Brzezinski: US must stop following Israel “like a stupid mule”

Discussion in 'Politics' started by poncho, Nov 28, 2012.

  1. poncho

    poncho
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    Leading US strategist Zbigniew Brzezinski – unofficial dean of the realist school of American foreign policy experts – has drawn an unflattering picture of US-Israel relations.

    In a speech to the National Iranian American Council, Brzezinksi said:

    “I don’t think there is an implicit obligation for the United States to follow like a stupid mule whatever the Israelis do. If they decide to start a war, simply on the assumption that we’ll automatically be drawn into it, I think it is the obligation of friendship to say, ‘you’re not going to be making national decision for us.’ I think that the United States has the right to have its own national security policy.”

    CONTINUE . . .

    Now don't go blaming me for what Brzezinski said. I'm just the one reporting it.
     
    #1 poncho, Nov 28, 2012
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  2. Revmitchell

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    What an ignorant pile of garbage.
     
  3. poncho

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    Haven't you ever had a friend that took advantage of your friendship? It does happen you know.
     
  4. kyredneck

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    So you think that the United States DOES NOT have the right to have its own national security policy.

    What an ignoramus attitude.
     
    #4 kyredneck, Nov 28, 2012
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  5. kyredneck

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    So how do you separate AIPAC from Congress? Actually nothing new here.

    THE ISRAEL LOBBY AND U.S. FOREIGN POLICY

    John J. Mearsheimer, Department of Political Science, University of Chicago

    Stephen M. Walt, John F. Kennedy School of Government, Harvard University

    March 2006
     
    #5 kyredneck, Nov 28, 2012
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  6. poncho

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    I wish I knew.
     
    #6 poncho, Nov 28, 2012
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  7. webdog

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    this is the best straw man you could erect? First, Israel is not "starting wars" as the op begs the question. Second, an ally is just that. Third, don't let your false eschatology determine your antisemitism.
     
  8. webdog

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    how is that the case here?
     
  9. poncho

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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaIQHWfj5f4

    True friends don't maneuver friends to do things against their best interests.

    Right here in "Securing The Realm" it says . . .

    [SIZE=+1]Forging A New U.S.-Israeli Relationship[/SIZE]

    In recent years, Israel invited active U.S. intervention in Israel’s domestic and foreign policy for two reasons: to overcome domestic opposition to "land for peace" concessions the Israeli public could not digest, and to lure Arabs — through money, forgiveness of past sins, and access to U.S. weapons — to negotiate. This strategy, which required funneling American money to repressive and aggressive regimes, was risky, expensive, and very costly for both the U.S. and Israel, and placed the United States in roles is should neither have nor want.


    Israel can make a clean break from the past and establish a new vision for the U.S.-Israeli partnership based on self-reliance, maturity and mutuality — not one focused narrowly on territorial disputes. Israel’s new strategy — based on a shared philosophy of peace through strength — reflects continuity with Western values by stressing that Israel is self-reliant, does not need U.S. troops in any capacity to defend it, including on the Golan Heights, and can manage its own affairs. Such self-reliance will grant Israel greater freedom of action and remove a significant lever of pressure used against it in the past.


    To reinforce this point, the Prime Minister can use his forthcoming visit to announce that Israel is now mature enough to cut itself free immediately from at least U.S. economic aid and loan guarantees at least, which prevent economic reform. [Military aid is separated for the moment until adequate arrangements can be made to ensure that Israel will not encounter supply problems in the means to defend itself]. As outlined in another Institute report, Israel can become self-reliant only by, in a bold stroke rather than in increments, liberalizing its economy, cutting taxes, relegislating a free-processing zone, and selling-off public lands and enterprises — moves which will electrify and find support from a broad bipartisan spectrum of key pro-Israeli Congressional leaders, including Speaker of the House, Newt Gingrich.


    Israel can under these conditions better cooperate with the U.S. to counter real threats to the region and the West’s security. Mr. Netanyahu can highlight his desire to cooperate more closely with the United States on anti-missile defense in order to remove the threat of blackmail which even a weak and distant army can pose to either state. Not only would such cooperation on missile defense counter a tangible physical threat to Israel’s survival, but it would broaden Israel’s base of support among many in the United States Congress who may know little about Israel, but care very much about missile defense. Such broad support could be helpful in the effort to move the U.S. embassy in Israel to Jerusalem.


    To anticipate U.S. reactions and plan ways to manage and constrain those reactions, Prime Minister Netanyahu can formulate the policies and stress themes he favors in language familiar to the Americans by tapping into themes of American administrations during the Cold War which apply well to Israel. If Israel wants to test certain propositions that require a benign American reaction, then the best time to do so is before November, 1996.



    True friends don't try to manage and constrain their friends reactions. True friends talk it out and try to come to a mutual understanding. But then I'm often here that I have no idea of what I'm talking about so maybe I don't even know what true friendship is. I just assumed friends don't try to manage and constrain their friends reactions.
     
    #9 poncho, Nov 28, 2012
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  10. kyredneck

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    Exactly what it is, a foreign entity.
     
  11. poncho

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    Yeah I know just don't say that out load here. :smilewinkgrin:
     
  12. Revmitchell

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    Or another way to put it lets not let your anti-semitism push you into creating silly strawmen.
     
  13. poncho

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    Another way to put is don't let your emotions and all the propaganda blind you to the facts.
     
  14. OldRegular

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    poncho

    It would have been better if "Ziggy" had not ben talking before a group of Muslims!
     
  15. webdog

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    That's exactly what I had in mind addressing you guys
     
  16. kyredneck

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    What are you afraid of, this?:

    Making false accusations is more loathsome than anti-semitism. Just what is it you're calling anti-semitism? Point me to the post, or be quiet about it.

    This cowardly smear tactic has been a very effective tool in coercing congress and stifling debate, but it is slowly but surely losing it's punch, and being seen for what it is:

    “The Great Silencer

    No discussion of how the Lobby operates would be complete without examining one of its most powerful weapons: the charge of anti‐Semitism. Anyone who criticizes Israeli actions or says that pro‐Israel groups have significant influence over U.S. Middle East policy—an influence that AIPAC celebrates—stands a good chance of getting labeled an anti‐Semite. In fact, anyone who says that there is an Israel Lobby runs the risk of being charged with anti‐Semitism, even though the Israeli media themselves refer to America’s “Jewish Lobby.” In effect, the Lobby boasts of its own power and then attacks anyone who calls attention to it. This tactic is very effective, because anti‐Semitism is loathsome and no responsible person wants to be accused of it.”
    http://mearsheimer.uchicago.edu/pdfs/A0040.pdf
     
    #16 kyredneck, Nov 28, 2012
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  17. kyredneck

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    "...Moreover, the Lobby’s campaign to squelch debate about Israel is unhealthy for democracy. Silencing skeptics by organizing blacklists and boycotts—or by suggesting that critics are anti‐Semites—violates the principle of open debate upon which democracy depends. The inability of the U.S. Congress to conduct a genuine debate on these vital issues paralyzes the entire process of democratic deliberation. Israel’s backers should be free to make their case and to challenge those who disagree with them. But efforts to stifle debate by intimidation must be roundly condemned by those who believe in free speech and open discussion of important public issues...."
     
  18. kyredneck

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    Are you saying that the U.S. should not be talking to the Muslims?
     
  19. webdog

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    Its called deductive reasoning.

    The OP calling Israel a "stupid mule" while comically stating THEY are the ones to start wars sounds like something the Palestinians (anti-semites) say.

    You agree with this premise given your "ignoramous" comment.

    What other conclusion is there?
     
    #19 webdog, Nov 28, 2012
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  20. Revmitchell

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    Add to that he constantly uses phrases like "Jewish Bankers" which the Jewish part is unnecessary. If you want to criticize Israel do it without always pointing out their nationality.

    What do you believe would happen if someone always said things like the "Black Bankers"? (rhetorical)
     

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