1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Alexander Hamilton's Advice To The Obama Administration

Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by KenH, Dec 18, 2008.

  1. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2002
    Messages:
    41,987
    Likes Received:
    1,485
    Faith:
    Baptist
  2. EdSutton

    EdSutton New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Messages:
    8,755
    Likes Received:
    0
    Alexander Hamilton?

    You mean he's still around??

    I thought he was dead after getting a round Burr under his shirt, or was that saddle?, or something like that, anyhow!

    What about Ol' George, John, TeeJay and Sisters Betsy, Martha, and Dolly? How are they all doin'??

    All them guys and gals must be gettin' really, really old by now. :laugh:

    Ed
     
  3. rbell

    rbell Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    11,103
    Likes Received:
    0
    Yeah, talk was they would only be able to serve McCain's first term, had he been elected...

    :D

    Now, back to the column of the OP...

    the last line says,

    I always find that funny for a liberal to say.

    First of all, Hamilton did not speak for the entirety of the "founding fathers."

    Secondly...keep in mind, liberals love to say when it comes to issues such as, for instance, gun control, "the founding fathers had NO IDEA that our society would be as it is. We need to be progressive, for today is a new era." So, which is it: should we listen to them, or not?

    I guess it's OK to have a double standard, as long as your agenda is being forwarded...

    Keep in mind, also...the author of the article denigrates every president since Reagan for not following Hamilton's advice...yet you will find that we have had percentage wise the most periods of economic growth and prosperity from Reagan until now. I'll forgive Hamilton for his error, since he is, after all, currently room temperature.

    I think I'll pay attention to facts, thank you.
     
  4. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2002
    Messages:
    41,987
    Likes Received:
    1,485
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Yes, on the basis of a gigantic credit card - especially during the Reagan and both Bush administrations. Now we are paying the price for the destruction of our manufacturing base and dependency upon service jobs to make up the difference. It didn't work out for the long haul. Alexander Hamilton has been proven correct.

    By the way, rbell, since you mention the last line I assume that means you read the entire article before replying. I commend you for so doing. :thumbs:
     
  5. rbell

    rbell Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    11,103
    Likes Received:
    0
    And, of course, the alternative--having the Almighty Government socialize industry--has been proven even more incorrect (look under "Communism, failed")
     
  6. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2002
    Messages:
    41,987
    Likes Received:
    1,485
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Socialism does not equal communism.
     
  7. rbell

    rbell Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    11,103
    Likes Received:
    0
    You're right, it doesn't. But our country is built on a healthy fear of both...because both are enemies of liberty.

    And both are flawed systems, that have shown themselves to be rife with fundamental and inherent weaknesses that eventually cripple the societies which employ them.
     
  8. Pastor Larry

    Pastor Larry <b>Moderator</b>
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 4, 2001
    Messages:
    21,763
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hamilton didn't write that in a manufacturing economy and he didn't write it in a global economy. How much difference that makes may be debated, but we should at least be accurate: Hamilton didn't have any advice for Obama, nor for people who live in this time. His advice was for his own time.
     
  9. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2002
    Messages:
    41,987
    Likes Received:
    1,485
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Sounds like you are describing the current mess caused by unrestricted capitalism and "free" trade rather than socialism.
     
  10. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2002
    Messages:
    41,987
    Likes Received:
    1,485
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Do you hold that same view toward all of the writings and speeches by the Founding Fathers or only toward those with which you disagree?
     
  11. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,013
    Likes Received:
    3,649
    Faith:
    Baptist
    If we do away with the oppressive tax system in this country and people get to keep more of their own money employing and manufacturing in this country will go a lot easier.
     
  12. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2002
    Messages:
    41,987
    Likes Received:
    1,485
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Our tax system is not oppressive for the wealthy and the big corporations in the United States.
     
  13. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    22,016
    Likes Received:
    487
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I's been better since Reagan.
     
  14. Bible-boy

    Bible-boy Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2002
    Messages:
    4,254
    Likes Received:
    1
    And it certainly is not oppressive for the 40% of the people that pay no income taxes and yet they receive the earned income credit every year, and the recent tax "rebate" (when they had put no "bate" in the pot to begin with).
     
  15. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,013
    Likes Received:
    3,649
    Faith:
    Baptist

    One mans welfare is another mans oppression.
     
  16. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2002
    Messages:
    41,987
    Likes Received:
    1,485
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Good for them. That's better than it going to the wealthy and big corporations. :thumbs:
     
  17. Bible-boy

    Bible-boy Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2002
    Messages:
    4,254
    Likes Received:
    1
    Who said anything about earned income credit or the "tax rebate" going to thw wealthy or big business? You are jumping to an unfounded conclusion.

    So you favor government enforced stealing from my paycheck to give to the someone who paid no income tax to begin with?

    I think God said: "Thou shall not steal."

    How about if the government just let us keep what we earn and imposed a flat tax (say 10% or 15% whatever) on everyone earning above the poverty line with no exemptions, deductions, or credits? Now that would be fair to everyone.
     
    #17 Bible-boy, Dec 18, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 18, 2008
  18. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,013
    Likes Received:
    3,649
    Faith:
    Baptist
    They don't want fair. They simply want socialism.
     
  19. rbell

    rbell Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    11,103
    Likes Received:
    0
    So, Ken, let's say that I'm wealthy, thanks to my own hard work and sacrifice. Let's say, just for the sake of argument, that you're poor, because of not applying yourself, and so on.

    How much of my money do you have a right to come and take? I'd like a percentage, please. What should you be allowed to come and get, by force?
     
  20. Pastor Larry

    Pastor Larry <b>Moderator</b>
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 4, 2001
    Messages:
    21,763
    Likes Received:
    0
    All of them. No one can seriously make the argument that they were writing for any other time, that they anticipated a global economy and the modern manufacturing society, or the information age, or whatever else. They were writing for their own time. It is absurd to say otherwise.

    I don't know if I disagree with this or not. I don't know enough to have a position on it. Your assumption that I disagreed is unfounded. You jumped to a conclusion you should not have.

    As I said (if you read it), "how much difference that makes may be debated." Honestly, I am not sure how much difference it makes. I don't know enough to know. I am inclined to think that if you support it, it is probably in our best interests not to support it, but that's just going on past history. Overall, I don't know whether Hamilton's advice is good for today or not. I am inclined to think there are some problems with it, but again I don't know enough to pass judgment.
     
Loading...