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3 Point Calvinists time to speak up!

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by BobRyan, Sep 27, 2007.

  1. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    There is a thread where the question is asked "What is a 3 point Calvinist".

    I am Arminian - so I am hoping that I am not the only one that will speak to that question.


    My understanding is that 3 pointers (more like 2.5's?) believe --

    Total Depravity
    Unconditional Grace (of some kind)
    Perseverance of the saints.

    What say you?

    Ever heard of one?

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
  2. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    Are there really three-point Calvinists out there? Isn't it a misnomer to give them the Calvinistic label?
     
  3. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    I don't have any problem with it - since it appears to be the most doctrinally correct form of Calvinism that I know of...

    But -- I am Arminian
     
  4. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    Ok, then the three-pointers would have to address this issue then, for I've just been disqualified.
     
  5. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    All 5 points stand and fall together. A three point calvinist is a calvinist who has a good outside shot.
     
  6. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    Oh, my good brother, Webdog! What can I say, the 3-pointer has a better outside shot than the 5-pointer? But something doesn't add up.
     
  7. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    My post was lame humor in reference to basketball (3 point shooter). There is no such thing as a 3 point calvint, as there is no such thing as a 0 point calvinist. If you are a calvinist, you hold to TULIP...5 points.
     
  8. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    Actually, the basketball reference was brewing in my mind, but didn't know if that was really what you were getting at. Next time, I try a Miller-time quick release!
     
  9. EdSutton

    EdSutton New Member

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    Personally, I sometimes refer to myself as a 0 point Calvinist. I am certainly not any Arminian, rejecting all the points there as they have been 'developed' by the Arminians, and I reject the wording of all five points of Calvinism, as worded, as well. But I believe in 'free grace', salvation by faith, the blood substitutionary atonement and resurrection of the God-man, the Lord Jesus Christ and 'eternal Security', for starters. And the other cardinal doctrines of the Christian faith, as well, in their entirety.

    So what would you call me?

    Hey, I got it! A No-Point Calvinist!

    Ed
     
  10. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    So Ed --

    Total depravity?

    Perseverance of the saints?

    Limited Atonement?

    Irresistable Grace?

    ...

    What about Unconditional Election? What is that really in a 3 point (or is it 2.5 point) model?

    And do you have anyone else on this board that also shares your views.


    I knew quite a number of 3 point Calvinist - baptists at one time but not sure how many are on this board.

    BTW - when you link OSAS with Calvinism -- I agree with you.

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
  11. ReformedBaptist

    ReformedBaptist Well-Known Member

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    You are 100% correct in this estimation. :thumbs: A 3 point, 4 point, or as a pastor I knew, a 4.5 pointer is inconsistent.
     
  12. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    Does that also make you a no point Mormon, a no point Jehovah Witness and a no point Hindu? :)
     
  13. drfuss

    drfuss New Member

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    drfuss: I have had problems with those three points being together. When not connected to irresistible grace, unconditional election must take on a new meaning. Unconditional election in this case must mean election of those who are presented the gospel and not the election of those to be saved.

    I believe Augustine/Luther/Lutherans believe in unconditional election, but not in irresistible grace nor perseverance of the saints. I got that from a Lutheran on another forum. If there are some Lutherans on here, they can shed some light on this or correct me if I am wrong.
    __________________
     
  14. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

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    Soooooo........what's yer point?


    :laugh:
     
  15. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    "No" Three pointers coming forward??
     
  16. drfuss

    drfuss New Member

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    drfuss: Still no three pointers?

    Bob, I suspect that whoever said they were a three point Calvinists did so by changing the definition of unconditional election from the Classic Calvinist definition. The Classic Calvinists definition assumes irresistible grace or it doesn't make sense.

    I have a friend who was a Classic Calvinist having graduated form Moody Bible Institute many years ago. Over the years, he changed his beliefs to believe only in the perseverence of the saints. Yet he claims to be a 5 point Calvinist. He has changed the definition of the first four points to agee with his present beliefs. However, he still calls himself a Calvinist. Why? I don't know, but I suspect that he has heard so much bad mouthing of the Arminians, in previous years, that he doesn't want to be called an Arminian.

    I suspect that whoever claimed to be a three point Calvinist, did so by changing the definition of unconditional election.

    I am waiting to hear the definition of unconditional election from someone who believes in total depravity, unconditional election, and perseverence of the saints, but not in irresistible grace.
     
  17. EdSutton

    EdSutton New Member

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    I don't have anyone else on this board, at all, in one sense.

    As to who shares my views, I have no idea, especially as to most, if not all, details.

    But I seldom seem to have very much of a problem finding several who do not share my views, on a lot of subjects. :tonofbricks: :laugh: :laugh:

    Ed
     
  18. EdSutton

    EdSutton New Member

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    [​IMG][​IMG]
     
    #18 EdSutton, Sep 30, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 30, 2007
  19. EdSutton

    EdSutton New Member

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    No! And that is definitely a "no-brainer"!
    >
    >
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    "Alright!! Pipe down up there in the 'peanut gallery'!" :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

    Ed
     
  20. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    So does that mean we are still in search of the illusive 3-pointer?

    Does it mean that you are one but you know of no others on this board that are 3 pointers?

    Or does it mean that Baptists that call themsevles 3-point Calvinists and those that call themselves Arminian but they also hold to OSAS - are in fact all holding to one and the same teaching?

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
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