Controversy in the SBC State Conventions

Discussion in '2003 Archive' started by J.R. Graves, Sep 5, 2003.

  1. J.R. Graves

    J.R. Graves
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    Just curious, but with regard to the Southern Baptist Conservative Resurgence / Fundamentalist Takeover, what is the situation in the various Southern Baptist State conventions? Is the battle still raging in the states? I know that conservatives have broken away to form their own convention in Virginia and Texas, but what about Tennessee, Arkansas, Georgia, or Kentucky? Which sate conventions are solidly in the conservative camp and which are solidly in the moderate camp? I am not asking this question to stir up a debate, but only for informational stake.
     
  2. go2church

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    Generally speaking the SBC state conventions are all in the SBC camp. Texas, Virgina and North Carolina are what I would consider moderate friendly. Smaller conventions dependent on funding from North American Missions Board don't really have a choice if they want to keep the money coming. As you have stated already the SBC backers have started their own conventions in Texas and Virgina so they don't have to deal with those who would dare question their precieved authority. There are groups such as Mainstream Baptists, Baptist Committed and the Cooperative Baptist Fellowship that moderates have found a home so to speak. There is still fussing over foreign missions, but groups within Texas and the CBF have given moderate baptists and alternative to fund foreign missions through.
     
  3. rsr

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    There is a fledgling breakaway convention in Missouri; it wanted to contribute to the Cooperative Program, but the SBC declined.
     
  4. gb93433

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    I would say that the majority of SBC people who attend church week after week and so many pastors are really tired of the SBC dilemma. Many of them want to serve God and are tired or all the politics. An article at http://www.lifeway.com/lwc/article_main_page/0%2C1703%2CA%253D150897%2526M%253D200005%2C00.html

    states, "Freddie Gage holds conferences for wounded ministers. He stated that 6,000 Southern Baptist pastors leave their ministries each year. Over 200 pastors are fired each month."
     
  5. Hardsheller

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    I don't believe there's much correlation between Freddie Gage's ministry and the problems in the SBC.
     
  6. Hardsheller

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    Fledgling is a good word for it. That turkey is having trouble getting off the ground. :D
     
  7. go2church

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    Isn't there a double standard by the SBC? They will help start other conventions in other states but take steps to block progress of those wishing to do the exact same thing that themselves have done.
     
  8. Dr. Bob

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    Why would the SBC want to help those who are "not on the same page" as they are? Evidently I'm missing something here.

    If I am going to work with missions, church planting or even a state fellowship, it will be with people with whom I am in basic agreement.
     
  9. rsr

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    You'd have to ask the SBC. Evidently, support from the major state conventions in Texas and Virginia is OK because there's so much of it; the new convention in Missouri can't bring much to the table.
     
  10. gb93433

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    I don't believe there's much correlation between Freddie Gage's ministry and the problems in the SBC. </font>[/QUOTE]Perhaps not, but there must be a correlation between 6000 pastors leaving the SBC and 40,000 SBC churches. That is almost 1 out of 7 churches where pastors are leaving. Let's face it pastors don't leave because they are incredibly blessed beyond their comprehension through the convention.

    I doubt that you read the article by the way you responded. It was on lifeway.com's website. Lifeway is the SBC publishing company.
     
  11. Bible-boy

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    That article is talking about pastors leaving the ministry due to being overwhelmed, experiencing ministry burn out, being caught in moral failures, etc. These things have nothing to do with being in a SBC church. These types of problems reach across all denominational lines. [​IMG]

    What are you trying to get at with your reference to 40,000 SBC? :confused: It looks to me as if you are grasping at straws in a very weak attempt to paint the SBC in a poor light. :rolleyes:
     
  12. Hardsheller

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    I did read the article.

    The cause of so many pastors leaving SBC churches has more to do with the Pastors and the Churches themselves than with Convention Politics.

    Let's face it - a large percentage of SBC Seminary Graduates who go into the pastoral ministry never retire in Ministry but leave the ministry for secular work.

    Some are forced out because it's their fault.
    Some are forced out because it's the church's fault.

    Some simply give up because it's hard.
    Some experience moral failure.
    Some are quitting because of denominational strife.

    But I don't think anyone can legitimately say the Convention Strife is the major cause of pastoral turnover in the SBC.
     
  13. Hardsheller

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    A further note - Pastoral Ministry is Changing Rapidly in America. No longer do many churches view the Pastor as their God Called Leader but they view him as an Employee that is expendable.
     
  14. J.R. Graves

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    Hardsheller,

    Can you tell me a little more about the current situation of the controversy in Missouri? Do conservatives or moderates control the Southern Baptist Colleges there? Is the state paper solidly in conservative hands now? At this year's state convention will conservatives control the meeting?

    Thanks,
     
  15. rsr

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    Last I heard, the Missouri Baptist Convention (the original group) had gone to court to try to overturn the decision of several related entitities — the Baptist Home, Missouri Baptist College, Windermere Baptist Conference Center, the Missouri Baptist Foundation and Word and Way (the state newspaper) — because they had decided to have self-governing boards. William Jewett College also is to be defunded in 2004.

    The MBC now has its own publication, The Pathway.
     
  16. td

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    Plenty of controversy in the Georgia Baptist Convention. There was a movement some years ago to unseat Kirby Godsey as President of Mercer University after his book came out. Some called it heresy. The state paper, The Christian Index, decided not to write stories about or accept ads from CBF-aligned churches. Last year, there was a movement to elect a layman as President of the convention (it failed), and Shorter College voted to change its charter and leave the convention altogether. The convention sued them and lost. Surprisingly, Dr. Godsey and the Mercer bunch decided they wanted to remain in the convention. Go figure.
     
  17. Hardsheller

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    RSR has it about right in his post. The conservatives are firmly in control of the State Convention and will run the State Convention for the foreseeable future. The outcome of the court cases will determine who gets the agencies. Either way the Word and Way is not and will never be again the Official Missouri Baptist Convention State Paper.
     
  18. gb93433

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    The number of SBC churches is slightly over 40 thousand.
     
  19. Kaylor

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    I must say that “Hardsheller” is off in his analysis of the situation in Missouri. The new convention (the Baptist General Convention of Missouri) is growing despite the SBC and MBC's attempts to stop it.
    Consider the following: The MBC has laid off nearly 1/3 of its staff this year, while the BGCM has doubled its staff. The MBC's giving is down from last year's, while the BGCM has already collected more than all of last year. The MBC is losing churches and individuals each month to the BGCM. It is still smaller, but even without the support that the new conventions in Texas and Virginia received from the SBC, the BGCM will continue to grow.
     
  20. Hardsheller

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    How many churches in Missouri have aligned themselves solely with the BGCM?

    I'm not asking you how many individuals...I'm asking you how many Mo. Baptist churches have publicly identifed themselves as being singly aligned with the BGCM by congregational vote?
     

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