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  #1  
Old 03-02-2006, 02:01 PM
mr. messy mr. messy is offline
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? What does T.U.L.I.P. stand for? This seems to be a condensation of John Calvin's teaching in a certain format...?

I am not a 5 point Calvinist.

Are there 5 similar points for the Wesleyans* [to keep it simple for me on the name's group] ?

Correct if I am wrong but my faulty memory would attempt to give the T.U.L.I.P. list as follows:

T may stand for the total depravity of men ? ?

U may stand for ? ? I have forgotten. ?

L may stand for the limited atonement of Christ?

I may stand for the irresistible call ? of Christ ?

P may stand for the persuversance? [my spelling is not correct] of the saints ?

If you help me, I would appreciate it.

Could you give me a link to the Calvinist point of view?

Could you give me a link to the non-Calvinist point of view?

Thanks again,

mr. messy
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  #2  
Old 03-02-2006, 02:15 PM
Matt Black Matt Black is offline
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T is total depravity - kind of similar to original sin I guess

U is unlimited grace

L is limited atonement - Jesus only died for some people not for all, apparently

I is irresistible grace ie: God does everything and those who are saved are incapable of being lost

P is perseverance of the saints which flows from I ie: once saved always saved

Most Christians would take issue with the L, and many also with the I and P.
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  #3  
Old 03-02-2006, 02:26 PM
standingfirminChrist standingfirminChrist is offline
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Teenagers
Unearthed
Litigants
Infesting
probables
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  #4  
Old 03-02-2006, 02:42 PM
Helen Helen is offline
 
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This may help:
http://www.reformed.org/calvinism/ -- pro
http://www.faithalone.org/journal/1995ii/Congdon.htm -- con

By the way, TULIP stands for

Total Depravity

Unconditional Election

Limited Atonement

Irresistible Grace

Perseverance of the Saints
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  #5  
Old 03-02-2006, 03:11 PM
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Jim1999 Jim1999 is offline
 
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Mr. Messy, This site is an overview of both Calvinism and Arminian "tulip".

http://www.tulipedia.org/TULIP_Overv...Juxtapositions

Cheers,

Jim
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The most important part of any prayer is not what we say to God. It is what God says to us. We are most likely to pray and then rush off before God speaks.
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  #6  
Old 03-02-2006, 04:49 PM
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DeclareHim DeclareHim is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by standingfirminChrist:
Teenagers
Unearthed
Litigants
Infesting
probables
This is really unkind of you sir. I could say IFBC stands for
Icompetent
Fools
Believing
C***

As a Church that follows John Piper's theology we are clavinist and I don't like you mockery of this position. But I do not believe IFBC stands for the above I was just trying to make a point.

[***Edited by Moderator. The word you typed is not suitable for use in this forum or anywhere on the BB. Please be more careful in your choice of words.]

[ March 03, 2006, 02:51 AM: Message edited by: Bible-boy ]
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  #7  
Old 03-02-2006, 04:54 PM
Ray Berrian Ray Berrian is offline
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mr. messy,

You said, 'What does T.U.L.I.P. stand for?'

Quote:
Tulip is just happy being a flower. The flower does not like being purloined by John Calvin's Roman Catholic medieval theology first taught by St. Augustine--the greatest Catholic quasi-theologian of all times.
.
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  #8  
Old 03-02-2006, 05:02 PM
Deacon Deacon is offline
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Talking

Quote:
Originally posted by DeclareHim:
This is really unkind of you sir. I could say IFBC stands for
Icompetent
Fools
Believing
C***
Please forgive my brother StandingfirminChrist, he got carried away with an acronym game in another forum.

(and he beat me to posting along a similar line)

Rob

[ March 03, 2006, 02:52 AM: Message edited by: Bible-boy ]
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  #9  
Old 03-02-2006, 05:13 PM
standingfirminChrist standingfirminChrist is offline
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You could say that? Looks like you already did.

Any true Bible believer knows the TULIP doctrine is not scripturally based.
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  #10  
Old 03-02-2006, 05:27 PM
Timtoolman Timtoolman is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by standingfirminChrist:
You could say that? Looks like you already did.

Any true Bible believer knows the TULIP doctrine is not scripturally based.
Most of them anyways.
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