Christian Magic

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Salty, Nov 8, 2009.

  1. Salty

    Salty
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    What are your thoughts about Christian "Majic"

    Would you have a Christian magician come to your church.

    Would you say that having this kind of progam can properly present the Gospel of Christ.?

    Salty
     
  2. tinytim

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    You mean illusions....? I have no problem.. I have done some myself...

    My favorite is my burning bible trick... I read about Hell, and the Bible catches fire...
    (But don't worry, it is only an illusion... I am not that goofball that ACTUALLY burns bibles)

    Of course my wife likes my disappearing trick.. this happens everytime I open my mouth.
     
    #2 tinytim, Nov 8, 2009
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  3. Salty

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    I hear you are pretty good at disappearing! :smilewinkgrin:
     
  4. Tom Butler

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    Nothing wrong with Christian magic that has a gospel message. As long as it's not real magic. I used to be pretty good with Chinese linking rings, and some card magic. Drove my family crazing practicing on them.
     
  5. dh1948

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    One of my sons and his wife perform illusions and do a very good job at using them to convey the gospel.
     
  6. thegospelgeek

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    I like it as long as they explain that it is an illusion and not magic. Especially when they demonstrate how a trick or two is done. That makes it clear to the children that it is not magic.
     
  7. Johnv

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    You mean "magic"? There's no problem with it whatsoever.
    I'd allow a magician in, regardless of his/her religious affiliation.
    I can't see how it would have any effect on the gospel.

    BTW, there's no such thing as "real" magic. Anyone who claims to have real powers is a fake. No illusionist, including Chriss Angel, David Copperfield, or Steve Martin, ever make the claim that their tricks are in any way supernatural or paranormal.
     
    #7 Johnv, Nov 9, 2009
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  8. Victorious

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    No problem

    I wouldn't call it magic, but illusion. My son began to learn from the local magician when he was young and even participated in charity events in his teens - the Salvation Army, for one.

    Nothing supernatural about it.
     
  9. Marcia

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    Stage magic is illusion and skill.

    Occult magic (sometimes spelled "magick") is ritual or ceremonial magick and involves calling on deities, spirits, and/or forces through incantations and other techniques. This type has a spiritual element to it which is totally evil, and is actually sorcery, though those who do it usually do no use that word. Sorcery is also a broader category than occult magic.

    Stage magic and tricks is totally separate from the occult magic.
     
  10. thegospelgeek

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    Not to derail the thread but,

    I know Marcia is up on this subject and want to ask, does drug use fall under the broad category of occult magic? I headr it said that the words used in the bible include drug usages. Is that true?
     
  11. Salty

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    I don't think that is derailing (my) thread. I'm glad you brought it up. Could be an interesting connection.

    Salty

    ps - did I mention I am a magician - I can make food disappear! :laugh:
     
  12. Marcia

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    Yes, the term pharmacopeia (sp?) which is the Greek word found in the Greek translation of the OT and is also in the NT means the use of drugs for occult purposes. This was probably for contacting spirits, the dead, or possibly mixtures (potions) for spells. All of this is done today - just look at peyote. Also, in animistic/shamanistic cultures, the shaman (once called the witch doctor) takes drugs to contact the spirit world, usually to get advice or guidance on healing and other issues. Witches today in the U.S. use "magical potions" for healing and spells.

    Not everyone in the occult uses drugs, however. Only those who do the ritual magic and spells tend to do this, and not even all of them do (in this culture).

    This use of drugs does not refer to the drugs your doctor gives you nor does it refer to people who get on drugs like heroin or cocaine. It's specifically the use of drugs (keep in mind that herbs are drugs) for a magical "working" or for spirit contact.
     
    #12 Marcia, Nov 12, 2009
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  13. Johnv

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    True.
    There's no such thing as sorcery. It's likewise an illusion. People who engage in sorcery think they're conjuring up something real, but there's no such thing.
    But they're both fake.
     
  14. Marcia

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    Yes, John there is such a thing as sorcery. God even refers to it in the Bible.

    I am not saying that people who do these things actually do what they think they are doing, but they usually are in contact with demons (not always knowingly, though in some ceremonial magick, they purposely call up demons thinking they can control them) and the demons do things. It is not always fake.

    I am an expert in this area and have written a book on it, and I engaged in the supernatural (though not doing magick). I have more stories than I can tell of supernatural things that happened through the occult, to me and to others.
     
  15. Salty

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    Marcia,

    What is the name of the book, and how can we obtain a copy?
     
  16. Marcia

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    Thanks for asking!

    It's SpellBound: The Paranormal Seduction of Today's Kids. It came out in 2006 from Cook in Colorado Springs. The Foreword is by Norman Geisler.. It's selling pretty inexpensively on CBD at www.christianbook.com. There are 3 good reviews of it there.

    You can also get it from Amazon marketplace sellers (I don't think Amazon is selling it anymore - they did but ran out). PTL, I've been on a lot of radio shows on this book and on this topic - I did 10 radio interviews Halloween week and 3 more since then!

    You can also get the book at numerous other bookstore outlets online. Just google it but use the whole title or put my name in there as there are numerous books with the word "Spellbound" in the title. :)

    I have a list of the chapters on my website here, with some comments.
    http://christiananswersforthenewage.org/AboutCANA_SpellBound.html

    Thanks again, Salty!
     
  17. HankD

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    The following verses use the Koine word (pharmakeia), or one of it's derivatives:

    From the Friberg Greek Lexicon

    Galatians 5:20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,​

    Revelation 9:21 Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts.​

    Revelation 18:23 And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived.​

    HankD
     
  18. fixit3546

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    It has been a long while since i read up on magic but as i remember from a booklet on the occult, magick comes in two forms.

    Black magick which is the dark magick and is inherently evil.

    white magick which is the good magick and is used for good. (it is deceptive)

    the problem is that in either form; it is satanic and of the occult. which is why i have a real problem with harry potter.

    Of course we also have our garden variety "magic" which is simply illusion, and harmless.

    I personally don't have a problem with "magic" as long as it is known that it is just illusion.

    where i have a problem is with the big shows that even though we know they are just illusion, they have the appearance if something supernatural happening. some people believe because of the appearance.

    It is kind of like so called christian rock music. some of it, even though they may sing the right words and touch the hearts of the youth, some of it looks purely evil. where do you draw the like on "fitting in with the world". BTW, i'm not attacking all christian "rock music" just that with the strange look, smoke-explosions-wicked looking makeup and costumes-voices that sound like deamons speaking.

    How do you feel about harry potter???
     
  19. thegospelgeek

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    Not sure how you can read a Bible and say this? What do you base your statement on and how do you explain scripture that reference such things?
     
  20. thegospelgeek

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    I am a big fan of Contemporary music and much Christian rock. I too have a problem with some of the performers. I think we know when something is over the line, although I can't explain exactly what it is.

    Not crazy about Harry Potter, I've never read any of the books and have only seen part of one of the movies. I'll defer to Marcia for advice. She knows way more about the subject than I do.
     

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