Beginning of the Baptism With the Holy Spirit

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by evangelist-7, Oct 13, 2012.

  1. evangelist-7

    evangelist-7
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    This is from the beginning of a long 2-page explanation of “The Baptism With the Holy Spirit”.

    Preface:
    John the Baptist tells us that Jesus is the One who baptizes with the Holy Spirit:

    “He (Jesus) will baptize you with the Holy Spirit.” (Matthew 3:11, Mark 1:8, Luke 3:16, John 1:33).
    More proof of this is found in Acts 2:33.
    But, this does not refer to the moment of salvation where the Holy Spirit does the “baptizing”:

    “For we were all baptized by one Spirit into one body (the Church)” (1 Corinthians 12:12).

    Jesus told His group of disciples to wait for the promise of the Father:
    ”Behold, I send the promise of My Father upon you; but tarry in the city
    of Jerusalem until you are endued with power from on high.” (Luke 24:49)

    Later, Luke described Jesus’ instructions in more detail:
    “… He commanded them … to wait for the promise of the Father …
    ‘… for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit
    not many days from now … you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you;
    and you shall be witnesses to Me … to the ends of the earth.’ ” (Acts 1:4-8)

    In the above passages, Jesus was referring to the following future event …

    Approximately 120 people received Jesus’ promise:
    “When the Day of Pentecost had fully come … there appeared to
    them divided tongues, as of fire, and one sat upon each of them.
    And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak
    with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.” (Acts 2:1-4)

    So, the promise of the Father was the following: the baptism with the Holy Spirit where
    the Holy Spirit came upon the disciples, filling them, which anointed them with spiritual power!
    Jesus’ promise was fulfilled: the disciples were (1) born-again and (2) baptized with the Holy Spirit.
    And today this often is how it goes, but normally a person only receives the first blessing.


    Peter explained to the Jews what had just happened:
    ”Therefore (Jesus) being exalted to the right hand of God, and having received from the Father
    the promise of the Holy Spirit, He (Jesus) poured out this which you now see and hear.
    … Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name
    of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
    For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off,
    as many as the Lord our God will call.” (Acts 2:33-39)
    So Peter is referring to being both born-again and baptized with the Holy Spirit.

    Here the first Gentiles received this experience:
    “While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who
    heard the word … the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also.
    For they heard them speak with tongues and magnify God.” (Acts 10:44-46)

    Peter recalls his experience with the Gentiles above:
    “… the Holy Spirit fell upon them (the Gentiles), as upon us (the Jews) at the beginning.
    Then I remembered the word of the Lord, how He said, ‘John indeed baptized with water,
    but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’ … God gave them the same gift as He gave
    to us when we believed on the Lord Jesus Christ” (Acts 11:15-17)

    So, we see that “the promise” and “the gift” refer to both salvation and
    the baptism with the Holy Spirit (with the evidence of speaking in tongues).

    The preposition “upon” is always used when referring to this baptism
    (Luke 24:49 and Acts 1:4-8, 2:1-4, 8:14-19, 10:44-48, 11:15-17, 19:5-6).

    .
     
  2. The Biblicist

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    There are so many errors due to a lack of proper Biblical heremenutics that is hard to know where to begin to correct them. From past experience, I think it would be a waste of time to correct them as you simply are void of spiritual discernment and correctability. For example your last statement about the preposition "upon" is wrong as it can be. The preposition "upon" is used to describe the empowerment of the Spirit due to filling both before and after Pentecost and that is not the baptism in the Spirit.

    You are also confusing the administrator and the elements as well as the candidate of the two different kinds of baptisms in Acts 2 and 1 Cor. 12:13.

    A. The Baptism IN (Gr. en) the Spirit

    1. The Administrator is Christ "He" not the Holy Spirit
    2. The element is "the Holy Spirit" not Christ
    3. The Candidates are PLURAL already born again water baptized members of the church at Jerusalem.


    B. The Baptism IN the body of Christ - 1 Cor. 12:13

    1. The Administrator is The Spirit not Christ - see 1 Cor. 3:5-8
    2. The element is "one body" (v. 27) not the Spirit - Acts 2:41
    3. The Candidates are born again believers - Acts 2:41
     
    #2 The Biblicist, Oct 14, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 14, 2012
  3. evangelist-7

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    Over the past few years in various forums, I have noticed that usually
    Satan pushes his man to post first ... against God's truths.

    In this way, Satan has set the tone for everyone to be against God's truths.
    You know, the "first impressions" thing.

    Satan has Biblicist really ready and willing to fight against God's truths,
    especially if they stand against his own bias, opinion, doctrine, etc.

    Brothers and sisters, "rightly divide the word of truth" (2 Tim 2:15) ...
    i.e. openly consider the verses in the OP ... and don't let Satan's lies distract you.

    .
     
  4. plain_n_simple

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    Well said brother...
     
  5. evangelist-7

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    It is very comforting to see that one stands with me on some of these very important points.
    Thank you, pns, for displaying the courage of your convictions!

    P.S. I also wish that Smith was still alive!

    .
     
  6. plain_n_simple

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    Lol, he was a no-games man. Always enjoy reading his stuff. Gives hope. There are many others today as I'm sure you are aware. gbu
     
  7. evangelist-7

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    Actually, I haven't been keeping up with others lately.

    My favorite Smith story was the time the Spirit told him
    to punch a lady in the stomach as hard as he could!
    She had some stomach ailment.
    And Smith was obedient.
    She was healed, but unfazed and unhurt, of course.

    Following the Spirit always produces incredible results.
    Because He honors those who are doing His prefect will.
    (And maybe also those doing His not-exactly-perfect will.)

    Oh yes, almost forgot ... Smith said:
    "Those without the baptism with the Holy Spirit
    are living in a weak and impoverished condition."


    Yup, no spiritual power at all (having a prayer answered is NOT having spiritual power).

    I'll never forget reading that!

    .
     
    #7 evangelist-7, Oct 14, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 14, 2012
  8. plain_n_simple

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    Yes that had a profound effect on me as well.
     
  9. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist
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    Anyone who exposes your false teachings by the Scripture would be your "Satan" man.

    I have noticed that false teachers who cannot respond to Scripture always stoop to the very same tactics which are Satanic in nature. When they cannot respond with substance they stoop to name calling, ridicule, and other satanic type tactics. Both you and Plain-n-simple come from that mold.
     
  10. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist
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    There are TWO fillings in Acts 2:1-3 one of which you completely pass over which is really the baptism in the Spirit. They were all sitting in an upper room and the incoming sound of a rushing wind FILLED the whole room they were sitting in. They were thus IMMERSED in the shikinah glory. This was the immersion in the Spirit. In addition to this baptism IN the Spirit they were filled by the Spirit which was a common Old and New Testament experience.

    There is not word that says they were "born again" as they were already believers in the gospel long before this event and were born again by the Spirit at the point of faith in the gospel prior to being baptized.

    The baptism in the Spirit occurred in the Old Testament at least upon three occassions where this double filling is spelled out and it is in regard to the INSTITUITIONAL house of God:

    Ex. 40:35 And Moses was not able to enter into the tent of the congregation, because the cloud abode thereon, and the glory of the LORD filled the tabernacle.

    It was both covered or immersed in the cloud and INSIDE it was filled by the glory of the Lord.

    The very same thing occurred at the dedication service of the temple by Solomon. It was covered by the shikinah glory and filled inside. Hence, immersed and filled.

    The same is true with the New Testament church as the house of God that Jesus built during his earthly ministry. He built it out of born again water baptized believers and the day of Pentecost was the dedication service of the new house of God when it was completely immersed in the glory of the Lord and and each member was individually filled with the Spirit.

    This was a one time historical event to the congregation composed of JEWISH members in Acts 2. In Acts 10-11 it occurred in connection with GENTILE members of the Jerusalem congregation.

    When Peter was called in on the carpet to explain why he went to a Gentile home and baptized them into the membership of the congregation he explained it was because that God confirmed them (prior to water baptism) by the very same thing that occurred to them "at the beginning" on the day of Pentecost (Acts 11:15).

    Note his words "AT the beginning"! He did not say "SINCE the beginning"! There had been thousands saved and added between Pentecost and Acts 10 but the NEAREST REFERENCE POINT Peter could compare what happened in Acts 10 was Acts 2 rather than an ongoing continuing thing between Acts 2 and Acts 10.

    The Baptism in the Spirit is not an individual experience. It is not regeneration and it is not a second work of grace for sanctification. It is the public accreditation of a new Institutional House of God. The only way that the congregation at Jerusalem would incoporate Gentile members into its JEWISH congregation is by God CONFIRMING them in the same manner he did the JEWISH congregation in Acts 2.

    The Baptism in the Spirit is not an ongoing, personal experience any more than are sign gifts. Paul explicitly denies that tongues is given to all Christians or that any other spiritual gift is given to all Christians (1 Cor. 12:29-30). That means sign gifts are not necessary to be saved or else they would be given to all Christians. That means they are not necessary for personal sanctification or spiritual growth or else they would be given to all Christians. The Pentecostal movement is not a movement that originates with the Spirit of God but with the spirit of error because everything about it is "error."
     
  11. Revmitchell

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    He should have been arrested for assault. When these fakes run out of ideas they make up junk like God told them to assault another person. What the Christian world needs is sober minded representatives of Christ. And we are not seeing it in this absurd behavior from those claiming to be Christians. The Christian community needs to appropriately stand up and denounce this kind of behavior. It is evil and not of God.
     
    #11 Revmitchell, Oct 15, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 15, 2012
  12. evangelist-7

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    What the Holy Spirit requested, and the results which followed,
    were obviously done for a laugh and to make UNBELIEVERS look like fools.

    Dost thou rememberest da story about the Lord speakin' thru a donkey?

    THE LORD DOES WHATEVER HE LIKES ... WHETHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT.
    And then He laughs at you!
    P.S. the Lord has a tremendous sense of humor.

    Just what type of Rev art thouest? And just what seminary did thou attendest?

    And what problem do you have with the perfectly chronological Scriptures in da OP?
    Other than UNBELIEF, I mean.

    .
     
  13. Revmitchell

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    Ahh...This is the arrogance I see in the charismatic movement. It was also on full display with that fella named Brown who led the pseudo-revival in Pensacola Fla.

    God does not tell people to hit people in the gut. No where in scripture has anything of the sort happened. Your doctrine is shown for what it is. It is ungodly and evil. Your doctrine is a fulfillment of the scripture Paul wrote to young Timothy:

    2Ti 4:3 For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions,
    2Ti 4:4 and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths.



    And I am reminded of what Jesus said:

    Rev 2:4 But I have this against you, that you have abandoned the love you had at first.
    Rev 2:5 Remember therefore from where you have fallen; repent, and do the works you did at first. If not, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place, unless you repent.



    I pray the Lord will soften you heart and turn from the evil you engage in.
     
  14. billwald

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    >Dost thou rememberest da story about the Lord speakin' thru a donkey?

    Theology by proof texting - the standard Christian practice - of ignoring Deut 13.
     
  15. Yeshua1

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    Where in the bible are we commanded to be "baptised" in/with the Holy Ghost?
     
  16. Yeshua1

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    How amny sick people did jesus punch and slap around though?
     
  17. Revmitchell

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    The better question is how many people did Jesus punch and slap around and then laugh at? Satan would certainly do that.
     
  18. evangelist-7

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    Just how many millions of times do I have to explain this?

    .
    .
    think
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    'Dis baptism is an anointing done by Jesus Himself ... where the Spirit comes UPON.
    'Dis is very similar to God's anointing of special people in da OT ... where the Spirit came UPON.

    'Tis not for everyone. 'Tis not for everyone. 'Tis not for everyone. 'Tis not for everyone.

    Git it? ... Got it? ... Good.

    P.S. I'll believe it when I see it.

    This thread is only for those with eyes to see, ears to hear, etc.

    .
     
    #18 evangelist-7, Oct 15, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 15, 2012
  19. Revmitchell

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    Translation..."this thread is only for those who will agree with me."
     
  20. Yeshua1

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    STILL waiting for that verse in ANY NT book that states that we are commanded to seek the "baptism of the Holy Ghost!"
     

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