Abu Mazen

Discussion in 'Free-For-All Archives' started by Joseph_Botwinick, Jan 9, 2005.

  1. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick
    Expand Collapse
    <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2000
    Messages:
    17,527
    Likes Received:
    0
    Now that he has been elected in a fair and free election, he must be held accountable by the rest of the world in the way he leads. I would not allow him the legitimacy of meeting with President Bush or recieving any support unless he proves that he is willing to confront the terrorists among his people, make the atmosphere safe for free speech among all the Palestinian people, and spend some of his government's money on improving his people's living conditions (medical facility improvments, etc...). The level of Democratic and human rights reforms should determine the level of legitimacy and support that is given to Abbas. We must not repeat the mistakes of Oslo.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  2. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle
    Expand Collapse
    <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    22,028
    Likes Received:
    1
    But we will. So far, indicators suggest he will follow in the steps of Arafat. His own history has been involved in terrorist acts, even though he is considered by the Bush White House as a "moderate." :(
     
  3. KenH

    KenH
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2002
    Messages:
    32,485
    Likes Received:
    0
    I am mot that familiar with the Mr. Abbas except for recently. Could you provide some proof from an objective source that he has been involved in terrorist acts, LE?

    I am quite hopeful that the move to democracy by the Palestinians will eventually result in a two State solution. [​IMG]
     
  4. JGrubbs

    JGrubbs
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2004
    Messages:
    4,761
    Likes Received:
    0
    Abbas has consistently opposed the idea of using the Palestinian security forces to stop terrorism. Even though this is an absolute requirement of the misguided U.S. peace roadmap, Abbas said he has no intention of upholding the commitment.
    Many have heard the story of how Abbas, as a doctoral candidate at Moscow's Oriental College in 1982, wrote a thesis suggesting far fewer than 6 million Jews were killed in the Holocaust. But, Abbas did much more than that. He actually accused the Jews of conspiring with Adolph Hitler to annihilate European Jewry. He accused the Jews of deliberately inflating the numbers of those killed in concentration camps to pave the way for a Jewish state. He may have been one of the first to equate Zionism with Nazism.

    "The Zionist movement's stake in inflating the number of murdered in the war was aimed at ensuring great gains," he wrote, adding that "this led to confirm the number [6 million] to establish it in world opinion, and, by so doing, to arouse more pangs of conscience and sympathy for Zionism in general."

    In the version of his doctoral paper later published under the title, "The Other Side: The Secret Relationship Between Nazism and the Zionist Movement," Abbas denied the German use of gas chambers and suggested the total number of Jews killed was fewer than 1 million.

    Source: WorldNetDaily
     
  5. JGrubbs

    JGrubbs
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2004
    Messages:
    4,761
    Likes Received:
    0
    According to PA presidential candidate Abdelhaleem Ashqar who ran against Abbas:

    "In some respects, Abbas holds certain different perspectives from Arafat, but he was clearly elected as a continuation of Arafat. Abbas emphasized the same things as Arafat – a final settlement with no less than the entire West Bank, Gaza, East Jerusalem, the right of return for all refugees. And when it comes to the economy and actual reform and democratization of the Palestinian Authority, Abbas is as bad as Arafat. There will be no change. No transparency, or separation of powers. No democracy. Just more of the same."

    Soruce: WorldNetDaily
     
  6. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick
    Expand Collapse
    <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2000
    Messages:
    17,527
    Likes Received:
    0
    Bump.

    I want to keep this in everyone's mind, especially the OP of this thread. I hope that Bush will confront Abu Mazen and put pressure on him to bring about democratic and human rights reforms to his people before he is given any support or legitimacy. I am still hopeful that Bush will not repeat the failed policies of Oslo.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  7. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick
    Expand Collapse
    <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2000
    Messages:
    17,527
    Likes Received:
    0
    Today, Israel cut off all relations with the PA until they take action against the militants. The United States should do the same thing.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  8. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 23, 2002
    Messages:
    10,988
    Likes Received:
    79
    That, my friend, is why there should never be a Palestinian state. Those in the Bank should be encouraged to sell out. Gaza should be forced back to the control of Egypt. There should be no such thing as the right of return. Mrs. Arafat spends $100,000 a month the press reports. She should be forced to return all of the money her husband stole. She should have to live on French welfare checks.
     
  9. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick
    Expand Collapse
    <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2000
    Messages:
    17,527
    Likes Received:
    0
    I disagree that there should never be a Palestinian State. If we will confront and pressure tha PA to reject the terrorists, and bring about more democratic and human rights reforms in exchange for their own state, I believe we could have peace over there. But, if we repeat the mistakes of Oslo and give them everything they want without anything in return, then there will never be peace over there.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  10. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis
    Expand Collapse
    <img src =/curtis.gif>

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    20,248
    Likes Received:
    3
  11. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick
    Expand Collapse
    <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2000
    Messages:
    17,527
    Likes Received:
    0
    From the same article:

     
  12. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 23, 2002
    Messages:
    10,988
    Likes Received:
    79
    Egypt
    Iraq
    Jordan
    Lebanon
    Saudi Arabia
    Syria
    Yemen
    Libya
    Sudan
    Morocco
    Tunisia
    Kuwait
    Algeria
    United Arab Emirates
    Bahrain
    Qatar
    Oman
    Mauritania
    Somalia
    Djibouti
    Comoros

    These are the states of the Arab League, which stretches from the Persian Gulf across Africa to the Atlantic Ocean. Once I compiled a list of the number of people in the Arab League states and the total land mass of the Arab League. Having misplaced the list, I think that the population is about twice that of the USA and the area about three times that of the USA.

    To that powerful mix, we want to add another Arab state? No! Gaza cannot support a state and neither can a broke US and a Europe saddled with welfare states and high taxes. Life on Gaza is not self-supporting. The Bank towns are going to be surrounded by high walls and the Gaza will be walled off.

    It is time to find another home for the Arabs who squat in Israel. Those who own property should be compensated. Those who don't should be made refugees to another Arab state.

    Bush should do nothing (to help a Palestinian state)--it should be natural for him to do nothing.
     
  13. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis
    Expand Collapse
    <img src =/curtis.gif>

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    20,248
    Likes Received:
    3
    </font>[/QUOTE]Whaddya 'spect them to say ? I assume these people want to stay attatched to their heads.

    Well, it should all be on the up & up if Jimmy Carter's there overseein' everything.
     
  14. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle
    Expand Collapse
    <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    22,028
    Likes Received:
    1
    You are exactly right on, CMG! [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  15. KenH

    KenH
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2002
    Messages:
    32,485
    Likes Received:
    0
    Gaza and the West Bank and East Jerusalem should comprise the independent country of Palestine. That is what needs to be worked toward diplomatically.
     
  16. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle
    Expand Collapse
    <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    22,028
    Likes Received:
    1
    I disagree. The map says it all.

    Abu Mazen aka Mahmoud Abbas aka financer of terrorism is a loser. But he's the Bush pick..... :rolleyes:

    Today's news...

    USA Today
     
  17. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis
    Expand Collapse
    <img src =/curtis.gif>

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    20,248
    Likes Received:
    3
    Isn't that the same deal Clinton brokered ? That Arafat walked out on ?

    I'm not saying it's a bad idea. I wish it could happen. But I'm not betting on it.
     
  18. KenH

    KenH
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2002
    Messages:
    32,485
    Likes Received:
    0
    I knew you would disagree, LE, but my hope is to see peace in that region, not carry out Christian Zionism. [​IMG]
     
  19. KenH

    KenH
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2002
    Messages:
    32,485
    Likes Received:
    0
    And Arafat will go down in history as a fool for doing so.
     
  20. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick
    Expand Collapse
    <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2000
    Messages:
    17,527
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ken,

    You are correct, sir. The only addition I would add is that the only way to make this work is if there is reciprocity included as part of the deal (i.e.: Abu Mazen disarms the terrorists, Israel gives a little bit of land, Abu Mazen brings about human rights reforms, Israel gives a little of what they PA wants, Abu Mazen bring about democratic reforms, Israel gives them a little more of what they want). IOW, the Palestinians should be forced to bring about democratic and human rights reforms among their people before they are given that state. And, we definitely should not repeat the mistakes of Oslo.

    Joseph Botwinick
     

Share This Page

Loading...