Do Churches need to hire armed Security guards?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by evangelist6589, Sep 29, 2013.

  1. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589
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    http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/09/2...g-louisiana-church-service/?intcmp=latestnews

    Obviously there was a conflict between the pastor and this demon possessed person at one time, but I have to wonder if it would be wise to have armed security guards. I bet that John MacArthur has them, as well as any major name. Many churches cannot afford them, so what can be done? Just pray and trust God. Does your church have guards?
     
  2. glazer1972

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    No need to hire anyone in some states. Pastors, Deacons or Members with guns and common sense would or could suffice.
     
  3. thisnumbersdisconnected

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    I lived in Colorado when Matthew Murray killed two and wounded two people at an Arvada missions building, and then five hours later killed two outside New Life Church in Colorado Springs.

    I'm pretty sure New Life was glad they hired Jeanne Assam to their security team.

    http://www.foxnews.com/story/2007/1...-had-grudge-against-christian-group-cops-say/

    Do all churches need security? All churches are potential targets. It only makes sense for our worship centers to be prepared, however they see fit to do so.
     
    #3 thisnumbersdisconnected, Sep 29, 2013
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  4. Tom Bryant

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    I think it depends on how big the church is. Probably a very big church would need trained security guards because there are so many ways for a murderer-wannabe to get close to the pastor or staff. The bigger churches would probably have the money to hire a guard.

    Smaller churches need to be aware of the possibility. In our church, we have more people who carry firearms than carry pocket knives.

    But someone who is determined to carry out an attack is very difficult to stop.

    Whoever it is needs to be trained and be aware of the people in the service plus be invisible. After all, pastors have to be in person to person contact with the congregation.
     
  5. webdog

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    ^what he said
     
  6. thisnumbersdisconnected

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    There is another aspect of church security that we haven't talked about, and that not the crazed killer looking to obey the voices in his/her head. It is the guy who goes into a church during services looking to a) steal something of value so he/she can feed his drug habit, or b) kidnap a child.

    As to "B" I think just about every church is aware of that potential, and has initiated secure nurseries so that, even in small churches and/or towns where every one knows one another, they still make sure each child and each parent/guardian/responsible party are properly matched up, and the child can't leave without the adult being able to adequately identify themselves. That most assuredly, if it has not been done, needs to be done in every church.

    As to the "A", the thief, he/she is the most likely to slip under the radar. Our church (membership of about 1,500) has volunteers who patrol the hallways during services in a casual, non-threatening manner. They aren't armed, but there are off-duty police officers in our church who are, and at least one is available during each of three Sunday morning services. It's not a big campus, so it isn't hard for them to get to wherever they are needed. As the volunteers are radio-equipped, the officers or other help can be summoned quickly.

    I don't think church security is something to approach from a lax attitude. Today is a different world that it was 10 years ago, much less 50 years ago.
     
  7. JohnnyReb

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    I will fear no evil....gun or no gun.

    I'm a big second amendment supporter but I won't be packing a gun to church or worshipping God with armed guards standing around.

    I am truly blessed to have a old country church in a valley in Kentucky where things are more like they used to be. The thought of these terrible things never cross our minds. Not saying it couldn't happen, but we don't loose any sleep over it.

    Although I do realize in bigger churches and more populated areas these things are a legit worry. I remember seeing a church in East St Louis and wondered how those people went to church and felt safe. I am not against guards or whatever means nessisary but as long as I'm able to avoid those things I will.
     
    #7 JohnnyReb, Sep 29, 2013
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  8. evangelist6589

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    One reason why Security guard jobs are hiring like crazy here in Colorado and perhaps everywhere soon enough. We can never have enough security. James Holmes, Adam Lanza, this new Navy Guard shooting have all contributed to the tightening of security.
     
  9. annsni

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    We don't hire - they are part of our congregation. In some cases, they might even be in the pulpit. Just sayin'. ;)
     
  10. preachinjesus

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    We have unarmed security guards that are uniformed and plain clothes on Sunday. Also, we use local police for traffic control so they're present on our campus on Sundays. During the week we have security officers, uniformed, at our facility on a 24 hour rotation.

    Since our state provides for concealed weapons, and we believe that creates more danger than it prevents if a suspicious person acts in the midst of a service (bullets flying everywhere is not ideal), we have posted signs prohibiting concealed carry weapons by civilians on our campus.
     
  11. saturneptune

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    We are the security guards. Plenty of us have guns at church. A 38 twixt the eyes will stop the nonsense.
     
  12. Don

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    Just a comment: we should be careful about how we use the phrase I bolded. It tends to lead people to believe they aren't responsible for their actions or their spiritual well-being. It isn't our fault; we can always blame the demons. Or, as Flip Wilson used to say, "the devil made me do it."
     
  13. preachinjesus

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    This is exactly the dangerous mentality we are trying to avoid. (No personal attack here SN, I've enjoyed out conversations.)

    It is next to impossible for 99.9% of humans to do what is said in the post. However about 85% of concealed carry owners think they can do this.

    The scariest moment for us is if someone charges the platform in a service and a dozen concealed carry owners stand and fire. The casualties that will amount will more than likely be the innocent than the person charging the platform. So we've asked our people to leave the guns at home.
     
  14. Revmitchell

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    People who carry conceal are trained and experienced with guns. Many of them are prior military or police. The idea that bullets will be flying is absurd. What churches need to do is coordinate those who carry and set up an in house security team to have a plan to respond should anything happen.

    Failure to do so can lead to liability issues.
     
  15. JonC

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    No... (to post #1; didn't read the rest).
     
  16. thisnumbersdisconnected

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    Better make sure the shot is "twixt the eye" or that .38 won't do squat to stop someone. That's why I still have my military issue .45 Colt semiautomatic. Refused the Beretta when they tried to pass it off as a military weapon.
     
  17. glazer1972

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    I wouldn't set foot in a church that banned guns. Gun or no gun. If you advertise the fact that your sheep have no armed shepherds then the wolves are all the more likely to come in.
     
  18. evangelist6589

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    I should have better explained myself. What I meant is that the devils did inspire this man to commit this crime, however he alone did it, and the devils did not force it, they just inspired and helped him commit it. Erwin Lutzer says in one of his books on this topic that devils can plant things in peoples minds, and plant even in the mind of christians a desire to kill others, but the Christian has the power to disobey the devils. A Christian may get a series of thoughts on sin, but he must choose to think on more Biblical things as it says in Philippines.
     
  19. JohnnyReb

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    One has to wonder......is armed security or armed members shooting down a intruder a direct disobedience to turning the other cheek????
     
  20. Revmitchell

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    No one does not have to wonder and no it is not.
     

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