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Repetition & Redundancy in the Scriptures

Discussion in 'Bible Versions & Translations' started by franklinmonroe, Mar 19, 2011.

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  1. Greektim

    Greektim Well-Known Member

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    Here's an interesting duplication amongst multiple authors (Greek is identical):

    2Co 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ
    Eph 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ
    1Pe 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ

    Some might argue that in each of these is a common early hymn. I've read the article somewhere (I think it was J. Coutts' article in NTS) but was less than convinced. However, there does seem to be a common early Christian blessing that would lead into a very hymnic or strophic sort of blessings to follow. Eph. 1:3-14 & 1 Peter 1:3-9 or 12 especially.
     
  2. Greektim

    Greektim Well-Known Member

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    Psalm 136 may fit into your idea of redundancy:

    136 Give thanks to the Lord, for He is good,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting.
    2 Give thanks to the God of gods,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting.
    3 Give thanks to the Lord of lords,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting.
    4 To Him who alone does great [a]wonders,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting;
    5 To Him who made the heavens with skill,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting;
    6 To Him who spread out the earth above the waters,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting;
    7 To Him who made the great lights,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting:
    8 The sun to rule [c]by day,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting,
    9 The moon and stars to rule [d]by night,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting.

    10 To Him who smote [e]the Egyptians in their firstborn,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting,
    11 And brought Israel out from their midst,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting,
    12 With a strong hand and an outstretched arm,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting.
    13 To Him who divided the [f]Red Sea [g]asunder,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting,
    14 And made Israel pass through the midst of it,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting;
    15 But He [h]overthrew Pharaoh and his army in the Red Sea,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting.
    16 To Him who led His people through the wilderness,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting;
    17 To Him who smote great kings,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting,
    18 And slew [j]mighty kings,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting:
    19 Sihon, king of the Amorites,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting,
    20 And Og, king of Bashan,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting,
    21 And gave their land as a heritage,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting,
    22 Even a heritage to Israel His servant,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting.

    23 Who remembered us in our low estate,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting,
    24 And has rescued us from our adversaries,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting;
    25 Who gives food to all flesh,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting.
    26 Give thanks to the God of heaven,
    For His lovingkindness is everlasting.
     
  3. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    Thanks for your contributions, Tim!
     
  4. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    Duplicate proverbs are Proverbs 20:16 & 27:13 (KJV) --
    16 Take his garment that is surety [for] a stranger: and take a pledge of him for a strange woman.
    13 Take his garment that is surety for a stranger, and take a pledge of him for a strange woman.
     
  5. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    Paul immediately repeats himself in Galations 1:8-9 (KJV) --
    8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
    9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any [man] preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.
     
    #45 franklinmonroe, Apr 18, 2014
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  6. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    Recurring phrase in the Torah (KJV) --
    Leviticus 23:40 And ye shall take you on the first day the boughs of goodly trees, branches of palm trees, and the boughs of thick trees, and willows of the brook; and ye shall rejoice before the LORD your God seven days.

    Deuteronomy 12:12 And ye shall rejoice before the LORD your God, ye, and your sons, and your daughters, and your menservants, and your maidservants, and the Levite that [is] within your gates; forasmuch as he hath no part nor inheritance with you.

    Deuteronomy 12:18 But thou must eat them before the LORD thy God in the place which the LORD thy God shall choose, thou, and thy son, and thy daughter, and thy manservant, and thy maidservant, and the Levite that [is] within thy gates: and thou shalt rejoice before the LORD thy God in all that thou puttest thine hands unto.

    Deuteronomy 16:11 And thou shalt rejoice before the LORD thy God, thou, and thy son, and thy daughter, and thy manservant, and thy maidservant, and the Levite that [is] within thy gates, and the stranger, and the fatherless, and the widow, that [are] among you, in the place which the LORD thy God hath chosen to place his name there.

    Deuteronomy 27:7 And thou shalt offer peace offerings, and shalt eat there, and rejoice before the LORD thy God.
     
    #46 franklinmonroe, Apr 18, 2014
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  7. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    Notice the repeated pattern found in Numbers 7 (KJV) --
    12 And he that offered his offering the first day was Nahshon the son of Amminadab, of the tribe of Judah:
    13 And his offering [was] one silver charger, the weight thereof [was] an hundred and thirty [shekels],
    one silver bowl of seventy shekels, after the shekel of the sanctuary; both of them [were] full of fine flour mingled with oil for a meat offering:
    14 One spoon of ten [shekels] of gold, full of incense:
    15 One young bullock, one ram, one lamb of the first year, for a burnt offering:
    16 One kid of the goats for a sin offering:
    17 And for a sacrifice of peace offerings, two oxen, five rams, five he goats, five lambs of the first year:
    this [was] the offering of Nahshon the son of Amminadab.

    18 On the second day Nethaneel the son of Zuar, prince of Issachar, did offer:
    19 He offered [for] his offering one silver charger, the weight whereof [was] an hundred and thirty [shekels],
    one silver bowl of seventy shekels, after the shekel of the sanctuary; both of them full of fine flour mingled with oil for a meat offering:
    20 One spoon of gold of ten [shekels], full of incense:
    21 One young bullock, one ram, one lamb of the first year, for a burnt offering:
    22 One kid of the goats for a sin offering:
    23 And for a sacrifice of peace offerings, two oxen, five rams, five he goats, five lambs of the first year:
    this [was] the offering of Nethaneel the son of Zuar.

    24 On the third day Eliab the son of Helon, prince of the children of Zebulun, [did offer]:
    25 His offering [was] one silver charger, the weight whereof [was] an hundred and thirty [shekels],
    one silver bowl of seventy shekels, after the shekel of the sanctuary; both of them full of fine flour mingled with oil for a meat offering:
    26 One golden spoon of ten [shekels], full of incense:
    27 One young bullock, one ram, one lamb of the first year, for a burnt offering:
    28 One kid of the goats for a sin offering:
    29 And for a sacrifice of peace offerings, two oxen, five rams, five he goats, five lambs of the first year:
    this [was] the offering of Eliab the son of Helon.

    30 On the fourth day Elizur the son of Shedeur, prince of the children of Reuben, [did offer]:
    31 His offering [was] one silver charger of the weight of an hundred and thirty [shekels],
    one silver bowl of seventy shekels, after the shekel of the sanctuary; both of them full of fine flour mingled with oil for a meat offering:
    32 One golden spoon of ten [shekels], full of incense:
    33 One young bullock, one ram, one lamb of the first year, for a burnt offering:
    34 One kid of the goats for a sin offering:
    35 And for a sacrifice of peace offerings, two oxen, five rams, five he goats, five lambs of the first year:
    this [was] the offering of Elizur the son of Shedeur.

    36 On the fifth day Shelumiel the son of Zurishaddai, prince of the children of Simeon, [did offer]:
    37 His offering [was] one silver charger, the weight whereof [was] an hundred and thirty [shekels],
    one silver bowl of seventy shekels, after the shekel of the sanctuary; both of them full of fine flour mingled with oil for a meat offering:
    38 One golden spoon of ten [shekels], full of incense:
    39 One young bullock, one ram, one lamb of the first year, for a burnt offering:
    40 One kid of the goats for a sin offering:
    41 And for a sacrifice of peace offerings, two oxen, five rams, five he goats, five lambs of the first year:
    this [was] the offering of Shelumiel the son of Zurishaddai.

    42 On the sixth day Eliasaph the son of Deuel, prince of the children of Gad, [offered]:
    43 His offering [was] one silver charger of the weight of an hundred and thirty [shekels],
    a silver bowl of seventy shekels, after the shekel of the sanctuary; both of them full of fine flour mingled with oil for a meat offering:
    44 One golden spoon of ten [shekels], full of incense:
    45 One young bullock, one ram, one lamb of the first year, for a burnt offering:
    46 One kid of the goats for a sin offering:
    47 And for a sacrifice of peace offerings, two oxen, five rams, five he goats, five lambs of the first year:
    this [was] the offering of Eliasaph the son of Deuel.

    48 On the seventh day Elishama the son of Ammihud, prince of the children of Ephraim, [offered]:
    49 His offering [was] one silver charger, the weight whereof [was] an hundred and thirty [shekels],
    one silver bowl of seventy shekels, after the shekel of the sanctuary; both of them full of fine flour mingled with oil for a meat offering:
    50 One golden spoon of ten [shekels], full of incense:
    51 One young bullock, one ram, one lamb of the first year, for a burnt offering:
    52 One kid of the goats for a sin offering:
    53 And for a sacrifice of peace offerings, two oxen, five rams, five he goats, five lambs of the first year:
    this [was] the offering of Elishama the son of Ammihud.

    54 On the eighth day [offered] Gamaliel the son of Pedahzur, prince of the children of Manasseh:
    55 His offering [was] one silver charger of the weight of an hundred and thirty [shekels],
    one silver bowl of seventy shekels, after the shekel of the sanctuary; both of them full of fine flour mingled with oil for a meat offering:
    56 One golden spoon of ten [shekels], full of incense:
    57 One young bullock, one ram, one lamb of the first year, for a burnt offering:
    58 One kid of the goats for a sin offering:
    59 And for a sacrifice of peace offerings, two oxen, five rams, five he goats, five lambs of the first year:
    this [was] the offering of Gamaliel the son of Pedahzur.

    60 On the ninth day Abidan the son of Gideoni, prince of the children of Benjamin, [offered]:
    61 His offering [was] one silver charger, the weight whereof [was] an hundred and thirty [shekels],
    one silver bowl of seventy shekels, after the shekel of the sanctuary; both of them full of fine flour mingled with oil for a meat offering:
    62 One golden spoon of ten [shekels], full of incense:
    63 One young bullock, one ram, one lamb of the first year, for a burnt offering:
    64 One kid of the goats for a sin offering:
    65 And for a sacrifice of peace offerings, two oxen, five rams, five he goats, five lambs of the first year:
    this [was] the offering of Abidan the son of Gideoni.

    66 On the tenth day Ahiezer the son of Ammishaddai, prince of the children of Dan, [offered]:
    67 His offering [was] one silver charger, the weight whereof [was] an hundred and thirty [shekels],
    one silver bowl of seventy shekels, after the shekel of the sanctuary; both of them full of fine flour mingled with oil for a meat offering:
    68 One golden spoon of ten [shekels], full of incense:
    69 One young bullock, one ram, one lamb of the first year, for a burnt offering:
    70 One kid of the goats for a sin offering:
    71 And for a sacrifice of peace offerings, two oxen, five rams, five he goats, five lambs of the first year:
    this [was] the offering of Ahiezer the son of Ammishaddai.

    72 On the eleventh day Pagiel the son of Ocran, prince of the children of Asher, [offered]:
    73 His offering [was] one silver charger, the weight whereof [was] an hundred and thirty [shekels],
    one silver bowl of seventy shekels, after the shekel of the sanctuary; both of them full of fine flour mingled with oil for a meat offering:
    74 One golden spoon of ten [shekels], full of incense:
    75 One young bullock, one ram, one lamb of the first year, for a burnt offering:
    76 One kid of the goats for a sin offering:
    77 And for a sacrifice of peace offerings, two oxen, five rams, five he goats, five lambs of the first year:
    this [was] the offering of Pagiel the son of Ocran.

    78 On the twelfth day Ahira the son of Enan, prince of the children of Naphtali, [offered]:
    79 His offering [was] one silver charger, the weight whereof [was] an hundred and thirty [shekels],
    one silver bowl of seventy shekels, after the shekel of the sanctuary; both of them full of fine flour mingled with oil for a meat offering:
    80 One golden spoon of ten [shekels], full of incense:
    81 One young bullock, one ram, one lamb of the first year, for a burnt offering:
    82 One kid of the goats for a sin offering:
    83 And for a sacrifice of peace offerings, two oxen, five rams, five he goats, five lambs of the first year:
    this [was] the offering of Ahira the son of Enan.
     
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  8. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    Isaiah 28:10 & 13 (KJV) --
    10 For precept [must be] upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, [and] there a little:

    13 But the word of the LORD was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, [and] there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken.
    [/QUOTE]
     
  9. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    Luke uses this same phrase, once about John the Baptist and once about young Jesus (KJV) --
    1:80 And the child grew, and waxed strong in spirit, and was in the deserts till the day of his shewing unto Israel.

    2:40 And the child grew, and waxed strong in spirit, filled with wisdom: and the grace of God was upon him.

    Luke uses these parallel phrases to describe Mary the mother of Jesus (KJV) --
    2:19 But Mary kept all these things, and pondered [them] in her heart.

    2:51 And he went down with them, and came to Nazareth, and was subject unto them: but his mother kept all these sayings in her heart.
     
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  10. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    Exact same phrase used by Jesus, John, Paul, and Peter --

    John 13:34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.

    John 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. ...

    John 15:17 These things I command you, that ye love one another.

    Romans 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.

    1 Thess 4:9 But as touching brotherly love ye need not that I write unto you: for ye yourselves are taught of God to love one another.

    1 Peter 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, [see that ye] love one another with a pure heart fervently:

    1 John 3:11 For this is the message that ye heard from the beginning, that we should love one another.

    1 John 3:23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.

    1 John 4:7 Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God. ...

    1 John 4:11 Beloved, if God so loved us, we ought also to love one another.

    1 John 4:12 No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us.

    2 John 1:5 And now I beseech thee, lady, not as though I wrote a new commandment unto thee, but that which we had from the beginning, that we love one another.
     
  11. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    And I will break the pride of your power: and I will make your heaven as iron, and your earth as brass; Lev 26:19

    And thy heaven that is over thy head shall be brass, and the earth that is under thee shall be iron. Dt 28:23

    Brass & iron, iron & brass, not exactly repetitive but definitely gets the point across to Israel concerning the curses for disobeying the covenant.
     
  12. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    I think there is so much repetition in the book of Proverbs that if one would delete the repeats it would be about 19 chapters long.

    Mind you, I am certainly not advocating taking a penknife to any book of the Bible!
     
  13. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    I'm still noticing repetition in Scripture. Most of Matthew 5:28-29 is very similar or exactly the same as Matthew 18:8-9. These two accounts seem to reflect that at two different times Jesus spoke this sentiment. Mark 9:45 & 47 seems to be the parallel of Matthew 18. (KJV below)

    5:29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast [it] from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not [that] thy whole body should be cast into hell.

    18:9 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast [it] from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire.

    ____________________________________

    5:30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast [it] from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not [that] thy whole body should be cast into hell.

    18:8 Wherefore if thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast [them] from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life halt or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into everlasting fire.​


    The KJV's setting off of every verse may make spotting some these similarities easier than some other translations' formatting. It does seem that I find them more often when I am reading in the KJV.
     
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  14. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    Matthew 13:42 & 50 are exactly the same (there is actually no "a furnace" versus "the furnace" difference in the Greek, KJV) --
    13:42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

    13:50 And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
    ___________________________________

    Matthew Chapter 13 exhibits a lot of repeated words. The exact phrase "the kingdom of heaven is like/ned unto" appears 7 times in this chapter (it can also be found to begin Jesus' parables in Matthew 18:23, 20:1 & 22:2) --

    13:24 Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field:

    13:31 Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is like to a grain of mustard seed, which a man took, and sowed in his field:

    13:33 Another parable spake he unto them; The kingdom of heaven is like unto leaven, which a woman took, and hid in three measures of meal, till the whole was leavened.

    13:44 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto treasure hid in a field; the which when a man hath found, he hideth, and for joy thereof goeth and selleth all that he hath, and buyeth that field.

    13:45 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a merchant man, seeking goodly pearls:

    13:47 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a net, that was cast into the sea, and gathered of every kind:

    13:52 Then said he unto them, Therefore every scribe [which is] instructed unto the kingdom of heaven is like unto a man [that is] an householder, which bringeth forth out of his treasure [things] new and old.

    The term "Kingdom of Heaven" is found in Matthew (and only in Matthew) about 40 times.
    ______________________

    More duplication from within this chapter in Matthew. This exact phrase is also used by Matthew in 11:15, and found in the OT at Ezekiel 12:2 & Deuteronomy 29:4. (KJV) --

    13:9 Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

    13:43 Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.
     
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  15. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    I find a fair amount of redundancy in the Book of Acts. Here are some examples (KJV) --

    15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and [from] fornication, and [from] things strangled, and [from] blood.

    15:29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.

    21:25 As touching the Gentiles which believe, we have written [and] concluded that they observe no such thing, save only that they keep themselves from [things] offered to idols, and from blood, and from strangled, and from fornication.
    ____________________________

    9:4 And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?

    22:7 And I fell unto the ground, and heard a voice saying unto me, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?

    26:14 And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? [it is] hard for thee to kick against the pricks.
    ____________________________

    10:13 And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat.
    10:14 But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean.
    10:15 And the voice [spake] unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, [that] call not thou common.

    11:7 And I heard a voice saying unto me, Arise, Peter; slay and eat.
    11:8 But I said, Not so, Lord: for nothing common or unclean hath at any time entered into my mouth.
    11:9 But the voice answered me again from heaven, What God hath cleansed, [that] call not thou common.

     
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  16. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    The Gospel of Matthew seems to exhibit a lot of repetition. Matthew 16:19 (to Peter, thus singular pronouns) is very similar or exactly the same as Matthew 18:18 (to a group of disciples, thus plural pronouns). It seems clear that Jesus made this pronouncement on two different occasions. Also, John 20:23 is somewhat similar to these verses (KJV) --

    19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

    18 Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
     
  17. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    Did you realize that the phrase "the apple of his/thine eye" is found multiple times in Scripture? (In five different books! KJV) --
    He found him in a desert land, and in the waste howling wilderness; he led him about, he instructed him, he kept him as the apple of his eye. (Deuteronomy 32:10)

    Keep me as the apple of the eye, hide me under the shadow of thy wings, (Psalm 17:8)

    Keep my commandments, and live; and my law as the apple of thine eye. (Proverbs 7:2)

    Their heart cried unto the Lord, O wall of the daughter of Zion, let tears run down like a river day and night: give thyself no rest; let not the apple of thine eye cease. (Lamentations 2:18)

    For thus saith the LORD of hosts; After the glory hath he sent me unto the nations which spoiled you: for he that toucheth you toucheth the apple of his eye.
    (Zechariah 2:8)​
    "The apple of his/her eye" is an idiom. Colloquially it is something, or more usually someone, most cherished above others by the beholder. However, originally the meaning identified the central aperture of the eye (pupil). I do not know at what period this shift of meaning occurred. Nevertheless, is this an example of a 'too literal' translation (even for that time)? The phrase does not seem to mean the same thing in the Psalm as it does in Zechariah. BTW, there several different Hebrew words behind the single English word "apple" in these verses.
     
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  18. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    There is a repetitious concluding formula found in the Chronicles. It names a king, follows the king's name with the phrase "first and last", which is then followed by the titles of various prophets' books (some of which are not included in the Bible). Here are just two examples from 1 Chronicles 29:29 & 2 Chronicles 9:29 (KJV) --

    Now the acts of David the king, first and last, behold, they [are] written in the book of Samuel the seer, and in the book of Nathan the prophet, and in the book of Gad the seer,

    Now the rest of the acts of Solomon, first and last, [are] they not written in the book of Nathan the prophet, and in the prophecy of Ahijah the Shilonite, and in the visions of Iddo the seer against Jeroboam the son of Nebat?

    This formula is duplicated 7 more times -- 2 Chronicles 12:15; 16:11; 20:34; 25:26; 26:22; 28:26; and 35:27.
     
  19. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    These three verses from Isaiah have redundant elements and are reminiscent of phrases found in Revelation (KJV) --
    41:4 Who hath wrought and done [it], calling the generations from the beginning? I the LORD, the first, and with the last; I [am] he.

    44:6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I [am] the first, and I [am] the last; and beside me [there is] no God.

    48:12 Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I [am] he; I [am] the first, I also [am] the last.
     
  20. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    From Matthew repeated but inverted phrases (KJV) --
    19:30 But many [that are] first shall be last; and the last [shall be] first.

    20:16 So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen.

    Seeing how "and the first last" in 20:16 is treated, are the inserted words "shall be" necessary to the translation of 19:30?
     
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