Are All Professions of Faith In Jesus Saving Faith?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by TCGreek, Sep 7, 2007.

  1. TCGreek

    TCGreek
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    1. The man who says he professed faith in Jesus but it was only to get a spouse, Was his faith genuine and therefore saving?

    2. Or the man who professed faith in Jesus but only to get well of a sickness, Was his faith genuine and therefore saving?
     
  2. Rippon

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    Yeah , there is a wide gap between professing and possessive faith . True believers are in the latter category .
     
  3. standingfirminChrist

    standingfirminChrist
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    The Lord knows the heart.

    This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with [their] lips; but their heart is far from me. (Matthew 15:8)

    A confession with the tongue must be followed by a profession of the heart.

    Therefore if any man [be] in Christ, [he is] a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. (2 Corinthians 5:17)
     
  4. Rippon

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  5. standingfirminChrist

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    Oh that men would grasp that truth!
     
  6. Rippon

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    I'm glad to hear that you grasp the truth that the Lord knows His own people . They are sealed for the day of redemption . It's all due to the Lord's foreknowledge and predestination of His elect ones . The Lord has set his special love on them from eternity past ( if I may so speak ) . They are His own because He purchased them alone . They were bought with the terrible price of the Lamb of God and that was an irrevocable act . They are the authentic ones because we know that others ( while claiming to know Him ) are told by the Lord -- "I have never known you ."
     
  7. TCGreek

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    Then not all professions of faith are saving.
     
  8. saturneptune

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    Amen to that. That means the Lord, not BB members.
     
  9. TCGreek

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    What exactly do you mean SFC?
     
  10. webdog

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    To #1, if it was only to get a wife...no.

    To #2, it would depend. If the person saught Christ out of fear his sickness would lead to death, and he had no assurance of where he was going, it could be yes. If it was from watching TBN and he just wanted to feel better, no.
     
  11. saturneptune

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    Why would an unsaved person profess the name of Jesus to get a spouse? It seems they would go about their daily lives and get a spouse who was an unbeliever. They would be much more compatable. I never heard of professing the name of Jesus as a way to attract a mate.

    Why would an unsaved person profess the name of Jesus to get well from a sickness? It seems like he would go to the doctor and hope for the best.
     
  12. TCGreek

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    1. I guess we all can agree that not every profession of faith is saving.

    2. I'm not a fan of TBN but I believe God can even use that outlet to reach someone.

    3. But Is desiring just physical healing in seeking Christ a true profession of saving faith?
     
  13. Aaron

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    Bunyan dealt with this question at length.

     
  14. swaimj

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    This is a very interesting phrase when considered in the context of II Tim 2. Let's start in verse 17: And their word will eat as doth a canker: of whom is Hymanaeus and Philetus; who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some. Nevertheless, the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, "The Lord knoweth them that are his"....

    The "them that are his" in the context refers to people who confessed Christ at some point but now their faith has been "overthrown". Even though they apparently are not following through on their original profession, at least some of them are still known by the Lord. In man's eyes they do not appear to be believers, but in God's eyes they are saved. Is their an alternate interpretation here? How does this fit in your theology?
     
  15. ReformedBaptist

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    In a slightly broader context Paul is exhorting Timothy "Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth." Set in opposition are the two mentioned.

    It seems a strange reading to me to think they are/were actually saved, and not mere professors of Christ, who profess Him and say they known Him, but in works deny Him. Faith without works is dead.

    In past readings, and reading again, I have considered the false teachers not Christians at all. Hymanaeus is mentioned in 1 Tim 1:20 along with a certain Alexander whom Paul delivered over to satan that they might learn not to blaspheme of whom also the Scripture says, "having faith and a good conscience, which some having rejected, concerning the faith have suffered shipwreck"

    To me this testimony concerning these men show them to be mere professors, likely arrogant men, who rose up in the churches to be teachers and subvert/overthorw the faith of others. We find similar teaching in Titus 1:11 where exhortations are given to hold fast the faithful word that he (a bishop/elder/pastor) may be able by sound doctrine both exhort and convince the gainsayers.

    "For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers, specially they of the circumcision: Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for filthy lucre's sake." Titus 1:10-11

    The word subvert here is the same as the timothy passage.

    Given the parallel Scriptures I conclude:

    1. The teachers were false teachers, repropbate, and unsaved, but not without hope of seeing them convinced.

    2. The possibility that one of the elect might be taken into the false, but will never finally be lost because of the firm foundation in Christ. Christ will restore them. Given that the warning was espeically "those of the circumcision" we could run a parallel to Galatians and how Paul addresses the Christians there being caught in legalism and Paul's concern for them "lest I have laboured in vain" which I take to mean, if you continue this course I conclude my work was in vain...you were never washed, never justified, never sanctified.

    3. The foundation is Christ knows His own, not as others He has never known, and will go into eternal destruction no matter what works for Christ they produce. They are none of His.
     
    #15 ReformedBaptist, Sep 8, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 8, 2007
  16. swaimj

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    Reformed Baptist said:
    I agree that it is not likely that the false teachers were truly saved. However, I see the phrase "the Lord knoweth them that are his" referring not to the false teachers, but to those who were led astray by them. Ultimately, we do not know with absolute certainty whether a person who makes a profession, bears good fruit, and then veers off into some error is truly saved or not. Only the Lord knows whether their profession is genuine or not. The fact that the reference to some who fell into error is followed by the statement "the Lord knoweth them that are his" indicates that it is possible that they are saved even though their faith has been shipwrecked. I hold it as a possibility but it cannot be a certainty for us; it can only be certain to God because, without fruit in a person's life, only he knows is the profession and earlier fruit indicates true faith and repentance.
     

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