James Dobson Speaking At SBC meeting

[Kiffin]

I am unable to attend the annual SBC meeting but I see that James Dobson is once again speaking at the annual SBC meeting. I find it interesting that the SBC once again has a Church of the Nazarene speaker. The Church of the Nazarene is classic Arminianism in doctrine and I find it disturbing that the SBC would have such a speaker.

I believe Jerry Falwell has already spoke at the pastors conferance. My problem with having both Dobson and Falwell speak at the SBC meeting is they are political spokesmen for the Religious right. It does give the impression of a religious marriage between the SBC and the politically charged Religious right. I am glad of the rightward turn of the SBC in recent years but I am very disturbed on the other hand of the SBC becoming a political entity for conservative politics in much the same way the National Council of Churches is a political entity for radical liberal politics.

[Chris Temple]

Kiffin:

I share your concern and I agree. But more disturbing than the endorsement of "Political Rightness" to me is the endorsement of bad theology, as you have mentioned. And how far have we slid from Baptist polity and theology to have a Nazarene member speak at the national Southern Baptist convention! Are there not enough qualified Baptist pastor-theologians in this country (or others) who can fill the speaking needs? :confused:

[Kiffin]

Chris,

I agree and I believe you hit the problem on the head. Is liberal theology being replaced by a generic Evangelical theology? Is not the SBC hypocritcal in condemning liberal theology, yet have Dobson a man whose theology disagrees with the BFM statement? He could not teach in one of our seminaries because of his theology yet can speak at the SBC meeting :confused: Do the current leaders in the SBC have a understanding of Baptist theology? :rolleyes:

[ June 12, 2001: Message edited by: Kiffin ]

[ June 12, 2001: Message edited by: Kiffin ]

[Pennsylvania Jim]

yes, it would be a real shame for a major Christian denomination to demonstrate to the world that God's word actually has the answers to real live problems. Better to sit and argue about the pH of water to be used in baptism.

[J.R. Graves]

Jim,

The problem is people think you can't do both. Could Southern Baptists have not found a Baptist that believed and taught the exact same thing as Dodson does on the Family? Yes! But instead they get Dodson and send a message (whether they wanted to or not) to everybody that Baptists and Dodson are on the same page and are in fellowship. We would not accept Dodson in our church, without him being properly baptized and we would not allow him to preach in our pulpit. I thank God for his ministry, but I think he would be more faithful to the Lord and to the Holy Scriptures if he would become a Baptist.

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Is it possible that God is not calling him to be a Baptist? Are Baptist the only true church? If God wanted him to stay right where he is, wouldn't he be disobedient by becoming a Baptist?

Joseph

[Kiffin]

I think the point is that the purpose of the Southern Baptist Convention annual meeting is to promote Southern Baptist work, doctrine and missions. Having a Arminian to speak who believes in losing one's salvation is not appropriate and sends the message that doctrine is not important. Southern Seminary fired Dr. Dale Moody 20 years ago for believing exactly what Dobson believes. Do you think Southern Seminary will rehire Moody? Absolutely not! but we have someone who holds Moody's doctrine of Apostasy speak at the annual meeting?! It has nothing to do with thinking something silly that the SBC is the only Church. It has every thing to do with a Convention that has a scorched earth policy towards liberals in the Convention(Which I am not againist) but an embracing of a classic Arminian outside of the SBC. Who knows..Next year we might have Paul and Jan Crouch :rolleyes:

[swaimj]

I'm not in the SBC, but the topic of speakers at conferences is interesting. The seminary I attend is fundamental, baptist, and premillenial. Their standard for speakers is: the speaker must be fundamental, baptist, and premillenial. However, the college from which I graduated was not as strict. They too were f,b,p; but speakers often held to only two or in some cases perhaps only one of the above. The faculty was f,b,p; but chapel and conference speakers were not always. However, the speakers were asked to speak to a topic in which they agreed with the school. Perhaps the SBC is inviting Dobson to speak on a topic in which he agrees with the SBC, or the leadership anyway. He may believe in losing salvation, but will avoid that topic at the conference so they have him anyway. So the SBC is less rigid in their criteria for speakers as long as they can assign him a topic in which his view reflects theirs. After all, I do not have to agree with someone 100% to benefit from them. Just a thought.

[Chris Temple]

Kiffin:

One problem is that the SBC invites an Arminian speaker because the SBC leadership is largely Arminian. Why is James Merritt SBC president instead of Al Mohler? Who is the better theologian? But who is the SBC leadership more in line with theologically?

Another problem is that many of our church members do not understand what it means to be Baptist and have 0 understanding of Baptist history. Most modern Baptists have no clue as to who James P Boyce, B.H. Carroll, Richard Furman, John L. Dagg or J.R. Graves were.

A third problem is that the Conservative resurgence was only a partial reformation. It succeeded in weeding out the liberal Arminians, but put in control the Conservative Arminians. The SBC is still in need of a theological Reformation, a return to biblical reformed theology, and a working understanding of Baptist history so as not to repeat its 20th century failures.

[Kiffin]

Dobson being Arminian is not the only reason though certaintly a major reason I am againist it. Dobson is someone who contemplated running for President last year and because of His deep involvement in politics it always makes me suspicious if this could not be used as a platform for his political views. I do not go to a SBC meeting to hear about FOCUS ON THE FAMILY though I agree much with Dr. Dobson. The SBC needs to steer clear of the so called Religious Right and not seem to be aligned with it.

Jerry Falwell who spoke at the Pastors conferance is highly involved in Republican Party politics. Possibly more than a pastor should be. His selling of the CLINTON CHRONICLES on The Old Time Gospel Hour years ago was unethical in my opinion and he seems more involved with Republican politics than preaching the Gospel.

[Kiffin]

Chris,

I agree. The SBC I believe is definitely moving theologically to the right but not necessarily to the theology found in the 1644 London, 1689 London or the Abstract of Principles. We do need more Al Mohler's and people who understand what the Founders of the SBC intended. The SBC seems at a cross roads. Will it go toward more the theology of John Wesley and Charles Finney or will it go towards the Historic Baptist faith of James Boice, B.H. Carroll and C.H. Spurgeon? We shall see.

[ June 13, 2001: Message edited by: Kiffin ]

[Chris Temple]

Kiffin:

You are exactly right. When I go to the SBC I want to see what the SBC is going to be doing about teaching our churches to glorify God and enjoy Him forever. What are we doing about making his name great among the peoples of the nations?

Instead we get statements (again) about families, divorce and covenant marriages. It's not a hard subject: Love and serve God, love and serve each other. It seems that the SBC is turning into the world's largest family counseling service. The problems in Baptist life are not rooted in the family, that is but a symptom. The problem is in not recognizing the Sovereign God of the universe as Lord over every area of our being. We do not need a Focus on the Family; we need a Focus on the majestic glory of Jesus Christ and then we will have a church who lives in covenant - with Christ first and then with each other.

[ June 13, 2001: Message edited by: Chris Temple ]

[Jette]

Something I found while surfing the web not long ago and offer without comment.

CNP (http://www.berkshire.net/~ifas/cnp/text.html)

[DocCas]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JBotwinick:
Is it possible that God is not calling him to be a Baptist? Are Baptist the only true church? If God wanted him to stay right where he is, wouldn't he be disobedient by becoming a Baptist?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Is it possible that God is calling him to be disobedient to scripture? NO!

Is it possible that God wants him to stay in a heretical "church.?" NO!

Is "Baptist" the only true church? If by "Baptist" you mean "founded on the bible as the sole authority on all matters of faith and practice, then the answer is YES!

The word "Baptist" is not a denominational name, but a doctrinal identity. We identify with what the bible teaches on any given subject. To do otherwise is not Baptist and not biblical. smile.gif

[ June 15, 2001: Message edited by: Thomas Cassidy ]

[MagicDar]

I'm very sad by the fact that having Dr. Dobson is such an issue. Dr.Dobson has alot of wisdom and insite for christians and no matter if he agrees or disagrees with a particular doctrine it should be more of a concern of if Dr. Dobson loves God and is serving him actively and that I believe he is doing 100%. Has our christianity come to the idea of separation of denomination so much to the point we reject others in Christ?

No matter if its the baptist or methodists or who the denomination is...are they bought with the blood of Jesus and is what they are teaching you at that moment biblically based?

Just a thought friends. ;)

[Bob Landis]

I feel like I am in the twilight zone here. James Dobson takes Freudian humanism and combines it with scripture and calls it Christianity. Right wing??????? I don't think so. Humanism is as far left as you can get. I hate to ruin peoples day but Jesus is not a liberal. There is no room for liberalism in the Bible. Everything in it is black and white. There are no grey areas. :(

[MagicDar]

I have upmost respect for Dr. Dobson, I may not agree with all he does or says but I think he is teaching godly values and is matching up with the bible. dar

[War_Eagle]

"James Dobson takes Fruedian humanism and combines it with Scripture and calls it Christianity."

LOL!

Obviously we're thinking of different jamed Dobsons.

Can you give a couple of examples?

[Pennsylvania Jim]

It seems to me that Dr. Dobson has come a long way. I support his ministry although I must admit that there are some things that I disagree with. If you go back maybe 15 years or so, you would find him pushing some pop-psychology things, particularly in the area of self-esteem teaching. It seems that he has dropped that for some time, although I have never heard him renounce it or say that he changed his mind.

As to right wing, I guess it's a matter of perspective. I'll be a little old fashioned and say that anyone who views Dobson as far to their right is a communist. :D

[Raulf7]

Dobson is a psychologist. And we dont need a psychologist. The greatest wisdom and psychology available to man is from Genesis to Revelation. God and his Word far surpass a man like Dobson who mixes human psychology with Bible doctrine.

I say bypass human wisdom and listen to God only through is word.

Most people that are messed up mentally have no trust in God and dont believe he is in control. Take it from someone whos been down that path ... me

[myreflection26]

I don't believe we need secular shrinks but I do believe we need christian shrinks. At least they give a godly view of how God deals with us thru scripture and also on a basis that we actually need to have. I give Dr. Dobson a thumbs up

Sue

[thepaintman80]

Your loving tone and outreach has been so wonderful I'll never be back here again. What a bunch of nominal Christians your are (not all of you) but enough that I have learned that some of you are extra biblical (unloving) and I continue to hear a resounding clang from many of you. Now I see why non Baptist cringe at the very word Baptist. Where is the Grace?

Grace to You! :confused:

[myreflection26]

Thepaintman, I sincerely hope I said nothing to offend you. If I did please accept my apologies. Sometimes Christians can get harsh with opinions and personal point of views and I'm sorry that you got the brunt of it.

Sue

[lightkeeper]

&lt;&lt;James Dobson takes Freudian humanism and combines it with scripture and calls it Christianity.&gt;&gt;

I am a Christian counseling psychologist who has read most, if not all, of Dr. Dobson's writings. His belief system and that of Freud could not be further apart.

Dr. Dobson is the foremost Christian expert on marriage and the family. Some studies are showing that Baptists have a higher divorce rate than any other denomination. Bringing Dr. Dobson aboard shows that our leadership is serious about solving a serious problem.