Biblical Solution to Spousal Abuse

Discussion in 'Free-For-All Archives' started by Eladar, Feb 11, 2005.

  1. Eladar

    Eladar
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    What is the Biblical answer to these two situations?

    -A Christian woman is married to a Christian man who abuses her.

    -A Christian woman is married to a non-Christian man who abuses her.

    The woman is supposed to be submissive. Jesus said that divorce is only the solution for those with hard hearts. So what is a Christian woman supposed to do according to the Bible? I know what Society says, but I'd like to see scripture to back it up.
     
  2. Ben W

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    There is a number that a woman rings when her husband abuses her, it is 911. The husband is required to submt to the laws of the country, his refusal required him to go to jail. She should then divorce him for abandonment.
     
  3. music4Him

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    1Cor. 7:10-16
    And unto the married I command, yet not I, but the Lord, Let not the wife depart from her husband: 11 But and if she depart, let her remain unmarried, or be reconciled to her husband: and let not the husband put away his wife. 12 But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away. 13 And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him. 14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy. 15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases: but God hath called us to peace. 16 For what knowest thou, O wife, whether thou shalt save thy husband? or how knowest thou, O man, whether thou shalt save thy wife?


    She would be free to leave.

    As for the Christian man who abuses his wife.......Ephesians 5:21-33 (he should pay special attention to verses 28 and 29.) If he is truley doing like he's suppost to be according to the Word, he shouldn't be abusing his wife.

    BenW~ has a good advice there too! [​IMG]
     
  4. Scarlett O.

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    The word submissive does not imply blind obedience.

    It does not imply that a woman has to shut up and take it.

    It does not imply a military type relationship where the inferior-ranked person has to "stand down" when a superior-ranked person barks commands.

    The idea of submission does not mean that a wife has to "take" anything.

    Not verbal abuse.
    Not physical abuse.
    Not mean-spirited words and actions.
    Not neglect.
    Not a refusal to love her.
    Not anything that crushes her body nor spirit.

    Submission from a wife means that she openly and gladly reveres and respects and supports a man who is the Godly spiritual leader of their home.

    Submission has nothing to do with a woman cowering in any way or fashion under any conditions that belittle her nor harm her or her children.

    Submission is a powerful characterization of a Godly wife.

    It means that a woman has enough spiritual marrow in her backbone to offer herself to her husband as the church does to Christ. Shoulders squared back and looking him in the eye with great love and joy to be with him. Proudly complementing her husband with great gifts and talents of her own that God has given her use as God sees fit. Teaching her children, by her own behavior, to respect their father and respect her in like manner. Looking to her husband only and finding in him, alone, a Godly protection, sacrificial love on a daily basis as Christ loved the church, and mutual respect.

    She doesn't look down at the ground.
    She doesn't speak in a timid voice.
    She doesn't walk behind her husband.
    She doesn't take inappropriate behavior and cry inwardly that he has some sort of "right" and that she can't speak up for herself.

    And she certainly doesn't take spousal abuse, in any form, from ANY husband, Christian or not.

    If he is putting her body or spirit in harm's way, then GET OUT!!

    Get out!

    Maybe he can be counseled, redeemed, or helped in some way with medication, salvation, a men's support group, or help from the church. Maybe their relationship can be salvaged or maybe not.

    But while he is on a rampage of any kind...

    ...get out!!!

    And she is not to return to living with him until he is safe to live with!

    If he is not saved, she can divorce him, but only after she has exhausted every means possible to help redeem him from his behavior. That's my opinion.

    If he is a Christian and cannot stop his abusive behavior, then she can live apart from him. If she divorces him, that is between her, God, and Godly counsel from clergy and/or professional Christian counsel.

    A submissive wife is a confident, vibrant, happy, humble stronghold to her marriage...a valuable asset to a Godly man.

    A submissive wife does not have to take anything from a husband that harms her in any way.

    Submission simply means recognizing someone's leadership and respecting it.

    Submission does NOT mean blind acceptance of brutality or harmful incompetence disguised as leadership.

    Too many Christian women have suffered and are suffering at this very moment, even while you are reading this post, because of the belief system taught by the church that a submissive wife is to never question anything that her husband does or says. No matter what he does.

    Peace-

    YSIC
    Scarlett O.
    <><
     
  5. dianetavegia

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    I don't agree with society.
     
  6. Eladar

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    Scarlett,

    What verses do you use to support these statements?
    Does the Bible say "Godly spiritual leader" or simply husband? Does the Bible make the same distinction that you do? I'm asking for Biblical arguments.
    Yes, submission is a powerful characterization of a Godly wife. What scriptures support your statement that submission odes not mean basially 'turning the other cheek'?

    Yes, I understand this is what society says. I'm asking for scripture.


    Music4Him,

    I find it interesting that you did not choose to bold the first part of the statement: And unto the married I command, yet not I, but the Lord, Let not the wife depart from her husband

    I do like the next part: if you can't stay, then at least do not divorce.
     
  7. music4Him

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    Eladar, no it should not have been put in bold. When I was pointing out that the woman can LEAVE! [​IMG] If a man isn't doing what the Lord tells him to do evidently its wrong....right? Read Ephesians 5:21-33 its right there.

    BTW, You mentioned a man being a christian and beating his wife... someone better be asking him some questions, because if not for what it says in Eph.5...the word also clearly states to "love your neighbor"...who would be closer than a wife. Also it says "if a man hates his brother he is guilty of murder". Surely the word is not excluding the female gender from that?

    BTW, your not trying to say its alright for a man to abuse his wife are you? :eek:
     
  8. Eladar

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    Why not? Is it not a plain statement from God Himself?

    Yes, she can leave. The problem that I have is that it seems to me that the statement about leaving comes on the tails of the commandment to stay.

    I see it saying this: It is best if a woman stays with her husband. But if the wife is not able to do this then she can leave, but she is not to divorce.

    Of course.
    I gave two scenerios. I figured the "Christian wife beater" scenerio was the easier scenerio to deal with, but still had its difficulties.

    Where did I ever say that?
     
  9. Eladar

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    Oops, forgot one question for Scarlett. Sorry about that Scarlett.
    Where is this in the Bible? It seems to me that Paul says the exact opposite. That's why I believe the non-Christian abusive husband is the more difficult subject to deal with from a Biblical perspective.
     
  10. gb93433

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    What I find interesting is that Jesus never asked a person if they were saved he just simply told them to come follow Him. If a man does not follow Christ I would certainly wonder about his salvation. How can a disobedient man follow Christ. It is impossible.

    How can a man say he loves God and abuse his wife. The two cannot coexist.
     
  11. Scarlett O.

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    I don't know what else I can say. I thought I was self-explanatory.

    Does a wife have a right to get away from a husband who is trying to abuse her or harm her and seek the police or the church or sanctuary in a group home? Yes!

    Scripture?? I don't know. It's really common sense, don't you think?

    Ezekiel 34 talks about the sin of the "shepherds" (church leaders) not talking care of the weak and helpless of the "flock". Quite a lengthy chastisement.

    There's also the Biblical stance on taking care of people in the church who are in the wrong. A wife could tell him that he is in the wrong. If he won't listen, she could go and get a couple of elders to talk to him. If he still won't change, the church can deal with him. I don't remember where the scripture is offhand.

    Matthew 5 (I think) is the reference you made to "turning the other cheek." And that has NOTHING to do with a submissive wife!

    That's talking about vengance and retribution and how, for the Christian, that is not the right course of action.

    Proverbs (somewhere) says that it is "to a man's glory to overlook an offense." That's "turning the other cheek." Not allowing an offense to cause you to sin by seeking retribution.

    "Turning the other cheek" is NOT sitting at home, allowing your spouse to split your jaw wide open!

    Malachi 2is where God says that he hates divorce. Well, guess what? It also says that he hate when men treat their wives and their marriages and their marriage vows violently.

    An abusive man is violating so MANY scriptures that it is beyond the ridiculous and yet anytime spousal abuse discussed, all people seem to want to yip-yap about is how a woman should stay home and take it because of their interpretations of the word submission.

    Ephesians also says for Christians to submit to "each other" in love. In that manner, a husband's role is to take care of his wife and her role is to allow him to do so.

    I Corithians answers the question about the wife and the non-believer. Music4him already posted that on.

    I'm not going to be able to give you scripture that you want. I just don't think that you and I are on the same "page" here.

    Sorry.

    Peace-

    YSIC
    Scarlett O.
    <><
     
  12. gb93433

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    God creates out of nothing. Therefore, until a man is nothing, God can make nothing out of him.

    -- Martin Luther, "Martin Luther--The Early Years," Christian History, no. 34.


    There was a day when I died:

    Died to George Mueller: to his tastes, his opinions, his preferences and his will.

    Died to the world–its approval or censure.

    Died to the approval or blame of even my brethren and friends.

    Since then I have studied only to show myself approved unto God.
     
  13. gb93433

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    Some don't have much if any common sense. They want a verse for everything. I simply cannot find one verse that tells me to use tiolet paper.
     
  14. Eladar

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    I had a long post, but the old "Baptist Board doesn't like my long posts" kicked in and I lost it.

    I guess I'll give the short version:

    It appears me Scarlett that you and gb93433 don't want to have to deal with this from a Biblical perspective. Since I do, I get to be demonized.
     
  15. Scarlett O.

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    I was never my intent to make you feel demonized or anything like that. And I am sorry if you feel that I maligned you in any way. My apologies.

    I gave my opinion, tried to interject some scripture.

    This issue is all boiling down to a difference in your interpretation and my interpretation of a submissive woman, so let's let it go at that.

    We disagree on it. We aren't the first to do so. We won't be the last.

    I'll back off on this one.

    Peace-I mean it.

    YSIC
    Scarlett O.
    <><
     
  16. av1611jim

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    A man should NEVER hit his wife. Saved or unsaved. PERIOD.
    Now that that is out of the way, let's get some perspective, shall we?

    Should a man "take it" if he is being abused by his wife?
    Should a man "take it" if he is physically hit in the face everytime he goes out to the street corner to witness of the saving Grace of Christ?

    There are dozens of scenarios I could offer to illustrate my point.

    2Ti 3:12
    Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.

    2Ti 2:11
    It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him:
    10:If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:

    1Pe 2:19
    For this is thankworthy, if a man for conscience toward God endure grief, suffering wrongfully.
    20:For what glory is it, if, when ye be buffeted for your faults, ye shall take it patiently? but if, when ye do well, and suffer for it, ye take it patiently, this is acceptable with God.

    1Pe 2:21
    For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps:

    1Pe 3:14
    But and if ye suffer for righteousness' sake, happy are ye: and be not afraid of their terror, neither be troubled;
    15:But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:
    16:¶ Having a good conscience; that, whereas they speak evil of you, as of evildoers, they may be ashamed that falsely accuse your good conversation in Christ.
    17:For it is better, if the will of God be so, that ye suffer for well doing, than for evil doing.
    18:¶ For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

    1Pe 4:15
    But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters.
    16:Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.
    17:For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?
    18:And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?
    19:Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.

    Re 2:10
    Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.


    That is ALL who will live godly SHALL suffer. Not just husbands, preachers, missionaries, children, sunday school teachers, or wives. ALL.

    This is a hard saying but it is Scriptural. God is pleased when we suffer WRONGLY for Christ's sake.

    "Be thou faithful unto death!

    This goes against every sense of "fairness" in my being, but I am NOT God, and I cannot PLAY God either. You asked for Scripture. I gave it. It all applies.
    Does a wife "suffer" under the iron fist of a cruel man? Sure she does. But what is the reward? Life now? OR a CROWN of Life later?
    I guess a woman must choose. Hard one, you bet, but nevertheless, that is the choice. Please don't rail on me and call me insensitive or any of the other worldly epithets. Whenever you offer an excuse for a woman to flee, try applying it in Paul's case and see if it will fly, or in the case of a missionaries wife who is abused while her husband is out preaching, or any number of other ways we could suffer and still do it for the glory of God. Try it. Then see if your excuses are valid.
    We are NOT here to save our own lives, but to GIVE them to God and trust God with them COMPLETELY.

    In HIS service;
    Jim

    ( I am truly sorry if this is hard. Nobody ever said living a pure and godly life is easy or safe.)
     
  17. Ben W

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    [​IMG] Post of the day my friend! [​IMG]
     
  18. BobRyan

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    Ben is correct. Restraining order and then Jail.

    In Jail the man might repent and become a real Christian as opposed to the fake Christian of example A or the blatant non-Christian of example B.

    If he becomes real Christian she wins a good husband.

    If he stayes evil - she protects her children and keeps away from him. Indeed "he" has left her.

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  19. Scarlett O.

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    I not going to call you anything.

    I will tell you this, though. You can take it as a railing or not, even though it's not intended that way.

    The twisting of scripture that pertains to Christians suffering for the glory of God and for their faith (like Paul in prison or Stephen when ganged up on and stoned)....the twisting of said scripture into an interpretation that wives in general should give into stabbings, rapes, cigarette burns, bitings, broken bones, and/or death by the hands of men that they are married to and to never cry out to their fathers, brothers, police, neighbors, nor the church is something I cannot fathom.

    I do NOT understand your application of these scriptures to tormented wives or children. And, hey, what's the difference? I don't even understand your application of these scriptures to abused husbands.

    I am going to give you the last word on this. I shall not give you another reply unless you specifically ask me for one.

    What do you mean? Help me understand, Jim, what do you really mean?

    If you had a married daughter and she had broken bones and cigarette burns and knife cuts on her body, are you saying that she should not come to you nor the police nor the church?

    Should she suffer in silence, with no one knowing and just hope that somehow God is pleased with it all and will gain glory from it?

    You have the floor and the last word. I can't post on this thread anymore. It upsets me too badly.
     
  20. Eladar

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    I am with Jim when it comes to what a perfect person should do. The problem is, there aren't too many people who are actually perfect when it comes to this matter. As a matter of fact, I'd say there are very very few.

    It seems to me that the Bible teaches that we are to literally pick up our crosses and follow Jesus. This literally means allowing other people to walk all over us and abuse us without us fighting back. This is totally unAmerican. I know it is and I know it is totally un-natural. In order to accept this, one must be willing to accept that what happens to us is meaningless. That simply doesn't fly in modern culture. It probably never flew in any culture. I would liken it to the command that in order for a man to be 'perfect', he must be celibate. Very few men can actually live like this. If a man who can't live such a lifestyle tries, it will only lead to frustration and rebellion.

    I'm sorry, but I do not believe people should be forced into a position of trying to be perfect, when God does allow the window.

    When I say take the window, I mean both through marriage for men and escaping an abusive husband for a woman.
     

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