Article: The Heavenly Divine Council

Discussion in '2004 Archive' started by BibleBob, Sep 13, 2004.

  1. BibleBob

    BibleBob
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    In my looking up info on the difference between fallen angels and demons as Dr. Bob mentioned doing, I found this article about the council of angels or something like that. I mentioned this in a post in the Nephilim thread, but ti didn't get any comments so I thought i'd start another topic to discuss this.
    http://users.aristotle.net/~bhuie/divine_council.htm
    This guy's has some interesting points, but this kind of strikes me as out there. I'm not sure what to think exactly. I found his idea that the "us" Gen. 1:26 refering to God and the council of angels as he explains it interesting. I had never run into that idea before. Any other thoughts?

    Bob
     
  2. Marcia

    Marcia
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    I started to read it and tried to read through it, but it was difficult to follow and too long. Frankly, I just don't have time to read this now as I have others things I must read.

    But the fact he is saying the "us" in Gen 1.26 refers to God and the council of angels makes me wonder about what he says. God making man in the image of God and angels? That sounds very unbiblical to me. If he thinks that, it makes me not want to waste time reading the article. Sorry.

    My understanding of the "us" is that it is like a royal "we." Some say it's the Trinity but I've heard that the "us" and "we" take a singular verb. Maybe a Hebrew person here could clear that up.
     
  3. Word Traveler

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    I would have to agree with Marcia, on the point of "us" In Genesis 1:26 does not refer to God and angels. It refers to the Trinity, which is God. Verse 27 kind of emphasizes the point to me: "God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him: male and female He created them." (NASB 1997) The angels do not share this verse! I too, had problems getting past this in the article. In Christ, WT [​IMG]
     
  4. Bible-boy

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    Sorry but...

    The "us" in Genesis 1:26 is not God speaking with angels. He had not created them yet. There was a one time creation event that took place over a six day period in which God spoke the comos into existance (comos is the whole of creation). The let "us" and in "our" image in the Genesis passage is God referring to Himself as the Triune God (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit). Regarding the Heavenly Council and God talking to the angels about the creation man... I would say show me that in the Bible.

    Sorry I just noticed that you all had already pointed out basically what I just said. [​IMG]
     
  5. Word Traveler

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  6. BibleBob

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    Thanks. Yea, that is what I was thinking too. I had just never run into this weird angel idea and I thought i'd see what others thought of it. The guy that wrote this is definitely alittle out there.
     
  7. av1611jim

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    I went to the link. Admittedly I only skimmed it but the general impression I get is this is basically similar to the mormon idea of a council of the 'gods'.
    While at this same link I browsed around and found other scripturally unsound ideas.
    For example;
    At the resurrection we are only resurrected as spirit beings.
    Unbelievers are annialated.
    Hell is not eternal.
    Everlasting life only applies to the Kingdom age.
    There are others, but these suffice to demonstrate this guy is wacko and should be ignored.
    In His service;
    Jim
     
  8. Marcia

    Marcia
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    I don't think the "us" is the Trinity; otherwise, Jewish people would have a problem with the "us." They don't see it as plural -- I think it takes a singular verb.

    If someone who knows Hebrew could address this, that would be great.

    av1611jim, thanks for taking time to post the errors you found this article. Sounds like there are quite a few! Those beliefs pretty much discredit this guy, and no one should read this article! The guy is more than just a little out there -- he is teaching error. So much bad stuff on the Internet -- it's sad.
     
  9. Charles Meadows

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    In near eastern mythology there were "god pantheons". The ancient Canaanites held the "El" was the father of the gods and the leader of the council of Gods. At times in the bible we see hints that perhaps YHWH was seen as the master of a heavenly court of sorts. The best example here is probably Psalm 82:

    "God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; He judgeth among the gods" By standing (not sitting) He demonstrates His authority.
     
  10. Word Traveler

    Word Traveler
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    Uh . . . okay, Marcia :confused: . I'm having a little trouble with this one (though I ain't no scholar.). If God is not talking about Himself (as the triune God), then why is a plural used when He speaks of Himself? And I'm not sure what you mean by "it takes a singular verb". Any Hebrew scholars out there? In Chris, WT
     
  11. Charles Meadows

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    Elohim has a plural form but generally functions as a singular noun. It's singular form is certainly the primitive noun "El" (god). In Hebrew the singular/plural status of nouns can be variable in terms of a singular noun meaning a singular thing. Blood is singular as it relates to actual blood but plural when it refers to siplled blood. Singular verbs can be used in some cases - but not in this one. "Let us make" uses the verb 'asah in the Qal imperfect PLURAL.

    Opinions have ranged from God speaking to His angels, to His heavenly counsel, among the trinity. Umberto Cassuto, the great conservative Jewish scholar sees it as a plural of exhortation - not necessarily implying that it was spoken to several other beings.

    Similar to this is the verse in Gen 11:7 when God says, "let us go down..." This time the cohortative is used instead of the imerfective Qal - but still with the plural ending.

    It would seem that, all in all, God seems to be talking to other beings.... The trinity is possible, but I suppose if Moses and the ancient Israelites (Ps 82) conceived of God as ruling a heavenly court this could have been intended.
     

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