Calvin Was A Man...

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by TCGreek, Aug 27, 2007.

  1. TCGreek

    TCGreek
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    1. No well-bred Calvinist begins and ends with the writings of Calvin.

    2. Therefore, it is a fallacy to argue continuously that Calvin didn't believe in this or that point.

    3. It is an affront to Calvinists to say that we are depended on Calvin for the Doctrines of grace. There are many things that Calvin taught that I do not embrace. For example, I do not embrace infant baptism, but Calvin did (see Book IV, CH. XVI ).

    4. The bottomline is this, Are the Doctrines of grace , commonly called Calvinism, biblical?
     
    #1 TCGreek, Aug 27, 2007
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  2. npetreley

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    I'd say there's a good chance far more people worship Calvin Klein than John Calvin. ;)
     
  3. Brother Bob

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    I guess you all have been labeled Calvinist after his name. I am sure he did many things you do not agree with. I would be afraid to list them or another fight would begin..............:) I do not like being called Arminian, for I am not. I certainly do not believe in falling from Grace and have been told my some who are Calvinist that I believe closer to Calvin than some of you do. I know our association at one time would of been called Calvinist.

    Yes, if the "through faith" is accepted correctly.
     
    #3 Brother Bob, Aug 27, 2007
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  4. TCGreek

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    I don't even know if I owe anything that says Calvin Klein. Do you?
     
  5. swaimj

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    Why would a person call themself a calvinist and not follow Calvin?
     
  6. npetreley

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    Because Calvinism is shorthand for the doctrines of grace. Most Calvinists I know have never read anything by Calvin (or have read very little). They simply know "Calvinist" means "believes in the doctrines of grace", and they agree.

    I don't know why this always gets framed as a Calvinist issue. Some people call themselves Arminians just because they believe in free-will, but no self-respecting Calvinist would make the intellectually dishonest claim that they follow Arminius. Ironically, the few Arminians I've met don't even have a clue what Arminius taught. At least most of the Calvinists I know truly understand the doctrines of grace.
     
  7. JustChristian

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    That's because its really not Arminianism but the gospel. So is Calvinism. The "self-respecting answer" is it's God's plan of redemption.
     
  8. TCGreek

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    By the way, that was a name given by the detractors. The Doctrines of grace are all over Scripture.
     
    #8 TCGreek, Aug 27, 2007
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  9. ReformedBaptist

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    Yes, all well-bred Calvinists are Reformed Baptists and love John Gill. :tongue3: Just, a Gillisist doesn't sound as good.
     
  10. Dale-c

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    I own one pair of Calvin Klein jeans.
    I got them at Costco for $20.
    Wait, I think they are CK.
    Whatever they are, they are one of those brands I would NEVER buy at a regular store for $65 :)

    Oh, and Calvinism is just a nickname for the gospel.
    We could call is Gillism or Spurgeonism or Edwardsism or Kennedyism etc.
    Hey, we could call is "Paulism"

    The problem with people that just say I am a "Bible Believer" is that we are ALL Bible Believers by our claim.
    THe question is: what do you believe the Bible says?
     
  11. ReformedBaptist

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    How about a Jesusist. wait, that sounds like Jesuit. Nevermind.
     
  12. Dale-c

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    how about a 2 lipper?

    :)
    say it to yourself and you will get it :)
     
  13. npetreley

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    Not a thing. ;)
     
  14. Jarthur001

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    In fact this was what it was called before Augustine. Well, really it was called Paulinism.

    Paulinism is the doctrine that has influenced the whole course of the history of dogma. Paulinism is the doctrine, that has influenced the whole church. People will embrace Paulinism and its doctrines of grace, or will build systems to oppose it for they hate the thoughts of it. People have been placed in jail on both sides of Pauline teaching, and put to death in some cases….yes this killing of others because they did not believe as you was also found on both sides. The RCC and its works, stands in opposition to Luther and Pauline’s grace. It stands in the clearest opposition to all merely natural moralism, all righteousness of works, all religious ceremonialism.

    Pauline teaching has become the conscience of the Church, until the Catholic Church in Jansenism killed this her conscience. Pauline’s doctrines that causes actions and reactions in its followers and its haters, describe the critical epochs of theology and the Church. For as many that loves grace, we have just as many or more that hate grace, and hold on to their works as faith.

    A person could write a history of doctrine as a history of the Pauline reactions in the Church, and in doing so would touch on all the turning-points of the history. Marcion after the Apostolic Fathers, Irenaeus, and Clement and Origen after the Apologists.... Augustine …after the Fathers of the Greek Church... the great Reformers of the middle ages ..... Agobard to Wessel in the bosom of the mediaeval Church.... Luther after the Scholastics.....Jansenism after the council of Trent:—everywhere this doctinre is found, historical turning points will be found as well.

    This now is called Calvinism. And today, you hate it or love it. That is the way it has always been, and always will be.
     
  15. ReformedBaptist

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    I got it lol :laugh:
     
  16. David Lamb

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    That's just the point. Many who believe the "Doctrines of Grace" do not call themselves Calvinists. Others call them that. As I see it, no one can be a baptist, and at the same time follow Calvin in all his teachings. Calvin believed in paedobaptism, and his understanding of the separation between church and state was far removed from what baptists believe. So there are plenty of people who are called "Calvinists" but who do not follow Calvin in everything.
     
  17. donnA

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    Because they follow the biblical teaching thats been named calvinism.
     
  18. Brother Bob

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    I thought we were supposed to following the bibical teaching that is called "Gospel", from Jesus Christ.

    I wonder why the other was called Calvinism, as if I did not know. If no Calvinist will say it, I will say it for you, because of John Calvin and the TULIP.
     
  19. ReformedBaptist

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    Bob, Bob, Bob....

    The elect of God were first called Christians in Antioch. Did this mean that those who were formally called Disciples or The Way, ceased to be followers of Jesus somehow? Of course not. In later years we have been called Separatists, Bible-believers, et.

    If someone says they are a Bible-believer, does that mean they believe in a book and not Jesus Christ? That would be silly now wouldn't it.

    We teach and preach the grace of God in truth, and others have called us calvinists. What is that to me?
     
  20. Brother Bob

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    Surely you see the difference of being called a Christian, which is (Christ like) and being called Calvinist, which is (Calvin like)?
    That is not a good analogy RB.
     

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