A Walk Through the New Testament

Discussion in '2005 Archive' started by TexasSky, Jun 20, 2005.

  1. TexasSky

    TexasSky
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    Matthew 5. The sermon taught by Christ himself.

    "Blessed are the merciful, for they shall be shown mercy." (Wonder what happens to the unmerciful.)

    "Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God." (Wow. What a blessing.)

    "In the same way, let your light shine before me, that they may see your good works, and give God glory." (Good works? What's that?)

    "Anyone who breaks the least of these commandments, and teaches others to to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be caled great in the kingdom of heaven. For I tell you that unless your righteousness suprasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven." (Let's see, the Pharisees were really into that judging stuff, they were really great about not showing forgiveness or love to anyone they could judge instead. But wait! Oh, didn't Christ say, "The second greatest of these if love?" )

    "If you are offering your gift at the alter, and then remember that your brother has something against you, leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to your brother; then come and offer your gift." (Gee, God doesn't even want your gift until you make peace!)

    "You have heard it said, 'eye for eye, and tooth for tooth,' But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If someone strieks you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also. And if someone wants to sue you and take your tunic, let him have your cloak as well." (Hmmmmm. Don't hit back. Give above and beyond what they demand.)

    "You have heard that it was said, Love your neighbor, and hate your enemies. But I tell you; Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you that you may be sons of your Father in heaven."

    Here is that answer to "Does he love the non-elect". "He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and teh unrighteous. If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? And if you greet only your brothers, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect. Apparenly God loves you, even if you DON'T love Him back.


    "For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins."

    (How more blunt does that need to be? If you don't forgive, God won't forgive you.)

    "Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you." (I've seen a lot of people try to twist that. I think Christ is pretty straight forward though. He doesn't say, "do not judge unless its really bad". He doesn't say, "Do not judge unless they are a fellow believer." He doesn't say, "do not judge unless they are pagans." He says, "DO NOT JUDGE." Why do you people try to twist Christ's words?

    "Watch out for false prophets. They will come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves." (Hmmm. Wonder if that has anything to do with people who want to teach hate in Christ's name?)

    "Not everyone who says to me, "Lord, Lord, will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, "Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles. Then I will tell them plainly, "I never knew you, away from me you evildoers." (Gee, wonder if that has anything to do with His telling us that love was the most important commandment of all?)

    My favorite passage of late:
    Matthew 9:10-12
    While Jesus was having dinner at Matthew's house, many tax collectors and sinners came and ate with him and his disciples. When the Pharisees saw this, they asked his disciples, "Why does your teacher eat with tax collectors and sinners?" On hearing this, Jesus said, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. But go and learn what this means: I desire mercy, not sacrifice. For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners." (God desires mercy. Stop and think about that. Christ wants mercy.)

    Matthew 10:7 "As you go, preach this message; The kingdom of heaven is near. Heal the sick, raise the dead, clense those who have leprosy, drive out demons. Freely you have received, freeling give. Do not take along any godl or silver or copper in your belts. Take no bag for the journey. ... (What did receive freely from Christ? Did we freely get condemnation and judgement? I thought we were freely given forgiveness, mercy, and love. Guess we're better than Christ huh? We don't have to mess with those last three anymore, we can just be hateful and judgmental and stop all that "heretitical love talk".... *rolls eyes*)

    Oh wait, geeze, PROBLEM with that - verse 24 says, "A student is not above his teacher, nor a servant above his master." Looks I am NOT above Christ after all, maybe I DO have to freely give love, forgiveness and mercy.

    Oh wow, here it is again, in Chapter 12: If you had known what these words men, "I desire mercy, not sacrifice, you would not have condemned the innocent. For the Son of Man is Lord of the Sabbath." That's TWICE now He mentioned wanting mercy.

    Matthew 15:8 "These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men." (WOW. You think there was a reason Christ quoted that when the Pharisees were complaining about people breaking tradition? Think it MIGHT apply today? Or was it just thrown into God's holy word as an after thought?)

    Matthew 18:21 "Then Peter came to Jesus and asked, "Lord, how many times shall I forgive my brother when he sins against me? Up to seven times. Jesus answered, "I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven times."

    This is followed by a parable of a man who was forgiven a debt, then refused to forgive a debtor, who was called back and told because he did not forgive he would not be forgiven. It endes with vs 35: This is how my heavenly Father will treat each of you unless you forgive your brother from your heart." (There it is again. As you judge you will be judged, as you forgive you'll be forgiven, show mercy and get mercy, show none, get none.)

    Matthew 19:17-19 "Why do you ask me about what is good?" Jesus replied. "There is only one who is good. If you want to enter life, obey the commandments. "Which ones" the man inquired. Jesus replied, "Do not murder, do not commit adultery, do not steal, do not give false testimony, honor your father and mother, and love your neighbor as yourself. There it is again. LOVE. Gee, that must get annoying to people who keep trying to explain it away out of scripture. Everytime they explain away one verse, Christ throws in another verse saying, "LOVE".

    Note - it doesn't say, "Love your brother," doesn't say, "Love your fellow Christian," doesn't say, "Love the righteious." Just says, "Neighbor."

    Matthew 22:34-39
    Hearing that jesus had silenced the Sadducees, the Pharisees got together. One of them, an expert in the law, tested him with this question: "Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?"
    Jesus replied: "Love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it; Love your neighbor as yourself. All the law and the prophets hang on these two commandments.


    Wow - ALL the law hangs on love. ALL of it.

    So, God has said "love is the most important commandment," and God has said, "Everything else hangs on love," why, why, oh why oh why do some of you claim to be Christian while trying to devaluate the importance of Love?

    Ever read Matthew 23? It can be a rather frightening chapter of God's word.

    "Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples. The teachers of the law and hte Pharisees sit in Moses' seat. So you must obey them, and do everything they tell you, but do not do what they do. Do not practice what they preach. They tie up heavy loads and put them on men's shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them. Everything they do is done for me to see; They make their phylacteries wide and the tassles on their garments long; they love the place of honor at banquets and the most important seats in the synagogues; they love to be greeted in the markeplaces and to have men call them Rabbi. But you are not to be called Rabbi, for you have only one Master and you are all brothers. And do not call anyone earth 'father,' for you have one Father, and he is heaven. Nor are you to be called 'teacher" for you have one teacher, the Christ. The greatest among you will be your servant. For whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and wholever humbles himself will be exalted. Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You shut the kingdom of God in men's faces. You do not enter, nor will you let those enter who are trying to. Woe to you teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hyprocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when he becomes one, you make him twice as much a son of hell as you are. Woe to you blind guides. [/b]

    Matthew 25:35 "Then the King will say to those on his right, 'Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared foryou since the creation of the world. For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat. I was thirsty, and you gave me something to drink. I was a stranger and you invited me in. I needed clothes and you clothed me. I was sick and you looked after me. I was in prison and you came to visit me. Then the righteous will answer him, "Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed, or thirst and give you something to drink? When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you? The King will reply, I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me. " (Wow, helping others, even the worst sinners, is a gift to God.)

    "Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat. I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink. I was a stranger and you did not invite me in. I needed clothes and you did not clothe me. I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me. They also will answer, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison and did not help you? He will reply, "I tell you the truth, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me." Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life. (THINK about that. When you teach that some are unworthy of Christian love and kindness you have become an angel of Satan.)

    That's the end of Matthew on Love.
     
  2. Rachel

    Rachel
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    Interesting [​IMG]
     
  3. jdcanady

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  4. AVL1984

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    Here again, a twisted bit of doctrine by TexasSky....how unoriginal. Texas...is God also a God of judgement and Holiness or not? You seem to overlook this particular thing. Nobody is saying God isn't love.
     
  5. Charles Meadows

    Charles Meadows
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    AVL1984,

    If God did not love us so much then he would not even have allowed us a way to be saved. Of course He's a holy God.

    Are you suggesting that we can earn the favor of this holy God?

    He loved us enough to send Christ? Our responsibility is to love Him and to love others. Didn't Jesus say that these two "commandments" were fairly important?
     
  6. AVL1984

    AVL1984
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    Charles, don't imply what I have not said or REMOTELY implied. :rolleyes: I don't go for that. Our responsibility is love Him and others, yes, but it is also to teach ALL THINGS.

    Please, point out where I have said anything about earning the favor of God. :rolleyes: I have made no such statement, and your implication of such is nothing short of lying and unbecoming of you. :(

    Nobody has denied that these two are important. Please, again, point out where I or anyone else has said such. :eek:
     
  7. Charles Meadows

    Charles Meadows
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    AVL1984,

    I didn't accuse you of anything. Let's not turn this into another "he said she said" thread.

    The point is, whether or not I agree with everything Sky says, taht showing love to others is of paramount importance as Christians.

    Yes God is holy - but if that were His only attribute He would not even have bothered sending Jesus for humans.

    Just to be unambiguous (so I won't be asked to cite in which thread a person said this or that)I'll say it this way:

    I think we should try to show the same love that Christ showed to everyone. We don't need to talk about hell every time we meet someone who is not a Christian. That doesn't mean we compromise on what we know to be correct. But we'll do more to win people to Christ by acting like Him than by simply quoting scripure. Unfortunately it is human nature to single out and to be hostile to those who are different. We should not let that creep into Christianity. If you agree with me then we agree. If not then we do not.
     
  8. AVL1984

    AVL1984
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    Nobody has said we should talk about Hell every time we meet someone who is not a Christian. In fact, I know many who witness without ever once mentioning the word Hell...not to negate it's reality or importance, but to take a less offensive route to witnessing. A good example are Kirk Cameron and Ray Comfort. They reach many by using a positive approach, which personally I like.

    Again, to act like Christ is not to be one sided in action or doctrine. Nobody has said to simply quote scripture. This is but one part of the mission, and you well know this. I do agree that hostility shouldn't be a factor in Christianity, but it has been from the beginning. Even Christ said he didn't come to give peace, but a sword. Sometimes, when doctrine is incorrectly taught, that sword must be used and division made. It is not a fun thing, or something that many of us take lightly. Milque toast Christianity isn't what Christ taught. Even Paul was very blunt and to the point with Peter, was he not? Error is error, and no amount of agreement in favor of or against it negates that fact.
     
  9. Charles Meadows

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    Error is error, and no amount of agreement in favor of or against it negates that fact.

    True enough.

    But we all have some error in our doctrine. We should not be divisive overly.

    I think a milk toast Christian is one who doesn't want to step on toes.

    There is a big difference between such a wishy washy compromising Christian and a Christian who wants to put Christ's love first. And I think we should put love first, not compromising on doctrine - but not being overly picky.

    It is my opinion (disagree if you wish) that evangelical Christianity has not done this as well as it should have - as evidenced by the fact that we are generally viewed by the lost as judgmental hypocrites. I hope this can change.
     
  10. AVL1984

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    We are pretty much viewed as "judgemental hypocrites" because of a sect of Christians that have infused their own ideology into Christianity and started teaching "do's and donts" that aren't taught by the Bible. They have put leaven of their own opinion in and aren't teaching the Bible, but their own ideology with the Bible twisted to fit it. It doesn't work. That is one of the main reasons that we believe the Lord led us out of the IFB movement. I've fought this legalism for the past three years tooth and nail, and will continue to do so.

    Not sure I agree with your definition of a milk toast Christian. But, that is for another post.
     
  11. TexasSky

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    Av,

    Do you understan? - If you love God with all your heart, all your soul, and all your mind, and you love your neighbors as yourself, you WILL obey the other parts of God's law.

    A human in love wants to please those they love. They sometimes screw up, but they apologize and try again.

    Well, a Christian who loves Christ wants to please God. They screw up, but they ask forgiveness and try again.

    Now, if I don't love someone on earth, I really don't care if I have pleased them or not. If I don't love Christ, I won't care if I pleased him or not, and no amount of "doing the right thing so people will think I'm good," will please him. What pleases him IS love. Love of him, love of each other.

    If I ~am~ loving, I help guide in love.

    That doesn't mean, "tell them whatever they do is okay." You can correct in love.

    I don't go to friends who are gay and say, "Oh, its okay, God loves everyone!" I go to them and say, "God loves you, and what you're doing is wrong, and it is going to kill you physically and spiritually. Let God show you how to over come this." If I went to them and said, "God hates that! You're going to hell!" The person would NOT listen beyond the word "hate".

    When I was young, there was someone I cared very deeply about who was NOT Christian.

    He came to me one day and said, "Teach me about your God."

    I said, "My God? There is only one God."

    He said, "Well, someone got it screwed up, and I figure if I'm going to believe in God, I want to believe in yours instead of the jerk I work with."

    I said, "Why don't we start over? Where did this come from?"

    He said, "I work with a man who carries his bible all the time. All he does is talk about how some person is sinning, or how someone is going to hell, or how someone needs to stop doing something. He's a pain in the neck and no one can stand him. He is not happy about anything. He thinks he is better than everyone."

    I said, "Go on."

    He said, "You and your friends are happy. You have this glow. You don't knock people. You help them. You don't do stupid things, but you aren't hateful to people who do. You just tell them why you don't. I figure, if there IS a God, I'd rather worship the one that makes you happy and loves people."

    A few weeks later he came to Christ.
     
  12. BillyMac

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    My word! What is this a witch hunt??? TS offended me some days ago, but you don't find me following her around the boards and crucifying her over it. I had my say that day and that is all. So, you had a disagreement. Big deal. Let it go, and get over it for heaven's sake.
     
  13. AVL1984

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    Correcting false doctrine isn't a witchhunt by any means, BM, and some of us will continue to point out such error.
     
  14. AVL1984

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    TS, love doesn't negate the rest of the commands in the Bible, though it seems you would like us to take that position.
     
  15. Charles Meadows

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    Please let's stop the cycle of "please prove your accusations".

    Larry and AVL - in what way to disagree with Sky? - let's get things in the open.
     
  16. AVL1984

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    Charles, we've been very open about where we disagree and it is in the open. Are you living in a cave??? [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  17. BillyMac

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    This has been weighing on me and I am sure you didn't mean it the way it sounded, but just in case:
    You can call me Billy - some do here - but I prefer Bill; or you can call me Mac as some do elsewhere but I am signed on here as BillyMac, so please don't refer to me in the future as BM. I am not BM, thank you very much.

    It appears to be a witch hunt when I go to thread after thread and see the same links to the same threads where you and she and another had words over who is right and who is wrong. That's the way it appears to this poster. Do you tink I am the only one who interprets it this way???

    You know, brothers, you could exercise a bit of love toward your sister and counsel her privately.
     
  18. TexasSky

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    AV,

    I'm not trying to negate any commandment of the bible. I'm not telling anyone that it is okay to steal, kill, lie, or commit adultery.

    I'm not telling you to tell someone else it is okay.

    I'm not telling you to look the other way.

    I ~am~ telling you, that if you DO correct, you should do it with LOVE as your purpose, with a desire to help someone get right with God again, NOT with a desire to point out their failure.

    I am telling you - if you DON'T DO THE DO's, God himself has told you that you have sinned, and that the sin you have commited is as bad as adultery, murder, and theft.

    And Christ has further told you that if you don't forgive, you won't be forgiven.

    I'm not sure I understand that in terms of "once saved always saved," but I do know that you can't "not love," and experience the full beauty of a Christian life.

    You can't "be Christ like," and NOT be forgiving.

    You just can't.

    How "loving" is a snide crack like the one you made to Charles? "Are you living in a cave???"

    If you're on strong biblical ground, give me your scriptures.

    You threw a lot of mine back at me, but you didn't refute them, and you didn't post any others of your own.

    And why do you, or Granny, or anyone else who objects to "mushy love" object? Wasn't it mushy love when Christ died for us?

    Wasn't it mushy love when Christ said, "Father forgive them for they know not what they do?"

    Wasn't it mushy love when God sent Christ to us??

    Wasn't it mushy love when Saul was spared death to become Paul?

    Wasn't it mushy love when Peter, who denied Christ 3 times, was restored in love and told that Christ would build his church upon that rock?

    Where did Christ NOT show mushy love?

    What's wrong with it?

    We are ALL sinners.
    God didn't say, "Okay, I love that killer more than I love that thief." He didn't say, "I love that liar more than I love that adulterer."
    God sent Christ to the world.

    He forgave us for causing Him torture at the cross. He forgave us for ignoring His will. He forgave us for our intentional and our unintentional sins.

    THAT'S mushy love folks.

    Praise God for being mushy.
     
  19. TexasSky

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    I understand that a LOT of people don't get that you can condemn sin and love a sinner.

    But you CAN.
    Christ does it every day of your life.

    My daughter knows a young man who happens to be gay. She told him that Christ loves him. He said, "You mean, Christ will love me if I go straight." Well, no, that's NOT what the bible says.

    Christ doesn't say, "Repent and I will love you."

    Christ says, "I love you, repent and I'll help you fight temptation."

    He was stunned, amazed. He told my daughter that no one had ever told him Christ could love him. He told her that for YEARS he was FURIOUS at God. Almost hated God because he did not WANT to be gay. He didn't wake up one morning and say, "Gee, I think I'll feel aroused by men instead of women." He realized that he was NOT like other men. He realized that he didn't lust after women, and he DID lust after men. And when he realized that he was scared, he was terrified. He didn't want his friends to look down on him, he didn't want to break his parent's heart, he didn't want to feel he had to through life "different". And when he most needed God, to show him HOW to deal with that temptation of the flesh - Christians were teaching him that God wanted him dead.

    So, here was a Christian telling him, 'Your lust for a man is a sin, and a man's lust for a woman is a sin. Lust is sin. Got that. Adultery, fornication, ... LUST is sin." So, if God doesn't want the adultery committing man dead, why would he want YOU dead?

    Christ wants you to love Him, and let Him love you, and let HIM do the rest.

    That was a couple of years ago.

    The friend is celebate now because it pleases a loving God for the friend to deal with the sin of lust in a Christ like manner of abstinance.

    Amazing thing love.
    Hate couldn't change this man's behavior.
    Hate couldn't bring him to God.
    But knowing that God loved him, despite a lustful sin, brought Him to God.

    Don't do the dos?

    That's all being a Christian who loves Christ WILL do.

    Doing the dos. Rebuke in love if you rebuke. If you can't rebuke in love, don't sin yourself by NOT loving.
     
  20. jdcanady

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    BillyMac:

    If you look at those threads, you will see that TexasSky started every single one of them, using those threads to accuse me and others of saying some very unChristian things. I choose not to fight it out with TexasSky, but to give observers the threads addresses so they could decide for themselves if I had said the things TexasSky has accused me of.

    I appreciate you wanting to mediate some sort of peace here, and I would never question your motivations. I believe you are sincere in your desire that we show respect and curtesy toward one-another, even when we disagree.

    IMO this was precipitated, at least in part, by my pointing out to TexasSky that she was gossipping about a pastor and his family on another thread. In that thread, I told her I felt she needed to be rebuked in public, because this particular sin was very much in public. It seems TexasSky has decided she will rebuke us for sins (real or imagined) on a long list of threads. To do so, she has misrepresented what I and others have said.
     

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