Cain -- first born?

Discussion in '2004 Archive' started by Phillip, Nov 29, 2004.

  1. Phillip

    Phillip
    Expand Collapse
    <b>Moderator</b>
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2001
    Messages:
    6,708
    Likes Received:
    0
    Genesis 4:1
    Adam knew his wife Eve intimately, and she conceived and gave birth to Cain. She said, "I have had a male child with the LORD'S help." 2 Then she also gave birth to his brother Abel.
    (HCSB)
    Genesis 4: 13
    But Cain answered the Lord, "My punishment is too great to bear! 14 Since You are banishing me today from the soil, and I must hide myself from Your presence and become a restless wanderer on the earth, whoever finds me will kill me.
    (HCSB)

    Who was he concerned about?

    Is there any place in the Bible that it specifically says that Cain is First-born child?

    Did a long time pass before Cain killed his brother, so that his brothers and sisters and their children had already spread out on the Earth?

    Who, specifically was he concerned about, if it was only his parents? Was he concerned about the future, knowing that his descendents would be killed? If he was concerned about himself, then obviously more children were involved either during Cain's life, before he killed his brother, or he was not the first-born?
     
  2. Lacy Evans

    Lacy Evans
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2003
    Messages:
    2,364
    Likes Received:
    0
    1) There could have been children prior to Cain. Part of the curse was sorrow in child-birth. This could mean that prior to the fall for an unspecified amount of time, Eve the mother of us all, placed on Earth to replenish it, could have been having twins, triplets, etc every nine months with no "sorrow".
    2) He could have been worried about a cousin or a younger sibling. We don't know exactly how many kids Eve had. (especially the girls . . .there must have been some.) We also don't know how old the brothers Cain and Able were when this occurred. They could have had dozens of siblings and hundreds of adult cousins.
    3) They could have been aliens. (Not really)

    Lacy
     
  3. Phillip

    Phillip
    Expand Collapse
    <b>Moderator</b>
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2001
    Messages:
    6,708
    Likes Received:
    0
    These were my thoughts too. I have never seen mention of Cain being the first born.

    Food for thought: Would Adam and Eves sin have effected prior born children? (I'm assuming that it would.)

    Aliens? I didn't think Green Cards were issued before the Tower of Babel ordeal? [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  4. dianetavegia

    dianetavegia
    Expand Collapse
    Guest

    Genesis 3:16 To the woman He said: "I will greatly multiply your sorrow and your conception; In pain you shall bring forth children; Your desire shall be for your husband, And he shall rule over you."

    Notice that God said He would multiply woman's conception as well as her sorrow and give birth in pain. Could it be that before that time Eve would only have been fertile once a year?

    [ November 29, 2004, 02:03 PM: Message edited by: dianetavegia ]
     
  5. blackbird

    blackbird
    Expand Collapse
    Administrator
    Administrator

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2002
    Messages:
    11,898
    Likes Received:
    2
    Diane says, "Could it be that before that time Eve would only have been fertile once a year?"

    If that were the case---then humans would be no higher than the rest of the animal world---who can only be fertile once a year(for the most part)
     
  6. dianetavegia

    dianetavegia
    Expand Collapse
    Guest

    I thought that too, Bro. David, but I looked it up and read that cats can be fertile for 2-3 weeks at a time. If they don't breed they will go into heat again almost immediately!

    What do you make of I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; ?
     
  7. robycop3

    robycop3
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2000
    Messages:
    7,573
    Likes Received:
    10
    I believe it's quite apparent that people can easily give birth 6 times in 5 years.

    Once again, I see no Scriptural contradiction against God's having created other people from A&E, especially in light of the latest DNA knowledge. If WE know that much, GOD knows infinitely more, plus, He has the power to apply it any way He chooses.

    Remember, identical twins began with ONE union of their parents' DNA. They're clones of the original zygote. But yet, even though they often LOOK almost exactly alike, they're often of entirely different demeanors and abilities. I believe God's telling us several things there...that EACH person is unique and has a soul. And although science has succeeded in cloning sheep, the clone is NOT an exact repro of its parent.

    We cannot get any closer to cloning as GOD does with id. twins. The fertilized zygote is the basic building block for every person, and when it splits into an identical zygote, it simply cannot be any more basic and still develop into a complete baby. If God does such naturally, who's to say He couldn't do the same with Eve's DNA by other methods, making instant adults as He did with A&E? The people thus formed could also be instant adults, spread into other lands.

    Remember, GOD CAN DO ANYTHING! Sounds like a catchall, but does anyone have a satisfactory explanation for whom Cain married, not involving incest? Given the strong worldwide taboo of incest from ancient times through now, let alone GOD'S forbidding of it, I don't believe it happened that way among man's first generations.

    Scripture doesn't mention any children before E&A's fall, but we can't rule it out, either.
     
  8. just-want-peace

    just-want-peace
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2002
    Messages:
    5,502
    Likes Received:
    40
    No doubt God COULD have created others, but it seems to me that they would have been perfect (IE sinless) just as A & E were in their original state, so that relieves Adam of responsiblity for ALL of man's demise.

    Unless I am mistaken, there was no prohibition of incest until many, many generations later.? The gene pool was still relatively pure for several generations before sin had it's full effect on mankind.
     
  9. Lacy Evans

    Lacy Evans
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2003
    Messages:
    2,364
    Likes Received:
    0
    That is facinating Robycop. I had never considerd it. Perhaps "conception" was something closer to cloning before the curse.

    Then again, I guess that would confound the original question of who was Eve's first born

    Lacy
     
  10. menageriekeeper

    menageriekeeper
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2004
    Messages:
    7,152
    Likes Received:
    0
    Could there have been sons before Cain? Wouldn't they have been mentioned in the geneologies?

    The linages are traditionally passed from father to eldest son. With Cain dishonored/disowned and Able dead the linage passes from Adam to Seth and then Seth's son. How could there have been older sons than Cain and Able? (ref is Gen 5:3-8)
     

Share This Page

Loading...