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Featured The Parenthesis Church

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by OldRegular, Jul 24, 2012.

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  1. thomas15

    thomas15 Well-Known Member

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    And the local church you belong to sir, tell me are they in obedience to the laws of Jehovah? Are they observing all the things that Christ commanded?
     
    #161 thomas15, Jul 26, 2012
  2. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    I am not sure how I could be more firm than I was in the OP. I suspect that many of the Rapture Ready dispensationalists on this Forum had no idea what dispensationalism was all about. Fortunately there is a movement away from the early, classic dispensational view of the Church, called progressive dispensationalism.
     
    #162 OldRegular, Jul 26, 2012
  3. thomas15

    thomas15 Well-Known Member

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    Yes or No? Does your local Church Old Regular keep the laws of Jehovah and or all the commands of the Lord Jesus?
     
    #163 thomas15, Jul 26, 2012
  4. saturneptune

    saturneptune New Member

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    Gee Thomas, you seem to be in doubt about the matter.
     
    #164 saturneptune, Jul 27, 2012
  5. mandym

    mandym New Member

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    This is exactly right.
     
    #165 mandym, Jul 27, 2012
  6. convicted1

    convicted1 Guest

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    For what? To see them "duke it out'? :laugh:


    I am a covenant Arm, so here is where my studying has brought me to.




    Abraham is the father of many nations, and not just Israel. The promise of God was given to Abraham prior to him being circumcised, also. We who are saved, obtain the promise(s) given by God to Abraham.


    Israel of the OT was a shadow of the church to come in the NT. Now there has always been a "church", whether it was a "called out assembly" in the OT, or the Church, which Jesus established through His work upon the cross. The promise(s) given to Abraham way back then, stand good for the Church now.
     
    #166 convicted1, Jul 27, 2012
  7. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    You make some excellent points there Willis! :thumbs:
     
    #167 kyredneck, Jul 27, 2012
  8. convicted1

    convicted1 Guest

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    See, I am not the "full blown heretic" that some think I am. I just have a blown head gasket....:laugh:


    God's promises to OT Israel are for the NT Church, and NOT for Israel AND the Church. Israel and the Church are now "one man", and both have access to the Father through faith in His Son, Who is the Head of His body, the Church.
     
    #168 convicted1, Jul 27, 2012
  9. Michael Wrenn

    Michael Wrenn New Member

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    Since I am neither, I cannot help you with this. :)
     
    #169 Michael Wrenn, Jul 27, 2012
  10. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    Couldn't do it, eh?
     
    #170 kyredneck, Jul 27, 2012
  11. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Just as a final word which is directly related to the O/P:

    IMO, the word "parenthesis" is a very poor choice of words by which to designate the ongoing status of the Church.

    Most people connect it in their minds with the grammatical pair of parenthesis around a set of words closely relating it to the preceding idea.

    That concept makes it look like the church was some sort of an afterthought or sudden idea of God rather than an historical descriptive adjective in the progressive history (The Bible which is now complete) of salvation.

    Rather the church (at the first advent of Christ) was/is a temporal gentile fulfilment of the abrahamic promise to bless both Abraham's seed as well as the gentile nations (goyim).

    In this age believing Hebrews come in the same manner as gentiles.

    Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.​

    In no manner is/was the church an afterthought or a sudden and brilliant idea on God's part but an integral part of the plan of the redemption of mankind from before the foundation of the world.

    Personally I believe it should be officially discarded by dispensationalism (not sure who would do it) as a descriptive word concerning the status of the church (and for the most part it has been).

    But there are still a few old Scofield Bibles out there.
    Saw one in church about a month ago.

    HankD
     
    #171 HankD, Jul 27, 2012
  12. AresMan

    AresMan Active Member
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    :thumbs::applause::jesus:
     
    #172 AresMan, Jul 27, 2012
  13. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    Louis Sperry Chafer, founder and first president of the Dallas Theological Seminary, and author of a multi-volume set, Systemic Theology agree that the term parenthesis is inappropriate. He writes [Systematic Theology, Vol 4, p41]:
    In fact, the new, hitherto unrevealed purpose of God in the outcalling of a heavenly people from Jews and Gentiles is so divergent with respect to the divine purpose toward lsrael, which purpose preceded it and will yet follow it, that the term parenthetical, commonly employed to describe the new age-purpose, is inaccuurate. A parenthetical portion suitains some direct or indirect relation to that which goes beforeor that which follows; but the.present age-prirpose is not thus related and therefore rs more properly termed an intercalation.​

    Other leading dispensationalists who advocate for the parenthesis Church are:

    John F, Walvoord, successor to Chafer at DTS, states [Millennial Kingdom, p230]:.
    The evidence if interpreted literally leads inevitably to the parenthesis doctrine.​

    J. Dwight Pentecost states [Things to Come, p201]:
    The church is manifestly an interruption of God’s program for Israel.​

    Charles C. Ryrie, editor of the Ryrie Study Bible, states [Basis of Premillennial Faith, p136; ]:
    The Church age is not seen in God's program for Israel. It is an intercalation. [See also Dispensationalism, p134]​


    One sometimes wonders if these men understood that Jesus Christ died for the Church, not Israel!
     
    #173 OldRegular, Jul 27, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 27, 2012
  14. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    Actually in the last half of Chapter 19. He is here in the last half of Chapter 20 and in Chapters 21 & 22!

    But this is not a pre-trib or premillennial return. It is at the end of the age. Until that time Jesus Christ is reigning at the right hand of God the Father!
     
    #174 OldRegular, Jul 27, 2012
  15. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    Finally convicted1! Finally!:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:
     
    #175 OldRegular, Jul 27, 2012
  16. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    Twice in a row!:applause::thumbs::godisgood:
     
    #176 OldRegular, Jul 27, 2012
  17. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    Where does it indicate a literal 'physical' return to terra firma?
     
    #177 kyredneck, Jul 27, 2012
  18. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    Revelation 21:1-3
    1. And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
    2. And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
    3. And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them.

    "Terra firma" may be somewhat different but He is here. I believe that the last half of Revelation 19 is a picture of the actual return to earth. At the Great White Throne Judgment everything is changed!

    Revelation 20:11-15
    11. And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
    12. And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
    13. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
    14. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
    15. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

    That being said lets face it: The mind of man cannot comprehend what it will be like in the presence of God! And that is the truth.
     
    #178 OldRegular, Jul 27, 2012
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  19. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    I saw a new heaven and a new earth [of the new covenant]: for the first heaven and the first earth [of the first covenant] were passed away

    I just can't commit to literalize any of the book.
     
    #179 kyredneck, Jul 27, 2012
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  20. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    Literalize where literal is appropriate. That is what I do, at least I try.

    There is no doubt that much of Revelation is written in apocalyptic language. In fact it is probable that much of language in the Book of Revelation Chapters 4-22 should not be considered as literal language. That does not mean that apocalyptic language does not teach a literal truth.
     
    #180 OldRegular, Jul 27, 2012
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