Ancient Versions?

Discussion in 'Bible Versions/Translations' started by nate, Dec 14, 2005.

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  1. nate

    nate
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    I'm wondering do I have all of the ancient versions of the NT or am I missing some of them.
    The Old Latin
    Latin Vulgate
    Coptic
    Syriac
    Arabic
    Thanks...
     
  2. TCassidy

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    The Syriac is divided into:

    Old Syriac which is the Sinaitic and Curetonian.
    The Peshitta.
    The Philoxeniana.
    The Harklensis.
    The Palestinian.

    The Coptic is represented by:

    The Sahidic, Bohairic, Proto-Bohairic, Middle Egyptian, Middle Egyptian Fayyumic, Fayyumic, Achmimic, and Sub-Achmimic.

    You might want to add the Arminian, Georgian, Ethiopic, and Slavonic
     
  3. nate

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    Thanks for all the information. How many copies of these texts do we have? For instance you can read a lot about Origens Hexapla and 'can' get the idea that we actually have a extant copy of it. I know I see a lot of information on the ancient versions but do we have many actual texts?
     
  4. Boanerges

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    Dr Cassidy,

    Some people have stated that the Peshitta is an "original" NT text. I do not believe this to be true, and believe that it is a copy of the Byzantine Greek. What is your opinion?
     
  5. Phillip

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    I know that some of these are available for download in various places.

    It would certainly be nice if someone could index these various documents and provide links for download, purchase or actual paper-books that can be purchased.

    If there are free downloads, provide them first.

    If any of you could help us with locations to as many copies as possible it would certainly be nice.

    I will volunteer to help index individual posts of locations for download and/or purchase.

    If they are not available this way, but are included in a reference book, then list it.

    Any help would GREATLY be appreciated for us non-scholars like me trying to feel like we are doing something. :eek: [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  6. Deacon

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  7. Eric Pement

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    I'm not Dr. Cassidy, but I'll pop in here. This claim is made by George M. Lamsa, in the introduction to his own translation from the Peshitta (not from the Greek). I owned a copy of Lamsa's translation a few years ago and read his introductory comments, using his translation on rare occasions.

    I don't think that Lamsa's position is defensible, especially in light of the fact that we have papyrus fragments such as p52 which is dated at about A.D. 125, far older than the texts which Lamsa relied on. What's equally significant is that the early church fathers such as Irenaeus, Papias, Eusebius and Jerome assert that Matthew was originally written in the language of the Jews (presumably Hebrew) and the other NT books were originally written in Greek.

    It is remotely possible that the language of the Jews might be taken to be Aramaic instead of Hebrew, but if so, then the assertion of Mr. Lamsa would apply only to the book of Matthew, not to all four gospels or the whole of the New Testament. But personally, I think this possiblity is too "remote" for my own confidence, and I'm not persuded by Mr. Lamsa's arguments.
     
  8. Boanerges

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  9. TCassidy

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    I agree. In my opinion the Peshitta is an early 5th century translation of a predominately Byzantine text. Just as the Sinaitic and Curetonian Syriac versions are late 3rd and early 4th century translations.
     
  10. TCassidy

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    I agree. The only evidence for Matthew not being originally in Greek comes from an ambiguous statement made by Eusebius in his Ecclesiastical History where he states, "Matthew wrote the words in the Hebrew dialect, and each one interpreted as he could." It is generally understood that by "Hebrew dialect" he was referring to Aramaic. However, our Greek manuscripts of Matthew do not bear the marks of translation and the absence of any Aramaic or Hebrew original casts serious doubts on that interpretation of Eusebius's statement.
     
  11. Boanerges

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    I agree. The only evidence for Matthew not being originally in Greek comes from an ambiguous statement made by Eusebius in his Ecclesiastical History where he states, "Matthew wrote the words in the Hebrew dialect, and each one interpreted as he could." It is generally understood that by "Hebrew dialect" he was referring to Aramaic. However, our Greek manuscripts of Matthew do not bear the marks of translation and the absence of any Aramaic or Hebrew original casts serious doubts on that interpretation of Eusebius's statement. [/QUOTE]

    Agreed. If you review the origins of many of the NT words, you will find Hebrew, Aramaic, Latin, and even persian. It was written in Greek by people who spoke multiple languages. Some people have theorized that Paul may have spoken as many as seven languages.
     
  12. Boanerges

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    If I remember correctly, Eusebius also promoted the epistle of Barnabbas. Obviously, it didn't make the "cut".
     
  13. Phillip

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    Thank you for the link, Deacon. Wow, just visted it looks like it is quite complete. Lot's of resources. [​IMG]
     
  14. Deacon

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    THE TEXTS OF THE EARLIEST NEW TESTAMENT GREEK MANUSCRIPTS
    The complete text of the earliest New Testament manuscripts
    compiled by Philip Comfort & D. P. Barrett
    on CD ROM through Libronix
    (mostly Greek texts dated before 300AD)

    Note: Personally I wouldn't advise purchasing the volume unless you already have the Libronix system.
    Rob

    [ December 15, 2005, 06:40 PM: Message edited by: Deacon ]
     
  15. Deacon

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    BIBLICAL LANGUAGE SUPPLEMENT

    </font>
    • Analytical Greek New Testament [based on UBS 4th Ed.] (Friberg, Barbara and Timothy)</font>
    </font>
    • Ancient Egyptian Literature, Volume 1-3 (Lichtheim, Miriam)</font>
    </font>
    • Old Syrian Gospels : Codex Curetonianus (Kiraz, G. A.)</font>
    </font>
    • Old Syrian Gospels : Codex Sinaiticus (Kiraz, G. A.)</font>
    </font>
    • The Peshitta [Syriac] (Kiraz, G. A.)</font>
    </font>
    • Scrivener's Textus Receptus (1894) with Morphology (Robinson, Maurice A. ed.)</font>
    </font>
    • Tischendorf’s Greek NT </font>
    </font>
    • Stephen's Textus Receptus (1550) with Morphology (Robinson, Maurice A. ed.)</font>
    </font>
    • Byzantine Text Form, 2000 Revision with Morphology (Robinson, Maurice A.; Pierpont, William G.)</font>
    </font>
    • Westcott and Hort Greek NT (1881) with Morphology (Robinson, Maurice A. ed.)</font>
    </font>
    • Elzevir Textus Receptus (1624) with Morphology (Robinson, Maurice A. ed.)</font>

    This supplement is included in the Libronix Scholars library which is pricey at ~$600 now.

    Since the LIBRONIX system is getting even more expensive, the recently added feature of a payment plan was certainly a good idea.

    I got mine system on E-bay a few years back and have been slowly upgrading it as able, {wife willing :rolleyes: }

    Rob
     
  16. nate

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    Thanks for the great links! Deacon.
     
  17. Deacon

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