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Logos1560
04-05-2008, 09:04 AM
Did the KJV translators in the 1611 KJV remove the name "Jehovah" at any verses where it was used in the pre-1611 English Bibles of which the KJV was a revision?

In my opinion, this is a fair and valid question since some KJV-only authors and advocates will claim that some present English Bibles have removed the name "Jehovah" at the few places where it was used in the KJV. In effect, they will condemn present English Bibles for not having "Jehovah" at those same verses where the KJV has it. Since the truth is consistent and for this KJV-only claim to be considered valid, it would need to be applied consistently.
If present English Bibles should have kept the name "Jehovah" at those verses where the KJV had it, should the KJV also have kept the name "Jehovah" at any verses where the pre-1611 English Bibles may have had it?

Logos1560
04-05-2008, 07:19 PM
Perhaps the way that my question was worded implies that I know of some verses where the pre-1611 English Bibles have "Jehovah" and the KJV does not.

Tyndale's Old Testament and the 1537 Matthew's Bible used the name "Jehovah" at least seventeen times where the KJV does not (Genesis 15:2, Exodus 15:3, 23:17, 33:19, 34:23, Deuteronomy 3:24, 9:26, Joshua 7:7, Judges 6:2, 16:28, 2 Samuel 7:18, 7:19 [twice], 7:20, 7:28, 7:29, 1 Kings 8:53). There may be other places that I have not yet found. William Tyndale also used the name "Jehovah" at Ezekiel 36:23 in some verses or portions of Old Testament books he translated that were included at the end of his 1534 New Testament.

At Psalm 33:12, the 1540 edition of the Great Bible has "Jehovah" in its rendering "God is the Lord Jehovah."

The 1560 Geneva Bible has "Jehovah" at Exodus 15:3, 23:17, and 34:23 where the KJV does not.

The 1568 Bishops' Bible has "Jehovah" at Exodus 6:2, 6, 8, 33:19, and Ezekiel 3:12 where the KJV does not.

If present English Bibles should have kept the name "Jehovah" at those places where the KJV had it, according to that same reasoning should the KJV have kept it in all the places where one of the pre-1611 English Bibles already had it?

EdSutton
04-05-2008, 07:40 PM
If present English Bibles should have kept the name "Jehovah" at those places where the KJV had it, according to that same reasoning should the KJV have kept it in all the places where one of the pre-1611 English Bibles already had it? Yup! :thumbs:

Ed

webdog
04-05-2008, 07:51 PM
Yup! :thumbs:

Ed

All pre-1611 Bibles are wrong...

So are all post 1612 Bibles in ye moderne englishe ;)

EdSutton
04-06-2008, 01:50 AM
All pre-1611 Bibles are wrong...

So are all post 1612 Bibles in ye moderne englishe ;)Or covldeth bee it is the other wayye arovnd? :confused:

BTW-ye, Langvage Coppe saith that thou shoulddest capitalifeth ye wordde "Englishe"! :D

[Edited to add] It appeareth that ye Baptiste Boardde 'powers that be', haueth remoued ye "lavgh" smilie to ye 'second pagge' for smilies. Doest thou thinketh that mayhap too many pofters inferteth that smilie more often than some of them liketh?? :laugh:

G'nite-eth alle!

Edde

EdSutton
04-06-2008, 02:30 AM
The 1560 Geneva Bible has "Jehovah" at Exodus 15:3, 23:17, and 34:23 where the KJV does not.

The 1568 Bishops' Bible has "Jehovah" at Exodus 6:2, 6, 8, 33:19, and Ezekiel 3:12 where the KJV does not.

If present English Bibles should have kept the name "Jehovah" at those places where the KJV had it, according to that same reasoning should the KJV have kept it in all the places where one of the pre-1611 English Bibles already had it?If the use of the word "Jehovah" (or "Jah" - Ps. 68:4) for the personal, saving name of the LORD, which it exactly what that word is, is really the issue, why are some of these same alleged KJV 'defenders' folks not falling, literally, all over themselves defending the DARBY, RV, NWT, ASV, and YLT, all of which use the name "Jehovah" around 5800 times, or more than 700 times as often as the KJV?

And - especially, why do they not 'defend' the YLT??!?

In other words, some "present English Bibles" did and do not only keep the name "Jehovah" in all the places where the KJV, Geneva, Bishop's, Great, Matthew's and Tyndale's Bibles all used this rendering, but they are consistent and render the Hebrew the same way in virtually every instance, apparently, and not merely 8 times, as does the KJV. Are all of you Witnesses to what I am saying, here? ;)

("Boys and girls, can you spell "consistent"? - Fred Rogers)

FTR, the YLT is entirely based on the same manuscript evidence and text body as the KJV, was rendered basically from the KJV, hence, correlates with the KJV, and predates the W/H NT text by 20 years!

Ed

Logos1560
04-06-2008, 12:46 PM
In other words, some "present English Bibles" did and do not only keep the name "Jehovah" in all the places where the KJV, Geneva, Bishop's, Great, Matthew's and Tyndale's Bibles all used this rendering, but they are consistent and render the Hebrew the same way in virtually every instance, apparently, and not merely 8 times, as does the KJV. Are all of you witnesses to what I am saying, here? ;)

("Boys and girls, can you spell "consistent"? - Fred Rogers)

Ed

Yes, there are several other English translations that use Jehovah much more than the KJV. The 1773 Bate's Bible (Genesis to 2 Kings), the 1842 revision of the KJV by Baptists and others that was later called the Baptist Bible, the 1862 Young's Literal Translation, the 1885 Darby's Bible, 1901 American Standard Version, 1912 Improved Edition by American Baptist Publication Society, and the 1987 Literal Translation by Jay Green are some examples. Young’s Literal Translation, Darby’s translation, and the ASV have “Jehovah” over 5,700 times. Do these translations honor the name of God more than the KJV? At Isaiah 51:22, the Webster's Bible and MKJV have Jehovah where the KJV does not. The 1833 Webster's Bible also has Jehovah at Jeremiah 16:21, 23:6, 32:18, 33:16, Amos 5:8, and Micah 4:13. The MKJV also has Jehovah many times where the KJV does not (Exod. 15:3, 2 Sam. 7:20, 28, Ps. 8:1, 9, 140:7, 141:8, Song of Sol. 8:6, Isa. 10:16, 38:11, Ezek. 25:3, 32:31, 34:10, 17, 30, 36:23, Hab. 3:19, etc.). Does a consistent application of KJV-only reasoning suggest that Webster's Bible and the MKJV honor this name of God more than the KJV? Benjamin Blayney’s translations of the books of Jeremiah and Zechariah have “Jehovah” several times where the KJV does not.

The 1640 Bay Psalm Book translated by Richard Mather (1596-1669), John Eliot (1604-1690),Thomas Welde, and others has Jehovah more than 100 times (Ps. 3:8, 4:5, 5:1, 6:9, 7:17, 8:9, 13:1, 20:1, 21:1, 24:1, 27:11, 30:1, 37:39, 40:5, 46:7, 50:1, 71:1, etc.).