Featured Answer this question and you will understand OSAS

You have done a nice job of trying to make a clear text say something that it does not say, for IT does not mention children at all. Amy did, but that is not the verse at hand.

What of the FACT that we are not born of the will of man, but only of God? Derail that...

About the FACT that we are all "His offspring" that is true, because of creation, but that is not precisely what John was speaking about when he talked about those born again as believers.

Monkey wrench to the face, dude...

 

Paul is speaking about the NATURAL relationship of mankind with God in regard to direct creative source. The waters and earth brought forth all other living Creatures but man was directly brought forth by God.

Hence, in regard to NATURAL source we are all "children" of God as God is the direct source of the origin of mankind. However, in regard to being children by new birth - no lost person is a child (tecknia or huios) of God.

 

Hardly. Who was Paul speaking to? Pagans. What are offspring? Clearly you are the king of semantics on this board!

What is there to derail? This has nothing to do with the topic at hand. Please follow along.

Again...what are offspring? Can you have an offspring that is not your child? I realize only believers are given the rights of sonship.

:laugh: are you 12?

 

I guess you got so carried up by your own seeminly wise response to Amy above that you neglected to notice that she was citing John 1. She then made a brief statement about us being God's children, which you took and ran into a totally different conversation, per your normal tendency when you cannot stand the point being made.

The rest of your response? Typical.

 

My sheep hear my voice, and will follow me as the true shepherd!
they will not listen to other strange voices


Was jesus telling the truth or not?

 

Oh really? And maybe I shouldn't mention this because it is too personal and I can't elaborate. But I know of a case where this was definitely not true.

 

That's what I'm saying, and your analogy is terrible and doesn't work.

 

I actually like this one. To me it means that, yes, we are indeed kept by the power of God, but the way we are kept is through faith, and if we lose that faith or reject it once received, we are no longer kept. God compels no one to come to Him, and He compels no one to stay.

 

You're not following along real well. She stated "You will never find God speaking of the unsaved as His children." I then replied with this thought in mind, which was in the exact SAME direction (but of course to you it is a priority to disagree with me on anything just for the sake of disagreement). I got her point, in fact I embrace it. Only believers are afforded the rights of adoption as a son. I even admitted just that. Oh...and it is quite funny how you do not engage in anything stated, just resort to the ad hominem.

 

just curious as to where you find support for that in the Bible , as jesus did give "out" for a biblical divorce and remarriage!

 

Please explain your understanding of John 5:24.

John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

 

I believe what it says. But I also hold that a person can stop believing.

 

So? :wavey:

How does that mean that they are "un-born," "un-adopted," or "un-justified?"

Seeing as how WE do none of those things, it would seem that our reaction might be of no real consequence before God.

Of course, there is an out for you... That you are speaking of mere human religion, pointed toward the correct God, of course, but mere religious zeal only. No action of God involved -- and with that, also of course, no true salvation, so the person who walks away was never actually "arrived" in the first place.

I'm beginning to wonder if that is not the case... Anyone who has tasted and seen that God is good -- been indwelt by the Holy Spirit -- and who has an authentic born-again-from-above experience backed up by fruit of the Spirit in their life can hardly turn away from what they KNOW is true.

 

John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

John 5:24 "Most assuredly I tell you, he who hears my word, and believes him who sent me, has eternal life, and doesn't come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life. (WEB)

Note: The person who believed:
1. presently has eternal life.
2. will not come into condemnation in the future.
3. has already passed from spiritual death into spiritual life.

One cannot go backwards. One cannot go from life back to death.
One cannot come back into condemnation once that promise has already been made by the Lord Jesus Christ.
If one presently has eternal life, and eternal life should end at any point, then that "eternal" would become "temporary" and Jesus Christ would be found to be a liar.

 

And, as I said, the only alternative is that they never passed into life to begin with.