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Any Concerns about the Content of Fast Foods?

Discussion in 'Health and Wellness' started by Benjamin, Dec 12, 2009.

  1. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    Here's the list of ingredients off of the generic store brand bread from my local grocery chain (not necessarily in order):

    Flour, water, butter, shortening, salt, sugar, yeast.

    To test your theory, I have left a slice out, and will report back daily.

    So, let me get this straoight. If I'm obese, and I want a hamburger, then it's McDonald's fault that I'm obese, and not my own? Sounds like the ultimate entitlement mentality.
    Of course not. It's a convenient "out" to say "oh, well, you can't trust the labels".
    We already know your book is subjective.
    Okay, so now it's not the Arby's beef that is bad, but what they cure it with that is bad. At least you're being more honest now. Why don't you find out what they cure their beef with, and tell us what ingredient is bad, rather than make blanket statements.
    How convenient. :rolleyes:
     
    #21 Johnv, Dec 15, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 15, 2009
  2. Benjamin

    Benjamin Well-Known Member
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    Obesity rates came to rise with the fast food industry (which started in home state BTW...jab). Marketing ploys, such as the “Super Size Me” clearly show their loyalty is not to you the customer, but to the stock holders ($). If you can’t see that they share in the responsibility it is your mentality that is in question.

    You really believe the labels aren’t manipulated, are all inclusive, and completely trustworthy? [​IMG]

    Uhh, what the beef is cured and processed with would be IN the beef! Your logic about this and avoiding the issue of “physical evidence” by placing blind trust into the industries recognitions through labeling isn’t even worth addressing.
     
  3. David Michael Harris

    David Michael Harris Active Member

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    Bit of mold can be good for you I believe, it has antibiotic properties. Careful with the word preservative it's means something else here in France.

    I enjoy cooking. I have a glass of wine while at it too. Fast food is ok but not all the time surely.

    Man I love hot currys.
     
  4. donnA

    donnA Active Member

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    if I want a burger I make it at home, I use 93% lean ground beef, never hamburger, and vegatables or baked potato. I cut more then half the calories and most of the fat out. I never use ground beef thats less then 93% lean, same for ground turkey, which also makes a good burger.


    I spent 25 years morbidly obese, and guess whose fault it was,,,, mine.
    I ate burgers and fries and all the junk food, I made the wrong choices. Now I'm always strict to make good healthy food choices. I refuse to go back where I was. Not to mention my body is so much healthier, and life is so much easier.
    good food choices are wise and pay off.
    bad food choices have their own penalty.
    but people have to take responsibiblty for themselves.

    about the food labels, (I couldn't copy and paste for some reason),
    I've seen numberous times in tv about fda regulations and food labels, and no they are not correct, there are loop holes they use for most foods, like the definations used for lite and light, and even low fat can be legally twisted, even sugar free doesn't have to mean it really is sugar free, only that it has no white sugar added to it, but can have other forms or sugars.
    nope, I never trust a label, I read the ingreidents, which does have to be accurate. and I read a lot of labels making sure I eat healthy.
     
    #24 donnA, Dec 15, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 15, 2009
  5. Spinach

    Spinach New Member

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    The bolded portion made me snort. I'm assuming it means the same as in Romanian.

    I'll refrain from making preservative jokes.
     
  6. Spinach

    Spinach New Member

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    Preservatives (or 'conservants' for our European friends) are everywhere. It's nearly unavoidable. Your table sugar has sulfites. So does your tea, coffee, and spices.

    Imagine being allergic to sulfites!
     
  7. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    Interestingly, the rate of malnutrition dropped at that same time. Sorry, it wasn't the "rise of the fast food industry" that caused obesity, it was the fact that the American standard of living included easy access to food in general. The fast food industry arose as a result of this standard of living, not the other way around.
    You keep referencing "Super Size Me". You must have missed the fact that the person in it intentionally consumed 5,000 or more calories per day and did not exercise. The result will be the same if you eat 5,000 calories a day at a fast food restaurant, an expensive fine dining establishment, or a home cooked meal. The fact that you're oblivious to that shows that it is your mentality that is in question.

    There have been numerous experiments done in response to "Super Size Me", which refute the claims of the film. Documentary filmmaker Scott Caswell did the same thing. He ate at McDonald for the same aount of time. Only he chose healthier options such as the side salad and more normal portions. He also included normal physical activity and excercise. He lost 20 pounds and his cholesterol fell sharply. Documentarian Deshan Woods did something similar in "Super Size Me" fashion. He ate nothing but fast food amounting to 2500+ calories a day which included burgers and fries, but avoided the sugary drinks in favor of iced tea and similar beverages available at McDonalds. He reported an overall health improvement, including a loss of 14 pounds and a 44 point drop in cholesterol. Professor James Painter made a documentary including two graduate students, one a 254-pound male and the other a 108-pound female. They ate nothing but fast food for 30 days. Both students reported weight loss and an improvement in cholesterol.
    Of course you will assume that labels aren't trustworthy, because it's the only way you can support your presuppositions.
    Again, why don't you find out what the Arby's beef is cured with and processed in.
     
    #27 Johnv, Dec 16, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 16, 2009
  8. Jon-Marc

    Jon-Marc New Member

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    Not if you're allergic to mold as I am.
     
  9. Benjamin

    Benjamin Well-Known Member
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    The type of food and preparation of if, along with the convenience provided and the motive for that convenience undeniably points to shared responsibility and greatly attributes to the rise in problems of obesity and disease in this country.

    Uh, I hadn’t even seen the film yet when I prepared the last post, you are jumping to conclusions...



    First, the extremity in the experiment was openly acknowledged within the documentary, and I did not miss that fact. Second, there is no doubt that the big $ industry has many friends, including you, that will form arguments to the contrary. But, I look through all the rhetoric from both sides and focus on the big picture. The food in general is very unhealthy, and along with the types of food offered and the convenience of it is motive, that motive is where the shared responsibilities lie.

    Give me a break on these accusations and insults. Would ya? Huh?



    I see you totally my point on that one. Or just choose to throw out the same accusation for the sake of “your” type of argument.

    …and that one. You choose to disregard that I gave reason to believe there is a problem and whether or not I can support that claim on what the industry would reveal within their labeling does not go to show that the problem does not exist. You can take or leave what I have already addressed, but I am not into circular arguments.

    BTW, I had addressed much more of the reasoning and claims in your post but unfortunately did it on this site instead of a word doc and lost it when posting, don’t have time to redo. Anyway, if you want to further discuss “Super Size Me “ why not take it to that topic?.
     
    #29 Benjamin, Dec 16, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 16, 2009
  10. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    Rubbish! If you close down every fast food establishment tomorrow, the number of people who are morbidly obese will remain the same. No one forces people to overeat.

    Yet you're still referencing it.

    More rubbish! I am by no means a "friend" of the "big $ industry". I'm simply an advocate of objective truth. The "12 yo burger" claim isn't truthful. Neither is the claim that a resturant is responsible for how much its patron eats.


    The problem with your assertion is that you're blaming the fast food industry for morbid obesity. Morbid obesity is not caused by eating bad food, it's caused by eating too much food. Yet you're going overboard on trying to blame the poor quality of fast food on morbid obesity, and there's no connection.

    Pot, kettle. You're the one tossing assucations.
    I have no interest in discussing fiction.
     
  11. Benjamin

    Benjamin Well-Known Member
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    Objective truth doesn’t involve constantly changing the premises to form rhetorical arguments. I tried to begin explaining that to you once before but it was fruitless, so be it. What did you do, come up with some statistics on what the “morbidly” obese eat and hope to jump into an “I gotcha”? I’m talking about the recent extreme weight gain in our society in general. I’m talking about fast food playing a significant role in that trend and shared responsibility and you are merely in denial of those facts and supporting the mind frame that enables such to continue. By a “friend” I mean a supporter of the wrong cause, to which I certainly do question your methods of argument and motives for doing so.
     
  12. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    When adhering to the "objective truth" one doesn't make implications that all fast food is categorically bad (when in reality, some of it is bad and some of it is not), that the fast food industry as a whole cannot be trusted (sometimes it can, sometimes it cannot), that the ingredient labels must be assumed to be deceptive (there's no evidence supplied so far that ingredient labels are intentionally falsified), and than anyone who thinks differently is a "friend" of fast food. Most importantly, one doesn't blame the fast food industry for one's eating choices.
     
    #32 Johnv, Dec 17, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 17, 2009
  13. David Michael Harris

    David Michael Harris Active Member

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    I read somewhere that our bodies are so full of those things that preserve food that we take longer to decay after death than in times past :)
     
  14. David Michael Harris

    David Michael Harris Active Member

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    I met a man at our xmas work nosh up who has a phobia of cheese :) can you believe it, a French guy who will not be near cheese. Someone passed him some as a joke not realizing and he literally bashed it across the room.

    Off topic sorry, just thought I would share it.
     
  15. Benjamin

    Benjamin Well-Known Member
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    The fast food industry’s loyalty is not you the customer, but to its stock holders. The biggest percentage of everything they sell daily is unhealthy for people to eat. The ONLY reason they even began to change what is on their menu and how some things were being prepared were not because of concerns for people’s health but to avoid law suits.


    To put one's complete trust in labeling is foolish. The food industry’s deceptive labeling techniques to meet minimum standards and requirements and deceptive claims about health are no secret, the fact they will only reveal important details about the contents of food only after being forced to testifies to the nature of their character. We were not first told the details of fat, and how and why unhealthy transfats, because of their economical properties and effect cooking qualities were being used to make French fries; no, it was all about the $ and changed only after the liability for using it was going to cost them more $.

    You do not see a label on fruit which tells you what kind of pesticide has been used on it and how much remains, etc. You do not see labels revealing how much chemicals have been absorbed into potatoes; is calling it 100% potato accurate? Well, one might make that claim but it does not tell you want is in it! Same with what the FF industry have done with the processing on beef, to save them more $ processing has gone to into various smaller operations such as switching over to low paid immigrant workers and large machines that grind up 100’s of cows, coming from different places, together to make inexpensive as possible hamburgers. You do not know what all the cows have eaten or been supplemented with, what is used to maintain freshness, to clean the machines which gets into the food, added to the packaging etc. They will do whatever they can get away with; an example of this is “meat” tacos where the meat turned out to be foreign Austrian horse meat.

    To be in denial that food labels are not trustworthy and make a claim there is no evidence to be suspect that they are deceptive amounts to sticking your head in the sand and saying it isn’t there. Further, to use that type of rhetoric to attempt to support your argument and “label” it as “objective truth” has many similarities to the mindset used by the fast food industry labeling their products. Disregarding the fact that labels are not all inclusive while maintaining there is no evidence to assume a deceptive nature in labels is to ignore the truth value in the supporting premises.

    If the shoe fits.

    One would have to disregard all reasoning about not at least acknowledging attribution of shared responsibility to come to that fallacious conclusion. The most “important” aspect of your argument, or implied motive for making such argument, is pure fallacy as it relies on the “all or nothing”. It is like saying a parent who raises a child that weighs 150 lbs at 6 years old is not responsible as an enabler to that child for the habits he has developed, even when the child turns into an adult. After all the child wasn’t forced to eat the food and certainly as an adult now he has no one to attribute any blame to his condition.
     
    #35 Benjamin, Dec 17, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 17, 2009
  16. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    So what? Any corporation is going to be loyal to its stock holders. Seeing as how 10% of my retirement money is in restaurant industry funds, I'm thankful that they're loyal to me.

    That's a bit of a generalization. Determining something to be unhealthy depends on the frequency of consumption. If a person has one Big Mac a week, that Big Mac is not unhealthy. If OTOH, a person has 100 Big Macs a week, then you bet, it's unhealthy.

    Never said otherwise. I was noting that your consider labels to be categorically deceptive as a rule, which is not only foolish, but unrighteous.

    Tell us, since you already know, how much pesticide is in a Sinkist Navel Orange, and in what quantities.


    But that's a whole other topic. Your contention is that fast food is categorically bad, and now you're citing chemicals in vegetables as evidence. If that's then your argument is with all food, not just fast food.

    I'm beginning to think you've been reading to much of Kevin Trudeau's books.

    THis is where your'e dead wrong. THe FF industry isnt' involved in the manufacture of food products. They buy food products from third parties, such as Golden State Foods, Tyson, Purdue, Farmer John, etc.

    Actually, I do. I've had numerous family members, including my own children, go through 4H and FFA programs.

    Nice try, but it doesn't remotely. There's shoe that fit you, though, but being a Christian website, I can't use that thype of language.

    Yet, that's what you're doing. Interesting.

    Yep, the parent is responsible. The place that supplies the food which the parent feeds the child is not.
     
  17. Benjamin

    Benjamin Well-Known Member
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    I already told you what...the $ and what is valued more.

    No surprise there.

    You have an odd way of separating out responsibilty........... ;) Mr. Fast Foods' Friend.
     
    #37 Benjamin, Dec 17, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 18, 2009
  18. Spinach

    Spinach New Member

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    I agree with John here. The parents are ultimately responsible. Responsible to make sure kids eat right, go to bed on time, wear their seat belts, learn to cross the road safely, and many, many more things. The responsibility can sometimes be heavy, but it doesn't change the fact that my husband and I are responsible for our kids.
     
  19. Benjamin

    Benjamin Well-Known Member
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    John is saying his buddies have 0% responsibility, I can not agree to that.
     
  20. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    So, companies value the dollar. Again, so what? That's what they're supposed to be valuing.
    What grade are you in?
    Wow, talk about a pharisaical attitude.

    I'm saying the consumer is 100% responsible for what they eat. To claim anything less, one would be guilty of a liberal entitlement mentality, which you obviously subscribe to.
     
    #40 Johnv, Dec 18, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 18, 2009
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