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Confederate Flag Display

Discussion in 'Polls Forum' started by SaggyWoman, Dec 26, 2004.

  1. Singing Cop

    Singing Cop <img src=/5667.jpg>

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    I don't own one now but I use to hang a bandana that had one on it in the rear window of my 73 Ford pickup when I was a VERY young wannabe redneck...(Can you believe it?) But for me the flag means something to me other then what it does for most people. I have ancestors who fought and died in both sides of the war. My great great great grandfather was an MD who was a POW and scheduled to be executed in St. Louis due to a paperwork mixup. It was all worked out and he was not executed and later was involved in a POW trade. Seven union soldiers were also executed on his property - Curtman Island, in Miller County. About 8 years ago I found the island and the spot where they were executed and I also found their graves in another town. The flag to me is a reminder of my heratige on both sides...nothing more and nothing less.
     
  2. blackbird

    blackbird Active Member

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    Now, I know we have the "freedom" to fly what we want---including flags of "Phantom" nations---but let me ask a question

    Suppose the Confeds would have won??? Do you suppose the freedom to fly the "Stars and Stripes" today would have been a "guarantee" in that particular constitution back then?? Could your so called Confederate States of America---give me a constitutional right to fly my Stars and Stripes---even as a flag of "reminder of heritage??"
     
  3. Singing Cop

    Singing Cop <img src=/5667.jpg>

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    I personally believe that they would have...but I also believe that would have been up to the state more then it would have been up to the Confederacy. One thing to also consider is that if the Confederacy were around today there would probably be at least one state if not more where any type of abortion at any term would probably be prohibited!....least I'd like to think so...they definitely would have had the power to do so!
     
  4. Rachel

    Rachel New Member

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    Neither is the confederate flag. It's part of the history of the proud South. </font>[/QUOTE]Is the swastika a part of the history of a proud Germany? </font>[/QUOTE]Are you seriously comparing the two?? Are you comparing the old South to the Natzi's?? (sp?)
    I don't think they are anything alike at all!!
    I don't agree with slavery though.

    Rachel
     
  5. NaasPreacher (C4K)

    NaasPreacher (C4K) Well-Known Member

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    Just a simple question.
     
  6. Rachel

    Rachel New Member

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    I don't know too much about German history. Don't American indians use that same symbol for something? Did Germany have that symbol prior to Hitler's evil reign? If so did that stand for something else before him and he perverted it? Or did Hitler make that part of his agenda for evil? I always have attributed it to Hitler and his followers and didn't consider it part of the history of a proud Germany. I don't know, I never really looked into it.

    Rachel
     
  7. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    "I hold it that a little rebellion now and then is a good thing, and as necessary in the political world as storms in the physical. Unsuccessful rebellions, indeed, generally establish the encroachments on the rights of the people which have produced them. An observation of this truth should render honest republican governors so mild in their punishment of rebellions as not to discourage them too much. It is a medicine necessary for the sound health of government." - Thomas Jefferson
     
  8. just-want-peace

    just-want-peace Well-Known Member
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    One thing I believe w/o a doubt. There would be no BLOATED federal beauracrecy like we have now!
     
  9. Debby in Philly

    Debby in Philly Active Member

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    Part of the history? Yes.
    Are we proud of it? NO
    It should serve as a lesson of what not to fall prey to ever again. Kind of like that other flag you're talking about.
     
  10. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    My problem with the "Stars and Bars" is not its relationship with the War Between the States. It is its appropriation by rebelious, lawless, dare I say muderous individuals who refused to apply the protections of the US Constitution to all Americans. As a person who interperts his Constitution like he intereperts his Bible, the 14th Amendment is fairly clear in its wording. Don't even get me started on lynching and the race riots.

    If it weren't for the later I'd be willing to treat the flags of the Confederacy like the Jacobite flags and symbols.

    [ December 27, 2004, 06:56 PM: Message edited by: Squire Robertsson ]
     
  11. MaineGospel

    MaineGospel New Member

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    No Way!

    A Yank
     
  12. blackbird

    blackbird Active Member

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    Just wants peace says, "One thing I believe without a doubt. There would be no BLOATED federal beauracrecy like we have now!"

    Is that beyond a "Shadow" of a doubt, Peace?????
     
  13. Rachel

    Rachel New Member

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    Not everyone in the South acted like that! Were the Northerners even close to perfect?

    Boy a few years ago I would have really lost it reading some of these posts. God has really been working on me.
     
  14. rsr

    rsr <b> 7,000 posts club</b>
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    Rachel said:

    "Don't American indians use that same symbol for something? Did Germany have that symbol prior to Hitler's evil reign? If so did that stand for something else before him and he perverted it?"

    Swastikas, of various designs, have been used by peoples all around the world as symbols of good luck, probably because they are fairly simple geometric shapes.

    Swastikas became popular in Germany in the late 1800s — having been picked up from Nordic mythology — and also found favaor with the Nazis because of their use by the Aryans (Indians.)

    Several Native American peoples used the swastika. The 45th Infantry Division of the Army National Guard originally used a swastika as its division patch; that was replaced by another Native American symbol, the thunderbird, in 1939 because of the swastika's fascist connotations.
     
  15. gb93433

    gb93433 Active Member
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    Some still cannot succumb to the past.
     
  16. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    No the North is not blameless on the matter nor even my home town of San Francisco. This was brought into the light in the 50s when the Giants moved to the City from NYC. Willie Mays wanted to buy a house in St. Francis Woods, one of SF's tonier neighborhoods. However, due to deed restrictions (which is how segreation was practiced out here), he initially was unable to. As for "not all Southerners", yes and there were violent race riots in Chicago and other northern cities. However nothing on the scale of Tulsa, Oklahoma and Roseville, Florida. And the lynchings showed (in my opinion) a blatent disregard for the rights of American citizens to be protected by the law. However, it boils down to how you view the responsiblities of an American government towards its citizens (I thought Appomatox and the 14th Amendment settled the matter). And if you view Negro\Colored\Black\African-Americans as citizens worthy of the full protection of the law. Not just now in 2004 but also in 1904. I for one believe the Supreme Court got Plessy wrong just as they got Roe wrong.
    Not everyone in the South acted like that! Were the Northerners even close to perfect?

    Boy a few years ago I would have really lost it reading some of these posts. God has really been working on me.
    </font>[/QUOTE]

    [ December 28, 2004, 10:46 AM: Message edited by: Squire Robertsson ]
     
  17. Carolina Baptist

    Carolina Baptist Active Member

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    Most who fly a confederate flag opt for the one that was commonly used as a battle flag. It represents a time in our nations history during which Americans took up arms and killed each other. We need to remember our history, but that war has been over for 159 years.
    I have been from Florida to Alaska to California to Maine (haven't made it to Hawaii ... yet). Every where I go I meet fellow Americans. Our common ground is the national unity represented by the Stars and Stripes.
     
  18. just-want-peace

    just-want-peace Well-Known Member
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    Yep!!

    Simply because the "States Rights " issue would have prevailed, WITH the right of secession.

    Now I'm not saying that the Fed would have been perfect, but the states would have had a redress capability that is non-existant now!

    Therefore, although the Fed may have gotten power beyond the "constitutional" limits, it would not be the bloated monster that now exists.

    But then again, some slick-tongued politician could have persuaded the masses that their safety was totally dependent on him (politician), & we could have just as big of a mess as now!?

    So who knows?

    That's one (of about 10 zillion) question I have when I get to Heaven; "What if--?" [​IMG]
     
  19. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    In all this discussion, I believe one facet of my position has been lost in the shuffle. Those that fought and died under the Stars and Bars were for the most part honorable men. It is not their fault the flags they fought and died under were hijacked by those with less honorable motives.
     
  20. Bro. James Reed

    Bro. James Reed New Member

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    Agreed.

    I would say there were no more racists in the Confederate army than in the Union army. Most people back then were racist to some extent.

    However, regardless of what people might say about the reason behind the war, states' rights or slavery, the men who fought for the Confederacy did so in defense of their homes and their states. Your state defined who you were more than your country. Kind of like how most Texans feel today, which is why many people say we are stuck-up.

    Anyway, racist groups such as the KKK, neo-Nazis, Aryan Brotherhood, etc, have taken the flag fought bravely under by those home-defenders and turned it into a despised, hated rag looked upon as being the symbol of hate and racism by many people.

    The flag was what joined the several southern states together, and was looked on as a symbol of southern unity rather than as the symbol of racism that people use it for today.

    Besides, if we are going to hate a flag just because racist groups use them, then you must also look upon the Christian flag and the US flag with disdain as both are used by the KKK and other groups.

    Yes, BTW, I do have a Confederate battle flag hanging in my room. It's right next to the Stars and Stripes on the other wall.

    I also have a picture of the tattered Confederate flag that my g-g-g-grandfather served under as my desktop picture. (34th Alabama Infantry)
     
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