Baptist attitude toward Muslims

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by paidagogos, Jan 26, 2008.

  1. paidagogos

    paidagogos
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    I am interesting in hearing anyone's take on a Baptist stance toward Islam in light of the publication of A Common Word Between Us and You by Muslim clerics and the signing of the so-called Christian response, Loving God and Neighbor Together: A Christian Response to A Common Word Between Us and You, by Timothy George, Dean, Beeson Divinity School, Samford University.

    I realize that Dr. George is ecumenical, meanwhile attempting to maintain Biblical fidelity, but this is this taking matters a little too far--it is disturbing. This smells of a postmodern attitude of all roads lead to God where all religious seekers are piligrims together. Can we accept such an attitude and still be Christian? Can we speak words of accommodation to the Muslim, Hindu or Buddhist and be faithful to the Scriptures? Where does this leave our evangelism? Our missions?

    Also, you may be interested in hearing John Piper's opinion at http://www.desiringgod.org/Blog/1032_a_common_word_between_us/

    What do you think?
     
  2. Rex77

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    Am 3:3 Can two walk together, except they be agreed?
     
  3. The Scribe

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    No, we can't accept that type of an attitude.

    We have nothing in common with the Muslims.

    Nope...

    Mark 16:15-16 (KJV)
    15: And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
    16: He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
     
  4. Gold Dragon

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    Thanks for bringing this to my attention. Here are the links for those interested as well as some highlight quotes.

    *bolding added by me*

    Signatories include 138 muslim leaders from around the world.




    paidagogos makes reference to one of many Christian responses to this piece.
    Timothy George was one of a long list of signatories and not the author.


    I applaud both statements.
     
    #4 Gold Dragon, Jan 26, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 26, 2008
  5. JerryL

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    Albert Mohler went through this on his radio program I was listening to last week or the week before. He went through how we aren't on common ground because we serve different Gods. I can't remember all he said but he ended with he wouldn't sign the petition if he was asked.

    Link http://www.albertmohler.com/radio_show.php?cdate=2008-01-08
     
  6. Gold Dragon

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    Some of the notable signatories that you should probably direct your rhetoric against include:

    Rev. Dr. John Stott, Rector Emeritus, All Souls Church, Langham Place, London, UK
    George Verwer, Founder and former International Director, OM
    Bill Hybels, Founder and Senior Pastor, Willow Creek Community Church, South Barrington, IL
    Rick Warren, Founder and Senior Pastor, Saddleback Church, and The Purpose Driven Life, Lake Forest, CA
    Brian D. McLaren, Author, Speaker, Activist
     
  7. donnA

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    We have noting in common with muslims, and should not even seek common ground with them unless it involves them committing to Christ and leaving islam.
     
  8. Linda64

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    There is no true "loving God and Neighbor Together" without Christ. Muslims do not believe in the diety of Christ nor are they a religion of "peace".
    It is an attitude of "tolerance" and ignorance of biblical truth. True biblical unity is based on biblical truth. "Tolerance" repudiates and compromises biblical doctrine. (2 Timothy 4:1-4).

    If Christians "love" the Muslims, they would not hide their lights under a bushel...instead they would witness the love of Christ. God loves the Muslims...they need the Christ to save them. Instead of "dialogue"...share the Christ of the Bible. "Tolerance" will send people to a Christless eternity. That is not love...love will share the Gospel...because "the love of Christ constraineth us" (2 Corinthians 5:14)
    Very good message by John Piper!

    All this stuff (dialoguing) with false religions and liberals is sending the wrong message. Living together in a false unity is NOT the answer. Where in scripture does it say we are to dialogue with the lost in order to find "common ground"? Scripture tell us to "preach the Gospel to every creature." (Mark 16:15)
     
  9. dcorbett

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    Whoever said that we have common ground with Muslims is not saved and will burn for eternity. We have no common ground - and unless they are willing to admit they are sinners and that Christ is their only hope, we have nothing to share with them.

    I don't want them dead, I want to see them saved. THEY want to see me dead. Period.
     
  10. Gold Dragon

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    If you want the job of judging who will burn for eternity, I think you might have some competition from the Big Guy upstairs.
     
  11. The Scribe

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    Matthew 7:16-23 (KJV)
    16: Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
    17: Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
    18: A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
    19: Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
    20: Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
    21: Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
    22: Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
    23: And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
    :saint:
     
  12. KJVkid

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    If you want the job of judging who will burn for eternity, I think you might have some competition from the Big Guy upstairs.gold dragon

    If you are referring to Allah, I wouldn't say he is "upstairs".

    If you are refering to God you are MOST disrespectful
     
  13. Linda64

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    First of all, I don't consider God to be "the Big Guy upstairs". He is the Creator and Sustainer of the universe. His Name is above all names. The Bible never calls Him "the Big Guy upstairs"---

    Philippians 2:9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:

    Philippians 2:10
    That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;

    Philippians 2:11
    And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

    When anyone (including Muslims) rejects God's gift of salvation in Christ, they are ALREADY judged by God. They are ALREADY under God's wrath. We don't say so, God says so!

    John 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

    John 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

    1 John 5:12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

    Being "tolerant" is NOT love. Jesus told Peter to "feed My sheep".
     
    #13 Linda64, Jan 27, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 27, 2008
  14. Gold Dragon

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    Apparently I've offended some sensitive folks so I will restate my post in a manner more politically correct on the Baptist board.

    If you want the job of judging who will burn for eternity, I think you might have some competition from Yahweh, the Lord Almighty who is Judge of all His creation.
     
  15. Gold Dragon

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    Amen! Many who call on God's name will not enter into the kingdom and Christ will judge who that is, not dcorbett or those who agree with dcorbett's positions.
     
    #15 Gold Dragon, Jan 27, 2008
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  16. JerryL

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    Because we belong to different religions and serve different gods doesn't mean we have to force our beliefs on them to be able to live in peace. If I get a muslim next door neighbor I could definitely live in peace with him and be friends. I wouldn't sign that paper though, because it insinuates that we serve the same god but with different saviours. There is also a difference in the "radical" muslims and the everyday muslims you meet on the street.
     
  17. Gold Dragon

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    Agreed. And I believe that to be the main thrust of the paper that all Christians should support.

    I would describe the paper as wisely side-stepping the issue that both sides agree that we do not serve the same god. Taking on that issue would be counterproductive to concept that there are commonalities between Christianity and Islam that we can peacefully agree about.

    And in case folks were wondering, I believe the Allah of Islam to be a false god that is entirely different from the Allah (arabic for God) of Christianity, Yahweh.
     
  18. JerryL

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    I definitely believe in the living in peace premise of the paper. The Piper video is a little harsh in where he says the only way we can live in peace with them is for them to convert to Christianity. If that is the case we would have to throw away a lot of friends and friendly aqaintances in our lives.
     
  19. KenH

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    Very few Muslims want to see you dead. It is bigoted to paint with such a broad brush.
     
  20. paidagogos

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    A specifically Baptist thread..........

    I chose Timothy George as a Baptist representative because this is a Baptist thread. Also, Dr. George is often identified as one committed to Biblical faithfulness although largely ecumenical in spirit. The others, including sometimes Baptist Rick Warren, are not representative of a Baptist viewpoint, I think. But, I was wondering how Dr. George could reconcil the signing of the document with a strong Biblical stance. IMHO, there is an apparent contradiction. It is bound up in how we view truth and if the Bible is truth. Can someone please explain it to me.

    BTW, McLaren is representative of the Emergent Church which would see no problem with the Christian-Muslim accord.

    Does this indicate a compromise of Biblical truth and the view of truth in the name of love and tolerance? If we believe that truth exists, it is knowable, and the Bible is the source of truth, then how can we tolerate a system of teachings (i.e. Islamic doctrine) that contradicts that truth and condemns souls to everlasting damnation?

    We need to think through the longterm implications of "tolerance" in evangelism and missions. What do you say?
     

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