1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured Is Edward Snowden a Criminal or a Hero?

Discussion in 'News & Current Events' started by ktn4eg, Jun 24, 2013.

  1. ktn4eg

    ktn4eg New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2004
    Messages:
    3,517
    Likes Received:
    4
    Edward Snowden, the civilian who worked for the NSA & who revealed the extent of that agency's records on individual Americans, is on his way to a country that hopefully won't allow him to be extradited to the US.

    Leaders from both major political parties and the Obama administration want him arrested.

    Do you think he is a hero or a criminal for what he did?
     
  2. thisnumbersdisconnected

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2013
    Messages:
    8,448
    Likes Received:
    0
    A criminal who, were he a legitimate whistle-blower, would have chosen a better way to call attention to the misuse and abuse of FISA provisions, which nonetheless still need to be investigated to the fullest.
     
  3. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2004
    Messages:
    19,657
    Likes Received:
    128
    Not quite sure what he is. There's not enough information out there for me to make that kind of determination just yet.

    I know the criminals in DC are saying he's a criminal but when is the last time the criminals in DC actually told us the truth about anything? They lied to us about their snooping on us didn't they? Now they've gone into distraction and cover up mode . . . again. Ah nothing like a good international spy thriller to take your mind off the real crooks and their crimes.
     
    #3 poncho, Jun 25, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 25, 2013
  4. saturneptune

    saturneptune New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    13,977
    Likes Received:
    2
    It depends on whether he is on the board of the international bankers running the ghost government that unites all the evil corporations and industrial military complexes throughout the world.
     
  5. Tom Bryant

    Tom Bryant Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    4,521
    Likes Received:
    43
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Ron Paul said, "Espionage is giving secret or classified information to the enemy. Since Snowden shared information with the American public, his indictment could mean that the government views you and me as the enemy."
     
  6. Tom Bryant

    Tom Bryant Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    4,521
    Likes Received:
    43
    Faith:
    Baptist
    So Snowden should have gone to his superiors who were doing the snooping? Or maybe seek an appointment with the CIA and FBI who were the recipients of the information? Or gone to the Senate or Congress? Or gone to the lame street media? I am sre they all would have jumped on it. :BangHead:
     
  7. Aaron

    Aaron Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2000
    Messages:
    20,253
    Likes Received:
    1,381
    Faith:
    Baptist
    :thumbs::thumbs:
     
  8. thisnumbersdisconnected

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2013
    Messages:
    8,448
    Likes Received:
    0
    The latter two would have been preferable to defecting, which is obviously what he has done. Obviously there are senators and representatives who are concerned enough to demand answers, and Fox News or the Washington Times would have heard him out. Heavy is the evidence against his claimed innocence and self-proclaimed mantle of sincere concern for personal rights. When he left Hong Kong, he believed he was ultimately bound for Cuba, not exactly a destination that will instill confidence in the minds of the majority of the American public that he was a "concerned citizen." His phone call to Julian Assange didn't help that perception. He's a traitor, likely all along in the employ of China, Russia, Iran or someone who set up an operation to embarrass the United States.

    Certainly his claims that FISA is regularly abused deserve investigation, but FISA itself, as written, is an excellent anti-terrorism tool and needs to be left alone. What needs to halt is the "enemy of the state" attitude the Great Pretender has toward anyone who disagrees with him, motivating him to use illegal means under the guise of national security to spy on his critics. It is no accident NSA, IRS and other scandals have arisen all at the same time.. He sees far more enemies within our borders than he sees outside of them. Paranoia does not well serve a president, or in his case, an occupier of the White House. He couldn't keep all the balls in the air that long.
     
    #8 thisnumbersdisconnected, Jun 25, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 25, 2013
  9. Tom Bryant

    Tom Bryant Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    4,521
    Likes Received:
    43
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Maybe that's why Snowden did what he did. When the perpetrators of a crime hold the investigatory and judicial system in the palm of their hands, it drives people to do what would in normal time be a crime.

    I understand what you are saying, though. But when the FBI, CIA, NSA and IRS are all marching to the President's priorities, issues need to be addressed and sometimes they are dealt with in ways we are not comfortable with. I hate using the Nazi Germany or Soviet Union comparison because I don't think we have gone that far, but we celebrated those who blew the whistle on the Soviet's government domination of their own people. I think there just might be a time when we might celebrate this action also, but only if we are free enough to do so by the American people returning our gov't to a constitutional republic in future elections.
     
  10. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2010
    Messages:
    24,988
    Likes Received:
    2,268
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Of course Snowden is not giving any of this information to the Chinese or the Russians...
     
  11. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2010
    Messages:
    24,988
    Likes Received:
    2,268
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Yes, it's hard to say. He revealed information that we (sorta) knew anyway. Nothing has changed in our situation except that now we are certain the government is collecting information on us via our phone records. Still, according to law the divulging of this information is a crime, so I guess he's a criminal.
     
  12. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    22,016
    Likes Received:
    487
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Excellent.
     
  13. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2004
    Messages:
    19,657
    Likes Received:
    128
    The fourth amendment is law. The government breaks it everyday doesn't that make the government criminal?

    Snowden signed a non disclosure agreement. He violated it once now he's on the run.

    Obama swore an oath to protect and defend the constitution he violates it everyday. Then he goes off to play golf.

    So much for the law. What good is it if only the little people have to live by it?
     
    #13 poncho, Jun 26, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 26, 2013
  14. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2004
    Messages:
    19,657
    Likes Received:
    128
    That's another thing. None of this was secret. We all knew the government and corporations (Google, AT&T, Verizon, etc.) were all spying on us so what's the big deal all of a sudden?

    Looks like a full court press from the government and corporations (Time Warner, Fox, Disney, etc) to demonize one guy that really didn't tell us anything new.

    Snowden's real crime then is the same as the little dog Toto's, he drew back the curtain to let everyone have a look at the hypocrites behind it.

    That makes him a hero in my book.
     
    #14 poncho, Jun 26, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 26, 2013
  15. Sapper Woody

    Sapper Woody Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2011
    Messages:
    2,314
    Likes Received:
    175
    I am not defending either side of the argument here, but that statement is ludicrous. He didn't give the information to the "American public". He gave it to the world, allowing our enemies to have the information.

    Personally, the jury is still out for me. I am leaning towards criminal at this time, however. Because all intel leaks are bad in my book.
     
  16. webdog

    webdog Active Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2005
    Messages:
    24,696
    Likes Received:
    2
    He gave the info to the American press, and nothing given puts our nation in harms way. During the campaign trail last fall Obama said we should praise whistleblowers in our government. That all changed when he was re-elected. Hes a hero in my book, putting his life second to the constitution.
     
  17. thisnumbersdisconnected

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2013
    Messages:
    8,448
    Likes Received:
    0
    ... and the English media (the Guardian is British) and in so doing gave it to the world, including our enemies. Plus it is known he downloaded over 200 "Top Secret" and "Eyes Only" documents, and he didn't give any of those to the media. So what do you suppose he did with them? (HInt: He didn't burn them.)

    He gave the info to the American press, and nothing During the campaign trail last fall Obama said we should praise whistleblowers in our government. That all changed when he was re-elected. Hes a hero in my book, putting his life second to the constitution.[/QUOTE]He's a traitor, obviously having passed information to the enemy. He needs to be arrested, extradited, tried and convicted. It appears, with the Great Pretender's sudden disinterest in accomplishing that, he has information that the competent liar knows could bring down his administration and has no interest in him being brought to justice. But Snowden's still a traitor.
     
  18. webdog

    webdog Active Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2005
    Messages:
    24,696
    Likes Received:
    2
    You have information the rest of us doesn't know about stating he gave national security secrets to our enemies? How is telling Americans and the world, our government is using unconstitutional practices being a traitor? That's quite the leap. Giving weapons to our enemies is being a traitor.
     
  19. thisnumbersdisconnected

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2013
    Messages:
    8,448
    Likes Received:
    0
  20. webdog

    webdog Active Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2005
    Messages:
    24,696
    Likes Received:
    2
Loading...