Billy Graham

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Salty, Jun 19, 2016.

  1. Salty

    Salty
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    From a post on another thread:

    Repeat after me salvation has overrun many churches in all ranks. There are unregenerated preachers in high places, many with long pedigrees. Sir William from Graham is responsible for a lot of this problem.

    Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

    Bro. Jame
    s


    So how would you rate the evangelism of Billy Graham
     
  2. Internet Theologian

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    Describe his evangelism.
     
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  3. preachinjesus

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    It's easier to throw stones than build bridges.

    Dr Graham excelled in his work and calling.
     
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  4. JonC

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    The problem, IMHO, is a lack of discipleship. God has used Graham in great ways to share the gospel and to bring many to Christ. But with evangelists there is the problem of witnessing without discipleship. The only assurance that Scripture offers that we have been saved is that we “walk in the Light”. The "weakness" of Graham's ministry is not in the ministry itself but in taking his ministry to be a substitute for what the church should be doing. But this"weakness" is not isolated simply to his method of evangelism.

    For example, the tracts which some advocate (let’s use the “million dollar” one from living waters) informs that if you have broken a commandment then you are bound for Hell. But God does not want anyone to perish so He gave His only Son that whoever would believe may live. Today, repent and trust Jesus and God will give you eternal life as a free gift. Then read the Bible daily and obey it. (http://store.livingwaters.com/gospe...bill.html#product_tabs_upsell_products_tabbed)

    Without follow up, without true discipleship, these efforts are incomplete. We are called to make disciples, to teach, to be a functioning member of the Body of Christ. Both an evangelism crusade and a tract ministry fall short. But both may be useful tools and used in powerful ways by God in the work of the Kingdom.
     
  5. JamesL

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    His evangelism gently and carefully guided people right toward the foot of the cross. And one step before, he would throw them into a ditch of self effort
     
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  6. Salty

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    Jon mentioned the lack of discipleship - and I agree, especially, when an agreement was made that decision cards would be sent to the church of which the individual stated he attended. Thus a decision card would for a RC would have been sent to his Roman Catholic church.
    Now, did Billy do the wrong thing there? Otherwise (at least back the day) a RC was forbidden to attend a Graham crusade.

    Also the "counselors" do not counsel - they only hand the individual a packet.
     
  7. TCassidy

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    The Great Commission is three-fold.

    1. Teach them (the Gospel)
    2. Baptize those who are saved.
    3. Disciple those who are saved and baptized.

    Billy Graham has done #1 better than any man alive, or perhaps even in all of human history. :)

    But he has failed to perform #2 and #3.

    By directing the new converts back into their spiritually dead church where they never heard the Gospel he kept the dead churches supporting him, but he abandoned the newly born (again) children of God into the hands of spiritual child abusers/neglectors. :(

    And only getting a 30% score is a failing grade in any school in the world.
     
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  8. JonC

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    I believe there is a distinction here between pastor and evangelist. IMHO Graham should have worked more closely with local churches and associations. I do not know if it was a failure on his ministry or on the ministries of those local churches. I do know many who God drew via Grahams ministry, and I also know some who had a fleeting emotional encounter they considered conversion only to toss it aside weeks later.

    So I am thankful that God has used Billy Graham as wonderfully as He has to reach so many, but I also believe going forward there is much to be gained through a careful and critical examination of the shortcomings inherent in his evangelistic model. While we have to be careful not to villainize the man, there is a benefit to honest review so far into the ministry.
     
  9. tyndale1946

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    Interesting this subject was brought up... I was thinking of Paul and knowing somewhat how men are and Paul being a previous Pharisee do you think some of them he knew followed him around waiting for him to slip?... Some today follow a certain preacher and become preacher worshippers... They come for the preacher and not the message and it is the Lord that gives the preacher the message... We should always look for the message and not who is delivering it... If the preacher is following Christ we should follow the example that the preacher sets forth and not the preacher... And as Paul states to Corinthian church this is the outstanding mark of a preacher who is commanded to preach the Gospel... The reverse is also true... Brother Glen

    I Corinthians 11:1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ.
     
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  10. JonC

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    1 Cor. 3:4 also comes to mind. And you are absolutely right that we should not look at the man but the message, and weigh that message with God's Word.
     
  11. Revmitchell

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    Graham was the best. Connected them with the local church for discipleship as he should have. Any failure of the local church is not his failure. He gets an A 100.
     
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  12. Van

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    The BG Crusade people contact many of the local churches and invite them to send counselors who do counsel and do more than hand a packet. So an effort was made to get those professing Christ into local churches. Folks have been throwing rocks at Billy my whole life. Sometimes with valid observations about doctrine or tactic. But they were not called to be an Evangelist, at least not with the power Billy had. One of my Pastors made a point about Billy, he not only effectively brought people to Jesus through the power of his presentation, he did it basically using one sermon! When he enters heaven, he will enter "abundantly." Praise God!
     
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  13. tyndale1946

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    I heard this said by a well known preacher of our people The Primitive Baptist and seeing and hearing preachers over the years his words ring so true... The three phases of a preacher are this... Number one they are idolized, then they are criticized, and last they are scandalized... Now not being a preacher I cannot say I have felt this but observing them over the years I do know this he was spot on... Brother Glen
     
  14. JonC

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    I do not know enough of Billy Graham to critique his methods. I take it from Revmitchel and Van that Graham looked to local churches to provide counseling and perhaps a home for any who would be drawn to Christ. I think that this is how it should be.

    The early church was not dependent on Paul to remain and disciple those who were reached with the gospel of Christ. Paul was taking the Word to the world. At the same time, churches were being built on the foundation of the gospel. But Paul was not baptizing and assuming the pastoral role of discipleship towards those who were saved.

    I do not see how Graham could be blamed for failings that would fall under pastoral care if Graham was an evangelist and not a pastor. I’m not even sure that it is fair to put the blame of shallow doctrine or false conversions at Graham’s feet to begin with.

    An evangelist is, IMHO, charged with teaching the gospel (witnessing), not baptizing. The local church is charged to disciple those who are saved.
     
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  15. Jerome

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    Any school? Presumably even Al Mohler's Billy Graham School of Evangelism at SBTS:

    Bowling Green, Ky. Daily News 15 Apr 2001, p. 3A:

     
  16. Revmitchell

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    He cannot be blamed. usually it is a charge made by those who do not like his method but cannot argue with how greatly the Lord used him. It is an absurd claim and by and large should be ignored.
     
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  17. Bro. James

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    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Sure seems strange that someone would lead someone out of darkness to The Marvelous Light and then send them back into the darkness of their previous religion.

    "Well done" does seem a bit inappropriate. Is all of the information regarding Billy Graham recognizing the pope urban legend?

    We live an ecumenical age. Jude 3 in not applicable.

    Even so, come, Lord Jesus,

    Bro. James
     
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  18. Salty

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    It was that - or the RC's being forbidden to attend a BG crusade.
     
  19. JamesL

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    I have nothing against the man's character, style, motives, or anything I can think of, except 1...
    He preached a voodoo of you-do.

    Scripture teaches two aspects of grace - merit and access.

    Merit is found in Jesus Christ, the cross, the propitiation of sin, reconciliation, forgiveness, remission of sin, etc. The merit is all the things which God has done, in Christ, on behalf of men. And all of orthodox Christianity agrees on this. No one comes to the Father except through Christ

    Well shoot, tell me how I can access this? How do I get my hands on it? What good thing must I do, how much must I work, or give, or at least promise, that God would grant this great grace to me?

    That's where Graham, and countless others are promulgating a false gospel. It's an issue of access.

    The Galatian church was scolded, and Peter rebuked, on this issue. Judaizers came to Christian believers and started pushing a works access. Paul said you have fallen away from grace. Christ is of no benefit.

    He wasn't speaking out against works-based merit, he was speaking out against works-based ACCESS.

    That's why I say Graham guided millions gently toward the cross - then one step before, he would throw them into the ditch of self effort.:

    "Christ, the Son of God, has died a great death on your behalf. He has satsified the wrath of God for you. He has undergone great pain and misery in your stead. Then He was raised victorious, and took His rightful place at the right hand of the Fatger." or something to that effect. Good job. Good facts, good history.

    Then the access...
    "Now if you'll open your heart and receive what God has for you. Are you sorry for your sins? Will you confess your sins? Turn away from them, and commit your life to obeying what the bible teaches. Ask Jesus to forgive you. Ask Him to come into to your life. Pray afyer me, but I want you to really mean it..." or similar garbage.

    That's where the whole thing ran off the rails every time. He did such a good job for the firsy 98%, then dragged everybody in the place into the muck with this self-effort attempt at access.

    What is biblical access? Faith in the Son of God. Full assurance that what God has promised He is able also to perform. Hope in the resurrection. Conviction. Belief. Fully convinced. Those who hope in Him will not be disappointed.

    And if an angel or anyone else preach different than that, let him be accursed.
     
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