Exposed: False Illustrations to ‘Prove’ Doctrine – Part 5

Who said God is a car salesman? Not I.

But the scriptures say eternal life is a "gift".

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

No one is compelled to accept a gift, people refuse or return gifts all the time. A young man may offer a young lady an engagement ring, but she can refuse it. The law itself accepts this;

http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/returning-engagement-ring-30198.html

Many a young lady has refused to accept the gift of an engagement ring from a young man.

Does that mean the young man did not pay for the ring? Of course not.

 

Protestant,

Well, you are right, but it will be counted as much ado about nothing by those who advocate self-autonomous free will. But that is not a reason not to teach the truth.

 

God himself says men have free will;

Lev 1:1 And the LORD called unto Moses, and spake unto him out of the tabernacle of the congregation, saying,
2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, If any man of you bring an offering unto the LORD, ye shall bring your offering of the cattle, even of the herd, and of the flock.
3 If his offering be a burnt sacrifice of the herd, let him offer a male without blemish: he shall offer it of his own voluntary will at the door of the tabernacle of the congregation before the LORD.
4 And he shall put his hand upon the head of the burnt offering; and it shall be accepted for him to make atonement for him.

God said that ANY MAN among the Jews could bring an offering to him, and that he was to offer it of HIS OWN VOLUNTARY WILL. What is more, God said this offering would be ACCEPTED to make ATONEMENT for him.

This means that any man has the ability to worship God of his own free will (this was an act of worship). And not only could every man freely worship God, but God himself said he would accept this offering to make atonement for them.

If God said men have free will, that's good enough for me. I don't care what men falsely teach. :thumbsup:

 

Give it up Winman you have just been called a thief and a robber. Evidently you are lost simply because you don't agree with the poster. In fact, he wasn't even talking to you. He was just posting for the choir to read.

 

Protestant,

I want to make sure I understand you. I certainly do disagree with Arminian theology, even viscerally so. But are you saying those who beliece in free will are "thieves and robbers" and therefore not saved?

 

jesus said that NONE come to Him unless the father draws them, John states that sinners prefer to walk in darkness, paul stated that we are at war against god in our sinner natures, and peter like sheep all have gone stray from the Lord...

Seems that the "only" free will that we have left is to reject God, doesn't it?

 

#1 Yes, Jesus said no man can come to him unless the Father draws him, and then he explains exactly how a man is drawn by the Father.

Jhn 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.

Did Jesus say men have to be supernaturally regenerated to come to him? NO, Jesus said they need to be taught. No man can believe in Jesus unless he has heard of him, and no man can hear of Jesus unless a preacher is sent to preach the word of God to him.

Rom 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

No other verse so directly addresses ABILITY as does Romans 10:14. Does Paul say a man needs to be regenerated to believe in Jesus? No, Paul only says a man needs to hear of Jesus to believe. Does Paul say a man must be regenerated to have the ability to hear the word of God? No, Paul only says a preacher must be sent to preach the word of God to them.

So what men lack is not ability to believe, but knowledge. No man can believe what he does not know.

#2 John did not say men prefer to walk in darkness, you do not know scripture. Jesus said some men love darkness because their deeds are evil. Other men do not love darkness and come to the light.

Jhn 3:19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

Jesus did not teach that all men love darkness, because in verse 21 he speaks of men that do truth and come to the light.

So again, you err because you do not know the scriptures.

#3 Paul said the carnal mind is enmity against God, but this does not mean that a man cannot turn from carnal thoughts and place faith in Christ.

Romans 8:9 says a man without the indwelling Spirit is "in the flesh", but Paul shows that men must believe to receive the Spirit, therefore the natural man is able to believe.

Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

A person is not in the flesh if the Spirit dwells in him, therefore the opposite would be true, the man without the indwelling Spirit is "in the flesh".

Nevertheless, Paul shows repeatedly that a man receives the Spirit by first believing on Jesus.

Gal. 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

If a man receives the Spirit by believing, as Paul shows here, then the natural man has the ability to turn from a carnal mind and place faith in Jesus. This is exactly what God himself says in Proverbs 1;

Pro 1:23 Turn you at my reproof: behold, I will pour out my spirit unto you, I will make known my words unto you.

God says if a man will turn or repent at his reproof, then afterward God would pour out his Spirit to that man. Peter said the same.

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Peter told the Jews to repent and believe on Jesus (for only believers are baptized), and they would afterward receive the Holy Spirit.

All of these many verses show that a natural man can turn from being carnally minded and place faith in Jesus, and if he does so God will give him the Holy Spirit. These scriptures utterly refute the false doctrine of Total Inability.

#4 And yes, Peter did say we have all gone astray like sheep, but are now RETURNED to the Shepherd and Bishop of our souls. This refutes Original Sin.

1 Pet 2:25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.

Calvinism (and many others) teach that men are born dead in sin, separated from God at birth, but Peter said we are now RETURNED to Jesus. You cannot return someplace you have never been. I cannot return to Utah, because I have never been to Utah. I can return to California, because I have been to California before. Therefore this verse proves men are not born separated from God as many falsely teach. Jesus also confirmed this;

Luk 15:24 For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry.

Luk 15:32 It was meet that we should make merry, and be glad: for this thy brother was dead, and is alive again; and was lost, and is found.

When the prodigal son repented and returned to his father, twice Jesus said the boy was alive AGAIN. If men are born dead in sin, then it could never be said that any man was alive again, but this is exactly what Jesus said twice.

All of these verses refute Original Sin and therefore also refute Total Inability.

Your problem is that you mindlessly listen to false teachers and do not study the scriptures for yourself to see what they really say. Not too bright.

 

Protestant,

I am glad you expanded on your original answer. Thank you.

My concern was that your original post could be misconstrued as suggesting that Christians who deny the doctrines of grace may be no Christians at all. I agree that there are Christians who are in error, either through ignorance or willfully, who are still Christians. Of course there are always going to be false sheep in the fold; those who deny their Lord and Master. They may fool even the wisest and most pious of Christians, but they cannot fool the Lord.

 

glad that you made this point, as there are some calvinists who mean well, but in their zeal to uphold what they see as "rightdoctrines", almost make it seem that only calvinists are saved, as they hold that arminians and others have a false gospel, wrong jesus!

Thankfully, truth is that we ALL are saved in exactly same manner, just that calvinists understand the method used in a more biblical way!