Are Catholics saved???

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Jer2913, Apr 2, 2006.

  1. Jer2913

    Jer2913
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    Ok, from what I understand Catholics are practically saved as long as they believe correctly about the Lord. I know they have an interesting theology, most of which I doubt I know about, but what I do know of it... it's interesting. But there was soemthing I was thinking about, which is why I say practically.
    As far as I understand Catholics confess their sins to the priest or something like that, correct? If that is the case then, when they first ask Jesus to come into their hearts and confess their sins to Him, I'm thinking they don't really confess them to Jesus specifically, but to the priest. So are they really saved if they don't confess to Jesus personally, or not?

    Just wantin' some thoughts on this, thanks!

    Jer2913
     
  2. bapmom

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    First off, you don't get saved by confessing all your sins to anyone, whether its Jesus or a priest. Very often the lost person doesn't even realize what all his sins are, hey, half the time the SAVED person doesn't realize that what he's doing is sin.

    "Confession is made unto salvation" is talking about confessing (agreeing with God) that one is a SINNER, it is not talking about listing one's specific set of sins.

    As to whether or not Catholics are saved, you'd have to talk to each individual. I know very few who ever study their Bible on their own, without first filtering it through a priest, so the chances that the average Catholic actually knows his Bible are pretty slim.
     
  3. webdog

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    If a catholic relies on the teachings of the church for salvation...they are not saved.

    If they rely on the teachings of the Bible for salvation...they are.

    There are saved catholics, just like there are lost baptists.
     
  4. Frogman

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    No man can come unto me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

    And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

    It has nothing to do with teaching. Here is the teaching that matters:

    It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.

    We, none of us, can teach or unteach anyone either into or out of the kingdom of God.

    We should therefore not judge anyone because of the teaching they submit to.

    Please refrain from making such judgments, especially where there are few possibilities of those who are so judged to speak for themselves regarding the witness that is in them.

    May God Bless,

    Bro. Dallas Eaton
    Co-Moderator
     
  5. Tom Butler

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    Catholics are saved the same way Baptists are--repentance toward God and faith in the Lord Jesus Christ.
     
  6. saturneptune

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    Amen to Brother Tom. To equate a denomination with either salvation or being lost is outrageous. Its all about Jesus and nothing else. All we can do as Christians is to serve in the local church the Lord has lead us to. Praise God I am in a church that does not have unbiblical thoughts. IMHO, anyone who is in a church or denomination that thinks they are the only ones saved, or that other Christian denominations are on their way to hell, dont walk, RUN.
     
  7. Martin

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    "Its all about Jesus and nothing else"

    "We should therefore not judge anyone because of the teaching they submit to"

    Those are just two of the troubling comments made in response to the post "Are Catholics saved???". While the above statements do not surprise me in today's version of feel good "evangelicalism" those statements still must be dealt with in a Biblical fashion.

    The above remarks present us with two very important questions:

    Is it really "all about Jesus" and literally "nothing else"?

    Does it really not matter what teaching a person submits to?

    Let's start with question one...

    Is it really "all about Jesus" and literally "nothing else"?

    That is a nice little feel good statement that is more than sure to get a million amens. However it is not totally true that Jesus is all that matters. The Bible is clear that other things do in fact matter. While Jesus is God and is thus to be the Lord, Master, Ruler, Savior, and Center of the Christian's life it is unBiblical to say the only thing that matters is Jesus Christ. Why? Because it does indeed matter what a person's view of Jesus is (ie..proper Christology, doctrine) and what their response to Jesus Christ is. Do they believe in Him? Do they reject Him (in word, deed, and/or belief)? The Bible says that those who do not believe in Jesus are condemned (Jn 3:18). To believe in Jesus means that you must believe...

    ...in the Historical, Biblical Jesus. That is that you are placing your trust in the Living Lord who is presented in the Scriptures. Some "churches" have their own version of Jesus, in fact some of these are rightly refered to as "cults". They do not preach/teach or trust in the real Jesus. Rather they preach/teach and trust in a Jesus of their own making (one who is the brother of Lucifer, or just a powerful angel for example). So it is critically important that people trust in the real, Biblical, historical Jesus and not a fake Jesus.

    ...place your faith in Him. A person can be a scholar on the life of Christ but if they don't have a personal relationship with Christ (as Lord) then they cannot be saved (Jn 14:6, 17:2-3).

    So yes Jesus is our Lord and God. And yes He is the center of the true Christian's life. However other things are very important. Things like repentance, faith, the Bible, proper doctrine, etc. The Bible places importance on proper doctrine.

    Let's move on to the second question...

    Does it really not matter what teaching a person submits to?

    The actual statement was...""We should therefore not judge anyone because of the teaching they submit to".

    That statement is, in fact, as unBiblical as it can get. In fact it is spiritually and eternally dangerous. The Bible knows nothing of that kind of logic.

    While I could write a book responding to the above statement I will only respond with a basic point about the Gospel since the original post (in which the statement was made in response to) is about salvation.


    A person who sits under false teaching is in danger of the fires of hell. Notice what the Apostle Paul said...

    "I am amazed that you are so quickly deserting Him who called you by the grace of Christ, for a different gospel; which is really not another; only there are some who are disturbing you and want to distort the Gospel of Christ" Gal 1:6-7

    Let's pause here for a moment. Notice that by paying attention, and accepting, false teachings these professing Christians had deserted Christ and His Gospel! They had turned from the Biblical Gospel and given an ear to a false gospel (a false teaching). By doing so they were in real danger of apostasy.

    So would Paul have agreed that we "should therefore not judge anyone because of the teaching they submit to"? I think not.

    Paul continues...

    "But even if we, or an angel from heaven, should preach to you a gospel contrary to what we have preached to you, he is to be accursed!" Gal 1:8 (see also 9).

    Wow, what a horrible picture. Look at what the Holy Spirit inspired Apostle Paul is saying...if any of the Apostles ("we") or even if an angel from heaven was/is to preach a false gospel they are to be "anathema" (gr, "accursed" in the NASB). So those who preach a false gospel are indeed under the judgment of God.

    Those who accept a false gospel have deserted Christ....

    Those who teach a false gosple are cursed....

    I hardly think that the Apostle Paul would have agreed with the statement..."We should therefore not judge anyone because of the teaching they submit to". In fact we SHOULD. Not with a judgmental spirit but with a love for the person and a concern for the truth. If someone is sitting under false teachings, if someone is accepting a false (soul condemning) gospel than they need to be warned. It would be a sin not to warn them (see Ez 33:7-9).

    Now to the original question...

    Are Catholics Saved?

    The answer is simple...As long as they accept the message of the Roman Catholic Church they are not saved. The Catholic church teaches a dangerous and unBiblical gospel, a false gospel. From their view of mass, to their view of Mary, and how one obtains salvation, their message is clearly unBiblical. There can be no compromise on this issue.

    In Christ,
    Martin.
     
  8. Helen

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    Very good post, Martin. And thank you.

    Frogman's post is something I find some strong disagreements with. If all teaching is simply by God and none of man, then why are some given the gift of teaching? If doctrine is not important (which is what is taught), then why did Paul warn Timothy strongly to watch his doctrine?

    I do agree that we should not judge anyone themselves because of the teaching they receive, but we sure as anything better judge the teaching! Wrong teaching leads straight to hell, especially for the teacher!
     
  9. mima

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    Are Catholics saved? Well as a person who has witnessed to many Catholics I can say this, any Catholic who truly understands the teachings of their church will not pray with you or anyone else for that matter, Nor Will they place their trust in any confession, about anything to anybody.
    The teachings of the Catholic Church are dark and foreboding and condemning. Nevertheless most Catholics are not very knowledgeable about the teachings of their church and many of them are openly questioning the teachings. Many Catholics know something is wrong they just don't know what.
    I've had many Catholics tell me, I've tried to talk to the priest but they won't give me an answer. Some Catholics have prayed with me and remained in the Catholic Church. Others have said, OK I'll get out and they do.
    So I would say that I condem and judge the Catholic Church's teachings as wrong and satanic inspired. But I am more than ready to deliver the message of salvation(how they can be saved) to them.
     
  10. rjprince

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    mima,

    good post!
     
  11. Eliyahu

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  12. JackRUS

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    If you just read over the thread titles on this Catholic site you will see that a true practicing Catholic that stays Catholic can not be saved (Gal. 5:4,9).

    http://www.scripturecatholic.com/salvation.html

    With us it's done, and with Catholics it's still do.

    I was raised a Catholic and went to Catholic school for 8 years. Trust me on this; only an ex-Catholic has a chance to be saved.

    Now having said that, I believe that it is possible for a Catholic to get truly saved upon hearing the Gospel and still remain going to a Catholic church. But not for long. Any discerning Christian would soon be appalled at the Catholic Mass and by the urging of the Holy Spirit, leave in order to be fed the Word.
     
  13. saturneptune

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    All you can really say is that it is much difficult to hear the Gospel in a catholic church than a Baptist church. Anyone here has no idea how God is working in any individual's life, or what He is using to bring that person to Christ.

    Yes, it is nearly impossible for someone to be a Christian and be in the Catholic Church and wrapped in the doctrine.

    But to sit here, when we have all been blessed by God to be in Bible believing churches, that for the most part preach the Gospel, and show a superiority because we are not in the catholic church is very arrogant. Except by the grace of God there go I.

    You can type one million lines in a thread, the fact remains it is all about Jesus. You can twist it, Greek or Hebrew word it, whatever, it makes no difference.

    This might all become apparant to lots of people when they see Baptists crying from hell for a drop of water from a Catholic believer in Paradise.
     
  14. DeclareHim

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    Correct. Their proof text for the belief that priests can forgive sins is John 20:23

    Jesus here speaking to the apostles. Remember the RCC says their Bishops and priests recieved their authority from the Apostles. Also Matthew 18:18 when Jesus is speaking of forgiving others He states this

    I disagree with them but this is their logic. Hope that helps.
     
  15. DeclareHim

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  16. JackRUS

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    There is no such thing as a Catholic believer. Only ex-Catholic believers added to all other believers.

    And the reason is that they don't believe that faith alone in Christ alone saves. And that folks is the only Gospel.

    "For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it (singular)is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek." Rom. 1:16

    "That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord." 1 Cor. 1:31
     
  17. Gina B

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    Certainly. There are variations of Catholics, (and Baptists) and I don't believe that all rely on methods other than Christ for complete salvation.
     
  18. JackRUS

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    I know that Roman Catholicism and Eastern Orthodox rely on "another Gospel" (2 Cor. 11:4). One that always adds works.

    And I know that the Russian Orthodox Church is an active enemy of the Gospel and God's church in Russia.

    If you can think of a Catholic denomination that believes the one true Gospel I would like to know about it. But you would have a better chance of finding the Hope diamond under your pillow tonight than finding a Catholic Church denomination that believes the Gospel. Gal. 1:6-8
     
  19. cindig2

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    John MacArthur has a great cd called Unmasking the Pope and the Catholic System. He was offering it free. It is absolutley eye opening. I would venture to say most Catholics don't know what the Catholic church believes and how it got started. I have copied it several times and passed it around to many people. So, to anyone that says they are our bother's in Christ....you need to familiarize yourself with what they truly believe.
    If anyone is interested in the cd, and you can't find it on the Grace to you website, I will be more than happy to copy it and send it to you.
    I am not breaking the copywrite law, it was free and he wants as many as possible to hear it.
     
  20. Gina B

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    I know that Roman Catholicism and Eastern Orthodox rely on "another Gospel" (2 Cor. 11:4). One that always adds works.

    And I know that the Russian Orthodox Church is an active enemy of the Gospel and God's church in Russia.

    If you can think of a Catholic denomination that believes the one true Gospel I would like to know about it. But you would have a better chance of finding the Hope diamond under your pillow tonight than finding a Catholic Church denomination that believes the Gospel. Gal. 1:6-8
    </font>[/QUOTE]I had thought Eastern Orthodoxy was very close to what we believe, but with some traditions kept.

    I haven't studied it though, simply looked into the basic ideas, which seem practically identical to the basic beliefs of some Baptist groups.
     

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