Did Jesus share the Passover with His disciples?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by revmwc, Mar 29, 2012.

  1. revmwc

    revmwc
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    Keep in mind the unleavened bread feast was 15 Nisan which would have been a high sabbath, 14 nissan was the passaover a High Sabbath and the 13th would have been the day the lamb was killed. 33 A.D. Jewish calender shows this perfectly. Wednesday the 13 Nisan 33 A.D. started on what is our Tuesday evening at 6:00 ended Wednesday at 6:00 P.M.. This would have been the prepartion day for both feast. Notice "John 19: 14 And it was the preparation of the passover, and about the sixth hour: and he saith unto the Jews, Behold your King!" Pilate speaking to the Jews. So Wednesday evening would have begun the Passover. The evening of His crucifixion they went to the upper room where they planned to have passover the next evening, never does it say they ate the passover meal. Here is John 13:1 "Now before the feast of the passover, when Jesus knew that his hour was come that he should depart out of this world unto the Father, having loved his own which were in the world, he loved them unto the end."
    verse 2 "And supper being ended, the devil having now put into the heart of Judas Iscariot, Simon's son, to betray him;"
    John goes from saying before the feast of passover to saying they were eating supper, not the feast. Matthew 26: 26 "And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed it, and brake it, and gave it to the disciples, and said, Take, eat; this is my body." As they were eating, again no mention of eating the passover. Mark 14:12 "And the first day of unleavened bread, when they killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where wilt thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the passover?" Matthew states the beginning of unleavened bread, the feast itself was on the 15th so the preparation for the two began on the 13th. Mark 14: 18 "And as they sat and did eat, Jesus said, Verily I say unto you, One of you which eateth with me shall betray me." 22 "And as they did eat, Jesus took bread, and blessed, and brake it, and gave to them, and said, Take, eat: this is my body."
    Again no mention of eating the passover meal, they just ate supper.
    Luke 22: 15 And he said unto them, With desire I have desired to eat this passover with you before I suffer:

    16 For I say unto you, I will not any more eat thereof, until it be fulfilled in the kingdom of God.

    He desires to eat it but did he, seems by all the other passages He didn't get to eat it.
    His human desire wanted to but as the other passages show he didn't.
    He tells them He will not be able to eat it.

    19 And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.

    Notice He took bread but the passover feast was a Lamb.

    20 Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you.



    So all this was taking place on the 13th our Tuesday night their Wednesday. Then Pilate examines the Lamb and finds it worthy on Wednesday the day of preparation. He found no fault. Never do we see that they ATE the Passover Feast nor that Christ ate it with them in the upper room.
     
  2. HankD

    HankD
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    Hi revmwc,

    Yes, the account is less than conclusive, most assume He did eat of the actual meal.

    I suppose others would say that He Himself was the Passover Lamb meal (spiritual of course).

    HankD
     
  3. webdog

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    Doesn't the fact we are on the gregorian calendar play into the alleged discrepancies in the actual dates of the crucifixion, resurrection and passover?
     
  4. Tom Butler

    Tom Butler
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    I think you have a point, web.

    By the Gregorian calendar, wouldn't Jesus have been born about 4 BC?
     
  5. webdog

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    I think so.
     
  6. Mexdeaf

    Mexdeaf
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    In short, the northern Jews observed the Passover a day before the southern Jews did because they kept time differently.

    From John MacArthur: (http://www.gty.org/Resources/Sermons/2382)

    Now you say, "Well, what does all this mean?" Listen very carefully. First thing it does is it harmonizes John 18 and 19 because it tells us that Galileans, which would be Jesus and His disciples and the Pharisees, could have their Passover on the evening of Thursday because they already began to count the day from morning to morning and it would end on Friday morning. And the others who were from Judea and who were Sadducees which made up the rulers wouldn't start their day festivities until late on Thursday and wouldn't kill their lamb until the end of the day on Friday.


    Now you say, "Why is that important?" Listen to me. It's odd that it would be like that. It's very odd. And we really can't identify specifically as to how that came to pass. But what fascinates me is this, listen very carefully. Jesus had to die on Friday. He had to be crucified on Friday because that's when the traditional Judean Jerusalem Passover lambs would be killed, from three to five on Friday. He had to die then. That's why it says, "In the ninth hour."



    He also had to keep the Passover because He had to transform it into the Lord's table. So, how could Jesus keep the Passover and still be the Passover lamb? There would be absolutely no way that that could be possible unless God allowed this kind of thing to take place in history so that when it came to the very moment that Jesus was going to die, in that very year, there was no problem in having a Galilean Passover on Thursday night and dying in the Judean Passover on Friday afternoon perfectly on schedule and violating no Jewish law at all.
     
  7. revmwc

    revmwc
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    John 19: 14 And it was the preparation of the passover, and about the sixth hour: and he saith unto the Jews, Behold your King!"

    This verse gives the key it was the preparation of the passover when Jesus stood before Pilate and was presented by Pilate as the Jewish King. Preparation for the passover meal would beging the day befor passover. If we go back to the Jewish calender for 33 A.D. we find that day to be a Wednesday. Thursday the Passover, Friday the feast of unleavened bread, Saturday the regular sabbath, which ended at 6:00P.M. making that Sunday.

    If Christ was on trial on the day of preparation then He could not have observed the Passover with them.

    Then notice this in John 13:1 "Now before the feast of the passover, when Jesus knew that his hour was come that he should depart out of this world unto the Father, having loved his own which were in the world, he loved them unto the end."
    verse 2 "And supper being ended, the devil having now put into the heart of Judas Iscariot, Simon's son, to betray him;"

    Before the passover the supper was ended. Again we see that the Lord's supper instituted was before the passover at supper that night, again if it is before Passover then Christ did not observe the passover for He was in the Grave by 6 P.M. Wednesday when the passover would have started.
     
  8. revmwc

    revmwc
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    But to place it on Friday would mean Jesus was in the grave 1 day Saturday and two nights (FRIDAY) Saturday 6 P.M. to 6 A.M. (Saturday) Sunday 6 P.M. to 6 A.M.

    He sadi He would Matthew 12:Matthew 12:40
    For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

    3 days and 3 nights Jesus said so Friday 6 P.M. the Jews saturday is 1 night, Saturday 6 A.M. 1 day, Saturday the Jews Sunday night 6 P.M. to 6 A.M. 2 nights.
    That would make Jesus a false prophet would it not? He said 3 days and 3 nights. Not a combination of days and nights. The time table doesn't fit.

    That would also make Paul out to be a liar for he said: 1 Corinthians 15:4
    And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

    Christ rose the third day. Paul uses the word "Hemera" which means:
    the day, used of the natural day, or the interval between sunrise and sunset, as distinguished from and contrasted with the night
    in the daytime
    metaph., "the day" is regarded as the time for abstaining from indulgence, vice, crime, because acts of the sort are perpetrated at night and in darkness
    of the civil day, or the space of twenty four hours (thus including the night)
    Eastern usage of this term differs from our western usage.

    Any part of a day is counted as a whole day, hence the expression "three days and three nights" does not mean literally three whole days, but at least one whole day plus part of two other days.


    revmwc:

    Now the discrepancy is usually explained with this definition of days. But notice how this has to work one whole day plus part of two other days, he went to the grave Friday right at 6 P.M. they had to hurry to get Him there that is actually considered Saturday it began at 6 P.M. to 6 P.M. the following is on whole 24 hour period and then Sunday Mornong, Again 1 full day and half of another not one whole day plus part of two days. Jesus also qualified it when He said as Jonas (Jonah) was 3 days and 3 nights, many not just the day as this definition states but it was 3 days and 3 nights and Friday doesn't fit.

    definition contd.
    of the last day of this present age, the day Christ will return from heaven, raise the dead, hold the final judgment, and perfect his kingdom
    used of time in general, i.e. the days of his life.
     
  9. Mexdeaf

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    Well, I'm not going to go around and around on this- it has been discussed ad infinitum here and elsewhere- but here's MacArthur's answer to that:

    Some people have difficulty reconciling what Jesus said in Matthew 12:40 about the length of His stay in the grave: "As Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth." Does that mean Jesus had to be in the earth three full days and nights? No. Many commentators take that view and back the crucifixion to Thursday, so the three days and nights are Thursday, Friday, and Saturday, with His rising on Sunday. The obvious problem with that view is that we are left with a fourth- day resurrection. Yet all the passages in Scripture dealing with this issue indicate He was to rise on the third day. That eliminates the need for interpreting Matthew 12:40 as referring to three 24-hour periods. The phrase "three days and three nights" was simply an idiom of the Jewish people referring to a three-day period.


    For example, if you were to say, "I'm going to San Diego for three days," does that mean you'll be there for three 24-hour periods? Not necessarily. It could mean you'll be there for a few hours one day, all day the next day, and a few hours the third day. That is how Scripture refers to Christ's burial.


    In Luke 24:21 the disciples traveling the road to Emmaus were bemoaning the death of Christ, saying, "We hoped that it had been he who should have redeemed Israel; and, besides all this, today [Sunday] is the third day since these things were done." They understood that the Lord's prophecy of His resurrection wasn't going to take place after three 24-hour periods, but on the third day, which from Friday would be Sunday. After all, Jesus said He would "be killed, and be raised again the third day" (Matt. 16:21). Matthew 17:23 repeats, "They shall kill him, and the third day he shall be raised again." The chronological, historical references to the death of Christ indicate a third-day resurrection, not one following three 24-hour periods. When Jesus referred to three days and three nights, we can conclude He was referring to a part of three 24-hour periods. Rabbi Eleazar ben Azariah (who lived around A.D. 100) said, "A day and night are an Onah [a portion of time] and the portion of an Onah is as the whole of it" (Jerusalem Talmud, Shabbath ix.3; cf. Babylonian Talmud Pesahim 4a).


    http://www.gty.org/resources/study-guides/40-5178/the-resurrection-of-jesus-christ
     
  10. percho

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    I don't think he did either revmwc. There is an article, "Was The Last Supper The Passover Meal", by someone named Bryan T Huie whoever that is. I read it and believe it be accurate per the word of God.
     
  11. percho

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    What if you said, I will be in SD until the third day. And. I will leave SD on the third day. And. I will leave SD after three days. And for the sake of argument let's say the day begin at 6PM and ended twenty fours later at 6Pm

    You arrive in SD Friday at 6PM. You step into the city limits.

    For all three above to be absolutely true when would step back over the city limits??

    To our knowledge did anyone see Jesus walk out of the tomb? Did the posted guard say oh yeah he walked out at such and such watch/hour?
     
    #11 percho, Mar 29, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 29, 2012
  12. HankD

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    Jesus is Lord of all. He told the Pharisees He was/is Lord of the Sabbath.
    It's a safe assumption then that He is Lord of the Passover (a movable holy day).

    In fact He is our Passover.

    1 Corinthians 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:​

    If He wanted to have a special Passover before the one celebrated by the Jews of Jerusalem. So, it's what He wanted?

    HankD
     

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