Curiosity question for Calvinists

Discussion in '2005 Archive' started by Ben Elohim, Feb 26, 2005.

  1. Ben Elohim

    Ben Elohim
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    "For the word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and spirit, of joints and marrow, and discerning the thoughts and intentions of the heart." (Hebrews 4:12).

    Calvinists, what is this verse talking about? What is "the word of God" here specifically and what does it do?
     
  2. Ben Elohim

    Ben Elohim
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    Anyone?
     
  3. Habakkuk

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    BE:
    Calvinists, what is this verse talking about? What is "the word of God" here specifically and what does it do?

    The Word is LIVING and ACTIVE means it will do exactly what God had intended it to do. Those who come in contact with the Word of God will either detest it or love it. Those who walk away from it are condemned already! For the people of God, however, the Word is that which sustains them unto salvation

    1 Pet 2
    2Like newborn infants, long for the pure spiritual milk, that by it you may grow up to salvation-- 3if indeed you have tasted that the Lord is good.

    and confirms them to the image of Christ

    2 Tim 3
    16All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, 17that the man of God may be competent, equipped for every good work.

    Habakkuk
     
  4. Kiffen

    Kiffen
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    Excellent post Habakkuk
     
  5. johnp.

    johnp.
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    Hello Habakkuk it's nice to meet you.

    ISA 55:10 As the rain and the snow
    come down from heaven,
    and do not return to it
    without watering the earth
    and making it bud and flourish,
    so that it yields seed for the sower and bread for the eater,

    ISA 55:11 so is my word that goes out from my mouth:
    It will not return to me empty,
    but will accomplish what I desire
    and achieve the purpose for which I sent it.

    ISA 55:12 You will go out in joy
    and be led forth in peace;
    the mountains and hills
    will burst into song before you,
    and all the trees of the field
    will clap their hands.

    johnp.
     
  6. Ben Elohim

    Ben Elohim
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    The Word being what?
     
  7. Ben Elohim

    Ben Elohim
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    For the Word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart and there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all things are open and laid bare to the eyes of Him with whom we have to do. Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God.

    Habrews 4:12 is not a statement about your Bible. It is about Jesus judging on that Day.
     
  8. johnp.

    johnp.
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    God is always judging. He is Judge. He is Sovereign.

    The word of God is never empty of the Word of God.

    johnp.
     
  9. Kiffen

    Kiffen
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    Well said johnp. Jesus is NOW judging us with His Word and that is the context of Hebrews 4:12. Not really sure what this has to do with Calvinism, Arminianism though.
     
  10. Ben Elohim

    Ben Elohim
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    Therefore, while the promise of entering his rest REMAINS, let us fear lest any of you seem to have failed to reach it. For good news came to us just as to them; but the message which they heard did not benefit them, because it did not meet with faith in the hearers. For we who have believed enter that rest, as he has said, "As I swore in my wrath, "They shall never enter my rest,' " although his works were finished from the foundation of the world. For he has somewhere spoken of the seventh day in this way, "And God rested on the seventh day from all his works." And again in this place he said, "They shall never enter my rest." Since therefore it remains for some to enter it, and those who formerly received the good news failed to enter because of disobedience, again he sets a certain day, "Today," saying through David so long afterward, in the words already quoted, "Today, when you hear his voice, do not harden your hearts." For if Joshua had given them rest, God would not speak later of another day. So then, there remains a sabbath rest for the people of God; for whoever enters God's rest also ceases from his labors as God did from his. Let US therefore strive to enter that rest, that no one fall by the same sort of disobedience. For the Word of God is living and powerful, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and spirit, of joints and marrow, and discerning the thoughts and intentions of the heart and before him no creature is hidden, but all are open and laid bare to the eyes of him with whom we have to do. Since then we have a great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus, the Son of God.

    The Word of God here is a WHO named Jesus who will judge and the preceding warning is about "US" who have believed entering the Sabbath rest and not falling short of it.

    THIS:

    For the Word of God is living and powerful, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and spirit, of joints and marrow, and discerning the thoughts and intentions of the heart and before him no creature is hidden, but all are open and laid bare to the eyes of him with whom we have to do.

    Is the same as THIS:

    while their conscience also bears witness and their conflicting thoughts accuse or perhaps excuse them on that day when, according to my gospel, God judges the secrets of men through Christ Jesus. (Romans 2:15-16).

    And THIS:

    Therefore do not pronounce judgment before the time, before the Lord comes, who will bring to light the things now hidden in darkness and will disclose the intentions of the heart. (1 Corinthians 3:5).

    Let US therefore strive to enter that rest, that no one fall by the same sort of disobedience.

    For the Word of God is living and powerful, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and spirit, of joints and marrow, and discerning the thoughts and intentions of the heart and before him no creature is hidden, but all are open and laid bare to the eyes of him with whom we have to do.

    Since then we have a great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus, the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession.

    Let US remind ourselves of our guarantee of entering that rest and that that we cannot fall by the same sort of disobedience.

    [ March 03, 2005, 11:01 PM: Message edited by: Ben Elohim ]
     
  11. johnp.

    johnp.
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    Ben.

    I have entered His rest. I am in His Sabbath I rest from my works.

    johnp.
     
  12. Ben Elohim

    Ben Elohim
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    I have entered His rest. I am in His Sabbath I rest from my works.

    johnp.
    </font>[/QUOTE]You are sure about that are ya johnp? Did you read the whole passage or just a verse you thought you could conform to TULIP?
     
  13. johnp.

    johnp.
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    Ben.
    Yes, why does it make you jealous? I know my Father's words well. I crossed the Jordon and I am now in the land of milk and honey as promised. I entered His rest and now I rest. It has all been done for me. :cool:

    Why do you ask? :cool:

    johnp.
     
  14. Ben Elohim

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    Maybe you should read this johnp:

    Therefore, let US fear if, while a promise remains of entering His rest, any one of YOU may seem to have come short of it.

    There remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God.

    Therefore let US be diligent to enter that rest, so that no one will fall, through following the same example of disobedience.

    Now before you conspire to contrive on the basis of Heb 4:3, and paint yourself into another corner, read the context again very carefully.

    Start here, see who the writer is speaking to, see why he is saying what he is saying, and read right up to 4:12:

    Therefore, holy brethren, partakers of a heavenly calling, consider Jesus, the Apostle and High Priest of our confession.... (3:1).

    [ March 04, 2005, 01:12 PM: Message edited by: Ben Elohim ]
     
  15. ILUVLIGHT

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    Hi JohnP;
    Is this why you keep quoting scripture that doesn't back you up.
    May Christ Shine His Light On Us All;
    Mike [​IMG]
     
  16. johnp.

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    Yea Ben a rather brilliant study what?
    Start here, see who the writer is speaking to, see why he is saying what he is saying, and read right up to 4:12:
    Start where? No you tell me what he is saying.

    johnp.
     
  17. johnp.

    johnp.
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    ILUVLIGHT.

    Please support your charge with fact and not just noxious gas.

    johnp.
     

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