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Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by Jamal5000, Jul 2, 2002.
What are opinions about this organization?
I just learned about it last year.
It's a good thing.
It is an excellent organization unless matters of Christ and Scripture are relevant. Then, it is apostate.
Preach the Word
Care to elaborate or do you need to email someone for information on this charge as well?
[ July 03, 2002, 10:02 AM: Message edited by: rhoneycutt ]
honeycutt, the sarcasm is childish. Check the record for yourself. Check their associations and the lowest common denominator theology for yourself. You shouldn't expect us fundis to do all the proof. If you are a Christian, you should be able to discern for yourself where they are on things.
"Preachtheword", your accusations and attitude reflect the evil one. Why do you persist in your attacks?
Guilt by association is the devil's tactic. Who did Jesus associate with?
If your make the charge (especially a negative one), you supply the proof. What's wrong with that?
If you are a Christian, you will not spread lies and half-truths and expect other people to accept them just because you said so.
Oh OK, how do you suggest I respond to unsubstantiated drivel. I really enjoyed the passive aggressive tact you employed after that.
As an FYI I took your advice and checked up on their associations. You were right for once preach. The Southern Baptist Convention is a member. Your right it is apostate!!!!
Seriously though Preach, I think you are confusing this organization with the Alliance of Baptists. Another fine organization I am sure you will disagree with. I know it can be difficult keeping up with all the different groups so if I were you I would exercise a little more caution before I shot my mouth off about something I know nothing about. How is that for sarcasm?
I couldn't find a listing right away of all the so-called Baptist groups that are involved. I knew that the SBC was connected to it. I wish they would cut away from it.
I also know that the "union" between the two groups is socially based and it is not an endorsement of or in agreement with their theological position. Again, to join others of a different faith for the sake of social issues is foreign to the concept of the N.T. teachings. I believe the SBC is wrong on this. The SBC does state though that they seek to unite with other groups for the sake of fighting pornography, child abuse, etc. I think they are wrong.
I do know what I am talking about in this issue. The BWA needs to be treated like the CBF and the BGCT if not more so. It isn't our job to make the world a better place to go to hell from.
On January 24, 2002, Denton Lotz, general secretary of the Baptist World Alliance, joined hands with Pope John Paul II and the leaders of many other denominations and 11 pagan religions at the third Day of Prayer for Peace at Assisi, Italy. The ecumenical pagan prayer gathering featured some 200 religious leaders, including representatives of such "Christian" denominations as Roman Catholic, Orthodox, Anglican, Reformed, Baptist, Lutheran, Mormon, Methodist, Quaker, Pentecostal, Mennonite, as well as representatives of Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, Sikhism, Bahai, Confucianism, Shintoism, Hinduism, Jainism, Zoroastrianism, Tenrikyo (Japan), and members of African and North American "traditional religions." The religious leaders traveled to Assisi with the Pope by train from Rome, arriving at the blasphemously named Railway Station of St. Mary of the Angels. The Pope said, "Violence never again! War never again! Terrorism never again! In the name of God, may every religion bring upon the earth justice and peace, forgiveness and life, love!" The Pope's prayers aren't answered, and neither are those of the other false religious leaders gathered with him, for the simple reason that they worship false gods and preach false gospels and blatantly disobey God's Word. That the general secretary of the Baptist World Alliance would participate in such a thing is irrefutable evidence of his apostasy.
Desmond Tutu spoke at a Baptist World Alliance meeting in 1988. Anglican archbishop Tutu is a rank liberal who in February 1996 called for the ordination of homosexual priests. Consider the following quotes by Tutu that expose his unbelieving heart:
"Some people thought there was something odd about Jesus' birth... It may be that Jesus was an illegitimate son" (Desmond Tutu, Cape Times, October 24, 1980).
"The Holy Spirit is not limited to the Christian Church. For example, Mahatma Gandhi, who is a Hindu ... The Holy Spirit shines through him" (Desmond Tutu, St. Alban's Cathedral, Pretoria, South Africa, November 23, 1978).
You mean he held hands and prayed with Methodists? Lutherans, too? I see your point, somebody get a stake and matches.
Just exactly when did Tutu become a Baptist, and the spokesperson for the Baptist World Alliance?
Thanks for starting to provide material to back up your assertions. It gives you much more credibility. Speaking of which, what is the source of this story?
Personally, I would not be very comfortable participating in prayers with a number of those false groups, but I do recognize that there are all sorts of people who are in Christian denominations that I have strong disagreements with who are indeed part of the kingdom.
My mother and her family were nominally Roman Catholic because there was no other Christian alternative in Sarajevo, Yugoslavia. They did not have a Bible (was not readily available) and they did not get a clear teaching of salvation by grace through faith.
When WWII broke out, they ended up in a Nazi camp in Poland with people from all over Europe. In the camp a young Roman Catholic priest ministered to the families and gave my mother and aunt a clear understanding of salvation by grace through faith -- not by the sacraments, veneration of icons and such.
When they were finally liberated by the Russians and came to the United States to escape Communism, my mother and aunt were drawn to Protestant churches, my mother to a local Baptist church and my aunt to a Methodist church. My grandparents remained a part of the Roman Catholic Church because that was what they knew, but their own understanding of God was more "Baptist" than quite a few so-called Baptist churches in the area. I have no doubt that they are both in the arms of God.
Their faith is real and was made real a long time ago before they even knew about the Bible.
Remember, the Spirit of God is not bound by borders, denominations, circumstances, the availability of the Bible or our opinions.
God has great patience and love for people with rotten theology. He must, or both of us are in bad shape!
The Baptist World Alliance was organized in England in 1905. Some of you might like to poke around the Baptist World Alliance Home Page. The Who Are We? link is a good place to start. THIS page lists the member organizations for A. D. 2000.
Other than as a format to bring Baptists around the world to communicate with one another, the BWA seems to exist chiefly as a social-work type of organization. Their greatest interest probably lies in the area of religious liberty. While I am not against all that they are doing, my belief system would not allow me to participate in an organization that is too big and too ecumenical. I say big because it is a religious organization at a higher level than the local church, and ecumenical because it encompasses Baptists (and others) that I would consider heretical.
The BWA is a Baptist version of the World Council of Churches.
On a personal note, the Russian representatives to this organization are from the follow on to the All Union Council of Evangelical Christian-Baptist Churches. The AUCEC-B was the offical government controlled (lap dog)Baptist organization. If the last sentence seems a little too strong, I know some Russian brethren who will use even more emphatic language.