children's Church

Discussion in '2003 Archive' started by TurboMike, Mar 6, 2003.

  1. TurboMike

    TurboMike
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  2. UnashamedYouth

    UnashamedYouth
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    my pastor's idea of children's church is doing a 10 minute kids sermon where all the kids come up onto the front of the stage(ie the Altar) and they gather around him and he preaches to them in "their language"

    it's working really well
     
  3. MissAbbyIFBaptist

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    We used to have a childrens church. We don't have many kids now, though. THe kids then are now the youth, and mostly we have very little babies and toddlers.
    We always had a lesson and such, but I don't remeber much about it. We stopped having it when I was five. That was about ten years ago.
    Good luck to ya'll. [​IMG]
    ~Abby
     
  4. Mark Osgatharp

    Mark Osgatharp
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    The best thing to do would be not have a "children's church."

    For one thing, to speak of a "children's church" is a total misuse of the term "church" which is one of the most important Biblical concepts. A "children's church" is no more Biblical than a "universal church," a "Catholic church," or a "TV church."

    Furthermore, I would venture to say that the demand for a "children's church" usually stems from children's behavioral problems in the worship services. The solution to this problem is for parents to get control of their children, not to devise an extra-biblical entity. "Children's church" is just another attempt to treat the symptoms rather than the problem.

    Mark Osgatharp
     
  5. Pastor Larry

    Pastor Larry
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    Mark,

    I disagree. I can't see anything unbiblical about children's church. (Of course, the universal church is a scriptural teaching so that would be a bad comparison.) The children's is not an extra-biblical activity. It is a part of the church's responsibility to minister to the whole body of Christ, not just the adults.

    Children's church is a place to teach kids, on their level. Face the facts: the worst thing about kids sitting in church is not their behavior. It is about the fact that they learn that church is boring, that it's a good time for a nap or a good time to draw. They learn this because it is way above them. You don't expect your six year olds to sit through a college level physics class for a good reason. Use some common sense here.

    Realize as well that many parents don't come with their kids to church. So parent's getting control of their kids is not the issue.

    What churches need to do is take a vital interest in this ministry, and make it church, not an entertainment time. I have a wonderful couple heading ours up. It is church for little kids. They do everything we do in the adult service but they do it on a level for children. The intent is that when they get in jr. hi., they are well prepared.

    Children need teaching from God just as much as adults do. If your children's church is bad, get a hold of it and make it work properly.
     
  6. Sherrie

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    I agree with Pastor Larry!

    Sherrie
     
  7. Mark Osgatharp

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    Pastor Larry,

    You said,

    "It is church for little kids. They do everything we do in the adult service but they do it on a level for children."

    They do? Do they ordain pastors and deacons, send missionaries, and collect offerings? Do they take the Lord's supper and administer baptism? Do the women keep silent in this little children's church?

    Do you have to be saved to be a member of this little children's church or is it a mixed multitude?

    If they are hungry do they eat at home, or do they break out the cookies and koolaid?

    There are too many unanswered questions about this newly come up church for me to acknowledge it as a New Testament church.

    Mark Osgatharp
     
  8. SaggyWoman

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    On this point only do I agree with Mark.

    Parents need to get a grip.
     
  9. SaggyWoman

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    If church is boring for children, maybe it is for the adults, too.

    If youth struggle with sitting through there, either there is a relationship with God problem with that youth, or church IS boring.

    This is not to knock Children's Church.
     
  10. SaggyWoman

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    By all means, yes.

    And break out the cookies and koolaid.

    We usually eat chicken in the adult worship.
     
  11. SaggyWoman

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    And by the way, TurboMike, is Faith Weaver a Group Product? It looks like it is. I would be wary of how shallow Group publishing activities for children and Bible Study for children can be.
     
  12. go2church

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    Mark, relax it is only to help children learn inportant truths on thier level. It is hard enough to reach the adult age groups that attend church, muchless trying to get to those who can't even read yet.

    I would highly recommend Child Evangelism Press out of Missouri, very good stuff, not to expensivy and it is not dated so it can be used over and over saving even more money
     
  13. Ben W

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    We used to use the "Bill Wilson Power Toolbox" to run our Childrens Church. It was very effective and I think some of the leadership enjoyed the lessons as much as the children. :D
     
  14. Pastor Larry

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    They are not a separate church. They are part of our church.

    Yes.

     
  15. Pastor Larry

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    Surely you are not denying that adults and children have different attention spans, different understanding levels, etc.

    I totally disagree. I remember growing up in elementary I was getting in trouble, not because the class was necessarily boring but because I was ahead of the class I was in. There was nothing mentally challenging for me. So I was constantly reading other things, looking around bored, etc. The class was fine. It just wasn't where I was.

    The same is true in reverse. Can you imagine how bored you would be in children's church? I would be bored stiff, not because it's not good stuff for them, but because it is not on an adult level.

    We recently overhauled our children's church ministry about 4 months ago and there is a decided improvement in behavior and relationships among teh children. They are quieter, they are better behaved.

    While I agree that parent's need to get a grip on their children, most of the children in my church come without their parents (not because we run a bus but because parent's drop them off or the kids walk. In fact since the recent overhauled our children's church attendance has almost tripled because the children enjoy it and are learning. You can ask them questions and find out what they are learning down there.)

    While we are trying to reach their parents, we cannot throw the kids out. We have to minister to them to. I think some people think the church is or should be full of perfect families. It is not. The communities that we live and minister in are not that way. We have to work where we are at, and take people from whereever they are to the next step, whatever that is.
     
  16. Mark Osgatharp

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    Saggy,

    Howdy! It's been a long time. I haven't talked to you since I was run out of the BMA forum.

    You said,

    "We usually eat chicken in the adult worship."

    Certainly not! I've never been to a church where they ate anything in the worship service other than the elements of the Lord's supper. Now I've seen plenty of chicken eaten at pot-luck after church had dismissed, but that is a whole different matter.

    If you really are eating chicken in the worship service, which I doubt, you need to stop because the Bible plainly forbids eating when the church is assembled for worship and pronounces some severe judgment on those who do so:

    "And if any man hunger, let him eat at home; that ye come not together unto condemnation."

    Mark Osgatharp
     
  17. Sherrie

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    This scripture is talking about all the rich people in the church having a dinner at that time, and they were excluding the poor people. They were eating in front of them. And instead of inviting the poor to eat with them, they were inviting more rich.

    This scripture has nothing to do with eating in a sanctuary.

    Tho it would seem disrespectful, because you are there to worship, not eat. Eat before or after.
    When worshipping, your time should be devoted to just that, worshipping.

    Sherrie
     
  18. Mark Osgatharp

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    PastorLarry,

    You said that your children's church does not ordain pastors and deacons because,

    "They are not a separate church. They are part of our church."

    Then you are dividing the worship of Christ's body by separating part of it at the most important hour - when the body is assembled for worship.

    You said,

    "Like any other local body, it is mixed. The kids are both taught doctrine and evangelized."

    The Lord's body is not a mixed multitude - it is a spiritual body whose members are saved and baptized. I do not mean to say that unbelievers should not be welcome to attend the assembly of Christ's body. I do mean to say that they are not members of the body.

    My question is, does this children's church have a membership? Do they receive and dismiss members? Do they excommunicate those who become involved in immorality? Do they grant letters of recommendation when members leave to go to a different "children's church."

    If it is, indeed, a New Testament church, then it must function as one. If not, you ought not call it a church any more than a media preacher ought to call his radio program a "Church of the Airways" or any such God dishonoring thing.


    Mark Osgatharp
     
  19. Thankful

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    I agree with Pastor Larry on this one.

    Children need to be taught on their level.

    It is not a separate church and perhaps should be called children's worship, bible study, etc.

    I believe the person who started this thread wanted advice on the subject matter of children's worship, not should he have children's worship.

    I think it would be hard for me to sit still through a service where I didn't understand what was being said. Children have very short attention spans. They cannot sit still as long as most adults.

    Oh and in our church the children contribute money and time to missions.

    We also have a children's bulletin in our church.
     
  20. Terry_Herrington

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    Mark,
    In reading your posts on this issue, it came to mind how much you sound like Peter in Acts chapter 10. Just because there is no mention of a "children's church" in the New Testament, does not mean that it is wrong.
     

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