A bogus way to try and salvage OSAS

The word "till" in verse 34 proves that this is temporary.

Again a temporary fire and a temporary separation.

When Hell is emptied out at the GWT (after the MK) notice verse 15 says that only those not found in the Book of Life are cast into the LOF!

If the man is saved, his name was written in the book. He is out of Hell and not going to the LOF! This is the restoration of what happened in Matt 18, John 15, Gal 5, and Rom. 11.

This is the second wiping away of tears (The 1st one happened in Rev 7:17 before the MK.) This is after the MK. This is eternity, the New Heaven and Earth. Who in the world would have been crying for the past 1000 years?

Here is the unconditional promise. Not that we will rule in the Kingdom (Gal 5:19-21) There are conditions applied to that promise.

But that on the last day, we will be raised up.

Lacy

 

BobRyan,

Amen. Well saying.

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 -Amen!

 

It is painfully clear if all you see in the Bible is saved or lost. In your mind, cut off and cast into the fire can mean nothing but having lost eternal salvation. But disobedient Jonah came up out of eternal Hell.

And so will a bunch of folks in Rev 20:15

These guys musta been having a really bad day.

Lacy

 

Lacy,

You interpreting these scriptures into literally.

You intepreting of Jonah. It shows that Jonah came out of hell as he got out of whale's belly.

But, this passage doesn't mean that, it supports of millennial exclusion teaching.

First, I believe Jonah was in the belly(stomach) of whale or shark - literal and phsyical, as what it recorded.

Notice, Jonah 2:1-2 say: "Then Jonah PRAYED unto the LORD has God out of the fish's belly. And SAID, I(Jonah) cried by reason of mine afflication unto the LORD, and he heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, and thou heardst my voice."

It shows us, that the condition within inside of fish's belly taste or feel like as a hell, shows that, it is very misery and grouchy. It does not mean that Jonah is already in hell literally, fact that he was not yet die, he was still alive. He was suffering inside fish's belly for 3 days and 3 nights. While he was still alive, he did repented to God while in fish's belly. God did listened Jonah's prayer. Then, God caused the mouth of whale vomit Jonah out.

Lacy,

This passage have do nothing with millennial exclusion or purgatory either.

Jonah was in the belly of whale, it shows us the picture of hell what it looks like.

Afterward, Jonah did preached in Nineveh, and they repented, then after that, he was still bitter with God. What happened to him after? Was he still righteousness(saved) by the time he died(physical with soul)? Does the Bible telling us that, Jonah is now in the heaven? Silence.

Only one thing that I know, King Saul is now in hell, because he turned away from the Lord, and the Holy Spirit departed from him. Also, he commited suicide by strike his sword into his stomach by himself.

Also, you show us of Psa. 86:13, 88:1-7; 116:3; 139:8. You intepreting them into literally. King David was not yet in hell while he was still alive. David's points that, he told us, God is sovereign, He have power over everything. These have do nothing with millennial exclusion, purgatory, and even, also security salvation too.

You take 1 Samuel 2:6 as one verse to prove us, this verse show us of literally, that the Lord did bring a person out of hell to make alive.

Understand, you have to read context from 1 Samuel 2:6-9 talk about God's sovereign.

I understand verse 6 speaks of Lord's power to alive us alive again, which speaks of resurrection. Jesus Christ is the firstfruits of the resurrection, so, therefore, Christ make us alive again - risen from the graves. THis verse doesn't prove us that a person is already in hell literally, but, it speaks of DEATH in the grave.

Lamentations 3:55 speaks of death in the grave, also, it speaks of resurrection, and God's sovereign.

Your intereting of these scriptures have do nothing with unconditional salvation, security salvation, & millennial exclusion.

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 -Amen!

 

GE:

'Debunking OSAS'
God speaking: (They haven't heard the first time!)
"Holy Father, keep through thine own Name those who thou hast given me"?
"I, kept them in thy Name"?
"Keep them, that they may be one as we are ... I in them, and thou in Me"?
"The glory thou gavest Me I have given them"? "I am glorified in them"?
"This is eternal life, that they might know thee ... and Jesus Christ"?

Does God, 'debunk OSAS'?
Debunk God, then debunk OSAS!

 

DRfuss:

"There is no scripture that establishes OSAS, only encouragement scriptures that are interpreted to mean OSAS. For a scripture to establish OSAS, it would have to say a Christian can not (or will not) stop trusting Christ as Savior. There is no such scripture. For instance, a scripture many OSAS Christians like to use to support OSAS is John 10: 27,28. “My sheep listen to my voice, I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no man can snatch them out of my hand.”

GE:

Man, just take Jesus' word for what it is! Listen! while for a moment you stop telling God what He says! Or simply you are telling God He lies!

To me it seems you Drfuss are a perfect specimen of one blinded so as not to see.

 

GE:

The Apple-pie Sauce Club!

 

Jonah's body came out of the whale. But did the whale swim down to the bottoms of the mountains, the bars of the earth, to corruption(Jon 2:6)?

I didn't take the verses literally, persay. I have taken them prophetically. They don't just teach nothing. They are pictures, like puzzle pieces with aparrantly no spot to fit.

Lacy

 

DRfuss:

"There is no scripture that establishes OSAS, only encouragement scriptures that are interpreted to mean OSAS. For a scripture to establish OSAS, it would have to say a Christian can not (or will not) stop trusting Christ as Savior. There is no such scripture. For instance, a scripture many OSAS Christians like to use to support OSAS is John 10: 27,28. “My sheep listen to my voice, I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no man can snatch them out of my hand.”

And they follow me.” To be his sheep, a Christian must continue to follow Him. Christ does not force us to follow Him. If a Christian decides to stop trusting Christ, he takes Himself out of His hand. If OSAS was true, then the scripture should say “And they cannot stop following me.” The fact that it does not say “cannot stop following Him” implies to me that OSAS is not correct.


GE:

Man, just take Jesus' word for what it is! Listen! while for a moment you stop telling God what He says! Or simply you are telling God He lies!

To me it seems you Drfuss are a perfect specimen of one blinded so as not to see.

drfuss: Just wanted to complete my quote on that scripture that GE only posted a part of. As I said in the rest of my post, non-OSAS Christians can be just as sure of their continuing salvation as OSAS Christians are. So OSAS Christians don't risk anything by considering the other belief. I considered both.

 

GE:

Thank you Bob, I gained much through this post of yours. Have never seen this Scripture in this light.

(Ps, not a member of the Apple-Pie Sauce Society!)

 

Jn15:2, "Every branch not bearing fruit in Me (my Father) takes (away / removes). And every fruit bearing (branch), that one He prunes that it can bear more fruit."

Bird-grafted parasitic 'branches' -- like the devil's seeds sown between the good seeds of God's sowing -- the Father removes.
The tree is known by its fruit even if but one. (Like this season a gigantic tree next door.) Branches of the true vine cannot help but bear fruit; even by the help of God the Father only, can it bear more fruit - but never different fruit. The tree that didn't bear fruit for the one year, got another year to do so. God's longsuffering with those His Own is immeasurably greater.

 

BR:

""SEVERED from Christ" and "FALLEN from Grace" Gal 5:4"

That's Bob's edition.

Paul's edition: "You ARE, severed from Christ" and "you ARE fallen from Grace" Gal 5:4.

The difference tells the difference between the figment of free will and the fact of Free Grace.

 

"Matt 18 "Forgiveness revoked"

It's not there! Retribution and justice are! "O thou WICKED servant, ALL THAT DEBT, THAT, I forgave thee, because thou besoughtest me!"

"Forgiveness revoked"? Then God like a movie-reel would rewind His whole Plan of Redemption.

 

"I will not remember thy sins; I have blotted out as a cloud thy sins! Thou hast in love to my soul delivered it from the pit of corruption, for Thou hast cast all my sins behind thy back ... The living, the living, he shall praise Thee -- the LORD READY TO SAVE me!"

 

What do you do with the "until he should repay all"? And don't try to tell me it's hypothetical or something. That God didn't really mean it? Hyperbole?

REV 20:15