An Arminian Took Over A Calvinist Pulpit

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Rippon, Aug 14, 2011.

  1. Rippon

    Rippon
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    There have been a number of posts about Calvinists secretly taking over pulpits of a decided non-Calvinistic flavor. I thought it was about time to speak of the tendency for a supposed Calvinist flying under false colors gaining a pulpit.

    There was an article written by Iain H.Murray in the March 2004 edition of the Banner of Truth magazine.

    Murray shares a letter that two deacons wrote to R.T. Kendall who had taken the helm of Westminster Chapel. It was written on June 25,1984. Here is a section of that letter :"When we called you to be our Pastor seven years ago (a Call which was supported by a very large majority of Members),it was naturally assumed that in accepting the Call,you were fully in sympathy with all that the Chapel had stood for. Had you then made your position and views on the matters which are the cause of the present difficulties there is no doubt that,whilst respecting them,we would not have extended the Call to you..."

    Murray writes that at a church meeting in September of the same year Dr.Kendall "asked those who were supporting him to raise their hands and expressed the wish that all who disagreed would leave Westminster Chapel. He was not prepared for any discussion of the cause of the disagreement,and when he had refused to talk with deacons on the subject,the deacons informed him of their intention to meet without him on 25 october. At that meeting,with eleven of the twelve deacons present,the majority could not agree with the dictate that those disagreeing with the minister should leave the church. Further meetings were inconclusive. Six dissenting deacons stated their position in a letter distributed to church members on 30 December 1984. They spoke of their difficulty in agreeing with aspects of Dr Kendall's ministry and the fact that dr Kendall had not replied specifically to their expressed concerns. They continued,"Some of Dr Kendall's views are novel. That of itself does not necessarily mean that they are wrong. But when we find them to be contrary to accepted reformed teaching and established Christian and Congregational doctrine we question them..' "

    In January of 1985 "Dr Kendall then immediately proceed to announce changes to the composition of various chapel institutions,removing the [6] dissenting deacons. After it was pointed out that deacons could not be forced to resign,another motion was moved to secure their dismissal from office. When it was carried,hand-clapping followed."

    Westminster Chapel's most famous Pastor -- Dr.D.M.L-Jones was a staunch Calvinist. His predecessor,G.Campbell Morgan was an ardent Arminian (though I don't think he admitted to being one). They worked together in the ministry before the death of G.C.M. They both respected the other. but much later M-L-J said that in a particular local church men with such different theologies should not share the same ministry (Or WTTE).

    Dr.Kendall (still living) is an Arminian. He wasn't being honest when he accepted the pulpit ministry of Westminster Chapel. Of course I am surprised that no committee was called to intervew him on his theological views.
     
  2. Don

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    Do you really dislike baptists who ascribe the arminian point of view?
     
  3. Bob Alkire

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    I would say he was wrong, not being honest about his soteriology. If he isn't honest, I believe he is being un Christ like. It has been shown that GCM wasn't a five pointer and he seemed to do well there, there wasn't any reason to hide what one believes, tell the truth and let them vote.
     
  4. Earth Wind and Fire

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    I know that GCM actively perused Lloyd-Jones but I dont know if this Kendall guy was the air apparent. Also Lloyd-Jones did not have a high opinion of Arminians.....often calling them muddled & pointing out areas where he felt they were NOT scriptural. I dont know if that means he would stand in the way of an Arminian running the chapel if he felt the man was qualified.

    But Don I would not consider Rippon a person who hates any professing Christian & I am surprised you would be blunt enough to ask a question like that to a fellow brother. Are you perhaps insecure in your own theology that you would even broach the subject?
     
  5. quantumfaith

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    :thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:
     
  6. Earth Wind and Fire

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    Rip..... I believe Banner of Truth does not always publish both sides of the argument (they refused to publish Martyn L-Jones book "Joy Unspeakable") so I would like you to explore what commentary Dr. Kendall has to say on the subject matter. Thanks
     
  7. Tom Bryant

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    If he was dishonest, then he was wrong. But if they had other "arminian" pastors, it might not have been a big deal about the person's soteriology.

    I guess the dates interest me. The letter was written in 1984, 7 years after they had called him as pastor. Then they wrote the letter. It sounds to me that they had other issues with the pastor, when he started to make changes in the church.

    The article was written in 2004 about a situation that occurred 20 years earlier.

    btw, I think that men who go to churches who are Calvinist ought to say what they are and vice versa.
     
  8. Earth Wind and Fire

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  9. Jerome

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    Rippon's own advice:

     
  10. sag38

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    This happened well over 25 years ago and the point is? It is old news and surely Rippon could come up with a more recent example of this kind of despicable behavior.
     
  11. Don

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    Read what sag wrote, bottom of 1st page, about this being an issue from 25 years ago; then tell me why Rippon would bring it up.

    *ANY* pastor, calvinist or arminian or otherwise, that isn't up front about their beliefs, isn't being honest with their congregation.

    What I see from the OP is a further attempt to *keep* division between arminians and calvinists, by bringing up an issue that's 25 years old.

    So what was the motivation in bringing it up?
     
  12. Jerome

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    From Reformation21 the Online Magazine of the Alliance of Confessing Evangelicals comes this telling description of Martyn Lloyd-Jones partisans:

     
    #12 Jerome, Aug 15, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 15, 2011
  13. JesusFan

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    Think that the point is that both 'sides" have been shown to be "shady" at times in how they opearte in NOT giving full disclosure to their viewpoints!
     
  14. Earth Wind and Fire

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    Knowing Rippon, he just was reading something & happened upon it & thought it would be a good "For Instance" point to show Arminians it aint jus Calvinists. My question to you is does it have to be timely to be relevant? Personally Id like to know more about the whole issue now.

    As far as division is conserned, Its already there & will always be there. No big deal.
     
  15. Don

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    See my post at the top of this page; specifically, the line that says something about "any pastor."
     
  16. Don

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    But what's your motivation for learning more about the whole issue? Knowing you, and the way you post, I'm optimistic and would say that you want to learn more in order to learn from the mistakes of the past.

    The difference here between you and Rippon, is that Rippon, more often than not, posts exactly as you've stated: points out and emphasizes the differences.

    I challenge that point of view. Division will always be there; the "big deal" comes when we let it cause such division as to be destructive, such as what we see in the conversations here between calvinists and arminians, to the point of name-calling, derogatory comments, and alleged Christians slandering each other and calling into question each other's salvation.

    We will always have division; no two people will agree 100% on every single point. But we can come to a point where we can agree to disagree, as long as it's not a point that calls into question actual salvational doctrines. And we can learn, or even teach ourselves, to keep the personal insults and childish innuendo out of these discussions, and try to learn from each other instead. Hey, I'll be the first to admit that I need to work on it, too.

    If you look back to my posting history, whenever I call someone on something like this, whether it be Rippon, or Luke, or whoever, it's because they've emphasized a division instead of working towards understanding, and thus presented themselves as a position of somehow having more authority, or "being better," than others.

    With that in mind, what lesson did Rippon intend for us to receive by posting his original message?
     
  17. MB

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    I agree with you.
    MB
     
  18. Rippon

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    That "question" comes from someone ignorant of my posting history. I have done threads on Arminians that I admire for instance. Before throwing out barbs please think and consider how wrong and inappropriate your "question"is.
     
  19. Rippon

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    Mr. Murray wrote the artticle in 2004,which was 18 years afterward. What would like to dismiss something as unworthy of discussion just because it is old? And just because it is old,the case inquestion is news to many here.

    I have shown many examples in Church History related to other topics --and I think that history needs to be studied instead of being derided.
     
  20. Don

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    I apparently have missed those threads. Would you please point me towards one?
     

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