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Can a christian doubt his salvation OR fail to get saved?

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by xdisciplex, Jun 5, 2008.

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  1. pinoybaptist

    pinoybaptist Active Member
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    I haven't read the clip.
    My answer is to what the OP states: Can A Christian Doubt His Salvation or Fail to Get Saved ?

    There are two parts to the question.

    First part: Can a Christian doubt his salvation ?

    Yes. If he bases it on feelings, his actions, his failures, his accomplishments, his outlooks, then the Christian will absolutely doubt his salvation.

    I have doubted my salvation many times, and have doubted the salvation of other people many times.

    I get into a situation where I'm caught between a rock and a hard place, and squeeze out of it, and I doubt my salvation.
    I get into a situation where the old habit of spouting expletives, and letting my temper get the better of me and whoosshh flies the fist, and I doubt my salvation.
    I get into a situation where I can't help but look twice at that shapely, lovely pair of legs that just went past, and I doubt my salvation.
    I get too lazy to open my Bible and read it, or to kneel down for prayers, and I doubt my salvation.
    I turn on my tv and stay glued on it for hours, and I doubt my salvation.
    I do not know my Scriptures, and I doubt my salvation.
    I feel no compassion, at all, for somebody, and I doubt my salvation.
    I, me, my, mine, causes me to doubt my salvation.

    Part number 2: Or fail to get saved ?

    Yeah. Somebody can fail to get saved.
    If he's banking on some silly prayer to get him saved.
    If he's banking on his own flimsy, brittle understanding of his salvation.
    If he's thinking his salvation should automatically result in saintly conduct and a saintly life, without instructions.
    A lot of other things can cause one to fail to be saved.

    Having answered that, let me say that when I start to doubt my salvation, I think back and remember these:

    CHRIST is the Son of God who came from Heaven to put on human form, not silly old me.

    CHRIST is the One who pleased God, and had full faith in the Father, and who shed His blood on the cross as the price for redemption of His people, not silly old me.

    CHRIST is God, not silly old me.

    CHRIST is the One whom the Holy Spirit raised from the dead, as a sure sign that He is the Messiah from God, not silly old me.

    CHRIST is the One who is currently seated at the right hand of God, not silly old me.

    CHRIST is the One who authored eternal salvation, not silly old me.

    My life is hid IN CHRIST, not Christ's hid in mine.

    The word CHRIST means the Annointed One, the words pinoybaptist mean nothing.

    The Bible says "looking unto Jesus", not looking unto silly old me.

    Put your focus on Christ, and everything else will come into focus.
     
    #21 pinoybaptist, Jun 6, 2008
  2. xdisciplex

    xdisciplex New Member

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    @ David

    But then how can a christian know if he has the real faith and not also only intellectual understanding? This only transfers the whole problem to the question:

    Do I have the right faith?

    And then the whole questioning starts all over. Then how can a person know if she really has faith or if she only has a head knowledge?

    This man wanted to get saved otherwise he would not have went to church. He had heard the gospel and then Washer asked him if he understands it and he said yes. He obviously wanted to become saved otherwise he would not even have done all this but in spite of this he couldn't just get saved right away and first of all he had to struggle for whatever you call it wether it was faith or a revelation or whatever. And this struggling is exactly the problem. If you can sincerely want to get saved and still not be able to get saved because you "only" have intellectual understanding and no real faith then this once again means that getting saved is not easy and that you may want to get saved and still not be able to.
    Then what do you say to a person which has a knife in the back and 2 minutes to live? What do you say if the person wants to get saved and she doesn't have to time to go through the bible for hours to wait for the real faith to come?
    Is the will to get saved not sufficient? Or would an atheist also want to get saved when he's dying and still not get saved because he doesn't have faith?

    ps: Washer has many sermons at sermonaudio.com

    @ Bob Dudley

    I have studied acts about getting saved and repentance and in some ocassions Paul or Peter only said to have faith like for example to the guard in the prison or to Cornelius and his followers but on other ocassions they required repentance. To me it did not become clear wether you only have to believe or wether you also have to repent and what's also not clear is what repentance means. Do they mean repenting from sins and being willing to stop sinning or to try to stop sinning or do they mean turning to Jesus when they say repent. So many questions....

    @ pinoybaptist

    I think this would not work for me. I mean when I feel insufficient or when I feel like I am not saved because I behave not like a christian or because I do not have enough love then looking to Jesus doesn't help me because I don't even know if I belong to Him. If I should not be saved then looking to Jesus doesn't get me saved.
     
    #22 xdisciplex, Jun 6, 2008
  3. pinoybaptist

    pinoybaptist Active Member
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    if you can frankly say that you think looking unto Jesus is not going to work for you, then I can boldly say I think npthing else will work for you. in fact, I can perhaps say you don't really know Jesus, or maybe Jesus doesn't really know you. I realize it sounds cruel, but I need to be honest with you.

    As for the man in the story with Washer, no one can want himself saved. by the way, eternal salvation is all OF God, none of man. go figure.
     
    #23 pinoybaptist, Jun 6, 2008
  4. FriendofSpurgeon

    FriendofSpurgeon Well-Known Member
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    No, don't think so.
     
    #24 FriendofSpurgeon, Jun 6, 2008
  5. CarpentersApprentice

    CarpentersApprentice New Member

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    Washer never does clearly tie the illustration of the big man back in with the close of his sermon. The way the illustration ended - with the man reading John 3:16 again and then, in an animated fashion, exclaiming "I'm saved! I'm saved! Haven't you ever read this text before! God, I'm saved!" - could be understood that it was a feeling that confirmed his faith.

    However, in the video nothing is said about "feelings." The man Washer spoke to said, "I understand, but that's all... There is no change wrought in me." From what Washer says toward the end of the clip it is evident that the "change wrought" is about repentence and belief in Jesus, not emotions.

    "How do you know you are saved?," Washer says. "Your life has changed and is changing. Salvation is not a flu shot (whether infant baptism, or "praying a prayer"). The evidence that you truly repented long ago when you said you did is because you're still repenting now and even to a greater degree. The evidence that you believed a long time ago is that you are still believing now and even more believing in greater and greater degrees."

    "You cannot be saved," Washer says, "because you have no repentence (but, if) your attitude toward that sin about which you once boasted has totally changed and you hate it and you are ashamed, you can be saved."

    Perhaps that was the "change wrought" in the man. He was ashamed of, and hated, his sin.

    CA
     
    #25 CarpentersApprentice, Jun 7, 2008
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