Appointed to disobedience !

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by savedbymercy, Jan 17, 2012.

  1. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy
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    1 Pet 2:8

    8And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.

    The early church followed the apostles doctrine or teachings Acts 2:42

    42And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.

    one of which [ apostles] was Peter, who was steeped into predestination Acts 2:23

    23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:

    Acts 4:27-28

    For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together,

    28 For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done.

    And remember, they were only continuing what Jesus at first began to teach them in His public ministry with them per Acts 1:1

    1The former treatise have I made, O Theophilus, of all that Jesus began both to do and teach,

    Remember Jesus taught that his death was determined..Lk 22:22

    And truly the Son of man goeth, as it was determined: but woe unto that man by whom he is betrayed!

    Now Peter in His epistle the 1 st letter is confirming the truth that within the scope of Gods determining counsel, He had appointed some to be disobedient to the Word..

    1 Pet 2:8

    8And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.

    The word here for appointed is the greek word:

    tithēmi:

    to set, put, place as in appointment of something..as in appointment to punishment..i.e

    1 Thess 5:9

    9For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

    So in contrast, some God hath appointed to wrath and consequently disobedience..

    1 Thess 1:8

    In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospell of our Lord Jesus Christ:

    Remember they stumble at the word 1 Pet 2:8 ..now peter was specifically speaking of the jews of the time of their earthly ministry with Jesus christ..and He was the Word made flesh..

    since then, those appointed to disobedience are offended by the preached word.

    Matt 13:21

    21Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.

    But those such offended, had been appointed to this disobedience by God..wether jew or non jew, god for His purpose, has appointed some to disobedience, to be children of disobedience per

    Eph 2:2

    2Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

    You see that ? Children of disobedience, thats their lot in life, and will be their ruin everlastingly..of which they have been appointed..
     
  2. billwald

    billwald
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    Why is a person who thinks he is saved by God's mercy so quick to judge other people and other interpretations of historical documents?
     
  3. mandym

    mandym
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    Whereunto also they were appointed (eis ho kai etethēsan). First aorist passive indicative of tithēmi. See this idiom in 1Ti_2:7. “Their disobedience is not ordained, the penalty of their disobedience is” (Bigg). They rebelled against God and paid the penalty.~ Robertsons Word Pictures
     
  4. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy
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    They were appointed to disobedience and to rebel, it is pretty plain, and they are appointed to wrath for that disobedience.

    Eph 5:6

    Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.

    1 Thess 5:9

    For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

    The same word used here for appointed, the point is antithetical, denoting that even though the Chosen of God had not been appointed to wrath, the rest of mankind has been !
     
  5. mandym

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    At what point were they appointed? At the foundation of the world or because of their disobedience? Not plain in the way you assert.
     
  6. savedbymercy

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    God does His appointing before the world began ! These people are who Paul means in Rom 9 as Vessels of Wrath made by God Rom 9:21-23



    21Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?

    22What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:

    23And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,


    God gave them being in order that their whole life fits them for destruction ! The word fitted in vs 22 is the greek word katartizo and means:


    to render, i.e. to fit, sound, complete

    a) to mend (what has been broken or rent), to repair

    1) to complete

    b) to fit out, equip, put in order, arrange, adjust

    1) to fit or frame for one's self, prepare

    c) ethically: to strengthen, perfect, complete, make one what he ought to be

    Also it is in the passive voice, meaning that they are being fitted by God for destruction. Now I already know that some will argue that it is in the middle voice, and that they fit themselves for destruction, well both are True, they do fit themselves for destruction because God appointed them to !

    Also these people are simply those God did not write their Names in the lambs Book of Life before the foundation ! Rev 17:8

    8The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

    That word perdition is the same word destruction in Rom 9:22, so they were made by God vessels of Wrath fitted for perdition !
     
  7. mandym

    mandym
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    Show me in scripture where the lost are appointed to be lost before the foundation of the world

    Fitted at what point in time?
     
  8. savedbymercy

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    Post 6, now That is where I get my conviction from, i cannot help it if you do not share it !
     
  9. mandym

    mandym
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    Which does not establish the appointment of the lost before the foundation of the world but from the foundation of the world meaning ever since or along the way.

    So you do not want to discuss it, you just want to post it and be left alone? You do not want to entertain questions about your assertions?
     
  10. savedbymercy

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    1 Pet 2:8

    8And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.

    They were appointed is in the aorist tense, passive voice, meaning they did not appoint themselves to disobey but someone else appointed them to disobedience..

    That being God..for the devil cannot appoint nobody nowhere.
     
  11. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy
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    Being reserved for Judgment



    The children of disobedience, those appointed thereunto, while on earth, God is reserving them for Judgment..There is no hope of salvation for them..

    2 Pet 2:9

    The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished:

    Both the Living and dead ungodly non elect, are both being reserved by the power of God unto the Day of Judgment to be punished..

    The word reserve is the greek word Tereo and means:

    To keep one in the state they are in..as per Rev 22:11

    He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.

    So the gospel to such as hear it now while they are living, to them it is a savour of death unto death..

    2 Cor 2:16

    To the one we are the savour of death unto death; and to the other the savour of life unto life. And who is sufficient for these things?
     
  12. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist
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    Do you believe that God is the author of sin?
     
  13. savedbymercy

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    What does that have to do with the post of mine you just quoted ?
     
  14. Heavenly Pilgrim

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    What makes any difference what he 'says' he believes? If simple logic demands that the end of his argument is indeed God is the author of sin, that is what is important, not whether he admits to it or not.
     
  15. The Biblicist

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    I am asking a flat out direct question! Do you believe that God is the author of sin?
     
  16. savedbymercy

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    Well when you tell me what that has to do with the OP and the post you quoted of mine I might answer it, until then you are ignored because you are ignoring a scriptural point I have made !
     
  17. The Biblicist

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    you are a deceiver and you hide in the dark like a deceiver. Anyone who will not ask a direct question as important is advertising they are a deceiver.

    However, it should be obvious that such a question is relevant to your thread as you are attempting to prove that God ordained certain ones to sin and the obvious question to such a position is "Do you believe God is the author of sin"?

    However, I am leaving you to your deceptive practices and going elsewhere.
     
  18. savedbymercy

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    bib

    Peter taught by inspiration that some were appointed to disobedience:

    If you do not believe the Truth, so be it..
     
  19. mandym

    mandym
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    More correctly if one does not believe you so be it.
     
  20. savedbymercy

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    1 Thess 5:9 A reasonble deduction !

    Deduction is defined:

    a process of reasoning in which a conclusion follows necessarily from the premises presented, so that the conclusion cannot be false if the premises are true.


    1 Thess 5:9

    9For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

    The Truth that God has not appointed the elect or chosen to wrath, is indicative that He has appointed others, the rest, to wrath.

    Hence there are some to whom The Gospel of God is a stumblingblock, who stumble at the word [ predestination and election], being disobedient [ obey not the gospel] where unto they were appointed [ to be disobedient] 1 Pet 2:8

    8And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: where unto also they were appointed.

    So the ones Paul writes about here Rom 10:16

    But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

    2 Thess 1:8

    In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

    and Peter 1 Pet 4:17

    For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?

    All those disobeying the Gospel, have been appointed to do so, have been by God appointed to disobey the Gospel; Because they had been appointed to wrath.
     

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