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Billy Graham Answers

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Salty, Jul 3, 2011.

  1. Winman

    Winman Active Member

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    That is Arminian doctrine. If God sincerely extended the pole in a real and genuine effort to save them, but they refused, that is Arminian doctrine.

    However, if God did not extend the pole, or let's say only extended it half way (general calling versus effectual calling) to the boys, well out of their reach, then the boy's volition really doesn't come into play does it? You can't refuse something not truly offered and that you were not truly able to accept can you? This is Calvinist doctrine.

    If you only extended the pole half way to the boys, well out of their reach, not only would it be an insincere effort to save them, it would actually be a cruel mocking and torture as they drowned.
     
  2. Robert Snow

    Robert Snow New Member

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    Wrong!

    It is exactly for this reason that mankind is under judgment.

    Notice: if you receive Him you become a son of God; however, if you reject Him you remain in your sin.

    So, the scripture shows that it is indeed our rejecting Him that causes us to end up condemned.
     
  3. preacher4truth

    preacher4truth Active Member

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    Not even close to wrong. The problem is people have believed this nonsense "going to hell for..." when they are going to hell because they are guilty sinners, not "for" rejecting Christ.

    Why do they believe this? Because their preacher said it. So he is also guilty for being wrong.

    Yep, you remain in your sin, where you were, already condemned, on ones way to hell. You don't see that you already prove what I said to be correct.

    No one is going to hell "for" rejecting Christ, mankind is already on his way there. See?


    - Peace
     
  4. quantumfaith

    quantumfaith Active Member

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    Yes!!!! I do most assuredly agree the call is all.
     
  5. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

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    Actually, you're both right. We all have a deadly disease (so to speak) called sin. Christ is the cure. But if one rejects the cure, he will die of the disease.
     
  6. preacher4truth

    preacher4truth Active Member

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    Nope. He/she will die of the "disease" period, whether consciously rejecting Him or having never had opportunity to. One is already condemned to hell before the message. In other words, one (mankind) is already on way to Hell prior to rejecting Christ.

    We don't go to hell "for" rejecting Him, we are already on our way there. All of mankind is, whether they've heard and rejected or not having ever heard, they all are on way to Hell.

    The Gospel is a stop to all those who believe.

    One then will die of the disease, period, prior to rejection of Christ. This is not excluded to only those who "reject" Christ. It's the indictment upon all lost mankind prior to hearing the Gospel.

    - Peace
     
    #26 preacher4truth, Jul 4, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 4, 2011
  7. quantumfaith

    quantumfaith Active Member

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    On the one hand are His justice and holiness, which demand punishment for sin, rightly deserved. On the other hand are God’s love and mercy, which demand reconciliation and forgiveness. Both are essential to His nature; neither can be compromised. What is God to do in this dilemma? The answer is Jesus Christ.

    In order to receive forgiveness, we need to place our trust (faith and belief) in Christ as our Savior and the Lord of our lives. But if we reject Christ, then we reject God’s mercy and fall back on His justice. And you know where you stand there. If we reject Jesus’ offer of forgiveness, then there is simply is no one else to pay the penalty for your sin – except yourself.

    Suppose that God could create a world in which everyone is freely saved, but there is only one problem: all such worlds have only one person in them! Does God’s being all-loving compel Him to prefer one of these underpopulated worlds over a world in which multitudes are saved, even though some people freely go to hell? I don’t think so. God’s being all-loving implies that in any world He creates, He desires and strives for the salvation of every person in that world. But people who would freely reject God’s every effort to save them shouldn’t be allowed to have some sort of veto power over what worlds God is free to create. Why should the joy and the blessedness of those who would freely accept God’s salvation be precluded because of those who would stubbornly and freely reject it? It seems to me that God’s being all-loving would at the very most require Him to create a world having an optimal balance between saved and lost, a world where as many as possible freely accept salvation and as few as possible freely reject it.

    Suppose that God could create a world in which everyone is freely saved, but there is only one problem: all such worlds have only one person in them! Does God’s being all-loving compel Him to prefer one of these underpopulated worlds over a world in which multitudes are saved, even though some people freely go to hell? I don’t think so. God’s being all-loving implies that in any world He creates, He desires and strives for the salvation of every person in that world. But people who would freely reject God’s every effort to save them shouldn’t be allowed to have some sort of veto power over what worlds God is free to create. Why should the joy and the blessedness of those who would freely accept God’s salvation be precluded because of those who would stubbornly and freely reject it? It seems to me that God’s being all-loving would at the very most require Him to create a world having an optimal balance between saved and lost, a world where as many as possible freely accept salvation and as few as possible freely reject it.

    It’s possible that God would permit the damned to leave hell and go to heaven but that they freely refuse to do so. It is possible that persons in hell grow only more implacable in their hatred of God as time goes on. Rather than repent and ask God for forgiveness, they continue to curse Him and reject Him.

    The Bible says that the unreached will be judged on a quite different basis than those who have heard the gospel. God will judge the unreached on the basis of their response to His self-revelation in nature and conscience.

    …[This] means that the benefits of Christ’s sacrifice can be applied to them without their conscious knowledge of Christ. They would be like people in the Old Testament before Jesus came who had no conscious knowledge of Christ but who were saved on the basis of his sacrifice through their response to the information that God had revealed to them. And, thus, salvation is truly available to all persons at all times. It all depends upon our free response.

    I truly wish with all my heart that universal salvation were true. But to pretend that people are not sinful and in need of salvation would be as cruel and deceptive as pretending that somebody was healthy even though you knew that he had a fatal disease for which you knew the cure.

    William Lane Craig
     
  8. JesusFan

    JesusFan Well-Known Member

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    Thankfully the Lord knows His own!
    brother Billy is past 90, and think his mental facilities have been declining...

    evidence is on larry King show, seemed to hesitate when confronted with jesus being ONLY way to God...

    seemed to be too "chummy" with heritical pastor/teacher Robert Schuller

    Also seen on TCT "total cultish Christian TV" saying how greats jan and paul crouch and ministry has been...

    Again, thankfully, the Lord realises we are ALL but frail flesh, and God will indeed kept and save securily his own!
     
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