All Who Claim Jesus as Savior Will Are Truly His?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by preacher4truth, Jun 16, 2011.

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Are All Who make the Claim Truly All His?

  1. Yes, every person who says this is genuinely born-again

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  2. No, not every one claiming this is born-again

    88.9%
  3. There will be some stand in judgment, who said He was their Savior, but weren't truly His

    66.7%
  4. It is possible to say Christ Alone is your faith and salvation, but yet, trust in works

    66.7%
  5. Some professing Him as their only Lord and Savior may not be truly His sheep

    77.8%
  6. Some will stand in judgment, who we thought were saved and claimed Christ as such, but were not

    66.7%
  7. It's ridiculous to believe all who claim Him alone as Savior are truly His

    66.7%
  8. People can lie and claim Christ Alone, but still are lost

    66.7%
  9. Christ rebuked others for laying claim to Him as Master, to whom He was not Master

    66.7%
  10. There is more to professing this by mouth. Jesus will sort them out.

    66.7%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. preacher4truth

    preacher4truth
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    Is it true, or not, that everyone that professes Christ as Savior is truly born again, and truly His?

    Your thoughts.

    Pardon the extra word "Will" in the question:

    All Who Claim Jesus are truly His?
     
    #1 preacher4truth, Jun 16, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 16, 2011
  2. JesusFan

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    No, as it all depends upon IF they are trusting in the jesus of the Bible ALONE to redeem them, and not in any of their good works/membership/baptism etc!

    many say believe in Jesus, but can be the Jesus of the Cults/social Gospel/ etc
    Also, some still "hedging" their bets and placing trust in Jesus AND having communion, baptised, witnessing etc as adding to grace of God!
     
  3. preacher4truth

    preacher4truth
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    Yes.

    My point is that there are some that claim to trust in Jesus as Savior, who will hear in that day that He never knew them.

    Some beg to differ and say that all that claim to know Him in fact do, every one of them, 100% of them, know Him.

    Claiming that a person does is not proof by any means.
     
  4. JesusFan

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    I tend to see it this way...

    IF you are really the elect of God, than you WILL have assurance of being saved by him... Through the witness of HS/external proof in Bible, changed life and mind etc

    IF you are not of real faith, can and will be deluded!
     
  5. Baptist Believer

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    Profession without intention and action is worthless.

    When we read the gospels carefully, we see Jesus called people to Himself in various ways. However, the essence of His message is for all to follow Him, to come to Him, and take His easy yoke of training (discipleship) upon ourselves and learn to appropriate His life within our own.

    He has made this possible through His life, death and resurrection, and He initiates and empowers this training/transformation through His active grace in our lives.

    As a result, we now have the option of no longer practicing iniquity, but practicing righteousness and being sons and daughters in His emerging Kingdom on earth (as it is in the heavens).

    Some will see what I have written here (and what Jesus clearly taught) and protest that salvation is by grace alone, and they are right. But grace is not opposed to effort, it is opposed to earning.

    Jesus, the Apostle Paul, James, and all of the other New Testament writers teach that we are called to effort, not passivity in Christ. We are called to be transformed, and Paul clearly teaches this in the overarching context of grace empowered living.

    Unfortunately, our modern presentations of the gospel often leave out any call to discipleship/training in exchange for what some think is an easier message of “accepting Jesus” as one’s “personal Savior”, a proposition that is not found in scripture.

    This has created churches full of people who may or may not be truly connected to God and have no sense of a faith that is relevant to the way they live their lives today. The faith that is often preached is essentially only good for when the church member dies (and then, possibly, not even that!).

    It’s no wonder that many Baptist churches avoid reading and preaching on the hard teachings of Jesus and instead focus on Paul’s writings. While Paul is not teaching anything that does not directly line up with what Jesus said (Paul was a disciple of Jesus after all), it is easier to take Paul out of the context of Jesus’ teaching (Paul assumes his readers already know the message of Jesus) and distort the gospel to fit our current popular practice than to boldly preach Christ’s invitation to a transformed and abundant life, under the well-fitting yoke of training and empowerment.

     
  6. preacher4truth

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    That's a lot of good stuff bro.

    Churches in general avoid the hard stuff. We are set up to be "successful" and have "leadership conferences" and things like this in place of servanthood and faithfulness to our calling.

    Thanks again.
     
  7. JesusFan

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    Guess in the debate between free Grace and Lordship salvation, you fall into the lordship camp. eh?
     
  8. preacher4truth

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    Not at all bro. I do believe in Lordship salvation to an extent, but not to the extent where it sounds like one working for it. But I do believe that there'll be a difference in ones life.

    Also, those who have labelled teaching as Lordship Salvation haven't been totally honest in their delineation of it.

    "Good stuff" doesn't imply that I 100% agree with every facet, but I can certainly get along with the one who said that.

    :godisgood:
     
  9. JesusFan

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    Gotcha!
    I believe that the salvation itself is at new birth, but we do definitly need to keep on maturing and growing up in Christ...

    Should be disciples of His, just "just" saved

    Think problem is the 2 extremes in this area...

    "Free grace" would say get saved by Grace of God, but no emphasis really on discipling

    "Lordship" emphasis on Discipling so much not really sure how/when one has made jesus Lord enough of to become saved!
     
  10. preacher4truth

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    Yes. Perseverance of Saints is in order here.

    I hear too many excuses for others. Such as, since one one time said they believed, then ran off to some cult somewhere and embraced it, and are proclaimed sympathetically that they are saved because the "said a prayer" or whatever.

    Yet, these same love to use "by their fruits" on someone else not in their immediate circle of influence.

    Being saved will show forth to others.
     
  11. JesusFan

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    Or as ole John Calvin said in regards to this:

    fath alone saves you, but the kind/type of faith that saves you will not be alone, will have good works with it! (my paraphase of him)
     
  12. preacher4truth

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    Yup. But don't let the ones who feel they can believe and live any way they want, hear you. They'll get all upset.

    God forbid we interrupt their heaven this side, before the reality of the other smites them. :tear:
     
  13. annsni

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    Since I know Mormons claim that they have salvation in Jesus Christ, I know that not everyone who claims Him as Savior are truly His.
     
  14. Old Union Brother

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    There are many that try to climb up another way, but they will be found out.
    See John 10:1.

    The bottom line is this: in this day and time of the repeat after me alter calls many so called churches have generated huge congregrations of people that couldn't tell an experience of grace if their life depened on it.......and it does.
     
  15. Baptist Believer

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    I think there's a fundamental misunderstanding here.

    I am not advocating "lordship salvation" in the sense that John MacArthur spelled it out in his book from the 1980s.

    In fact, the focus of what I'm talking about is not "getting saved" (which is essentially narrowing the gospel to "getting To Heaven"), but rather the Kingdom of God (or "Kingdom of the Heavens" in Matthew) which is what is actually taught in the New Testament. Sure, eternal life is given to us in Christ (God is very generous with this) when we accept His offer of the Kingdom, but that's only part of what happens.

    If a person wants a relationship with Christ just to get Heaven but wants no part in the benefits and responsibilities of the "Kingdom of Heaven", then they are like the one who puts his hand to the plow but is constantly looking back, or like the rocky soil, or any of the other illustrations Jesus used that frustrate preachers who want folks to just "just accept Jesus as their personal Savior."

    But if a person accepts Christ's offer and enters into Christ's life (willingly connecting all he knows himself to be with all he knows Christ to be), then God's grace will guide Him and help him persevere until the end. There will be natural transformation of life and character.
     
  16. JesusFan

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    Think that we are in agreement here, as i see it as being those who are "just" saved, have Eternal Life going on to heaven...

    others who in addition to that, are looking to find and do the Will of God for their lives here on earth, to put theur gifts/talents/resources to work for God!

    Think problem I have with "lordship salvation" as some have espoused it is that "unless you make jesus Lord of All, he is really Lord of none''' Have ANY of us really made him absolute Lord over ALl areas of our lives, and would we know when we made enough of it under Him in order to be really saved?
     
  17. Dr. Bob

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    People use religious "jargon" and false religious "experience" to act/look/appear to be sheep. Unless God does a work in a heart, they can say/do anything and it does not change them from being a goat (in sheep's clothing??)

    Goats will be separated out. That is God's work when He sends the death angel to cast them into eternal perdition.

    The only WRONG answer on the survey was the first. All the others are very true. I could give people's names to each of them.
     
  18. annsni

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    That's exactly how I voted. :)
     
  19. Baptist Believer

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    I don't think you can claim a group as being "just saved" as distinct from those who seek the will of God. Those who do not seek the will of God and have a transformed life are not "saved." 1 John makes that pretty clear. And Jesus taught that a person is known by their fruit. James teaches that faith without works is dead.

    The only way I would soften what I say is that since many Christian churches haven't been teaching the full message of the gospel, there are many true Christians in churches who don't know that there is anything more to being a Christian other than "fire insurance." But there's going to be a restlessness that will not be satisfied until they understand that God is calling them to abundant life, not just going to Heaven.
     
  20. JesusFan

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    Think that they are a large group of genuine believers who have allocked this world system/riches/worries/concerns etc to 'choke out" to a large degree their Christian walk with God...

    Lost their zeal/desire to serve God, just have been "beaten" down by life...

    Some of them dont know how to overcome, nor how to have strenght from God in midst of trials.

    Another group have decided to follow God when its "expedient" by not allowing Him to be involved in entire life... he can direct at Church, but not at my job etc...

    Atill other not really saved, but look/act/talk the part...

    So think there are Christians really putting God first in lives, trusting Him, want his will to get done, but also other groups in same Church Body with them!
     

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