Do we have a perfect Bible?

Timothy 1769: "We may not understand everything about how God has preserved his word."

Right. There are no two English Bible versions alike, but all of us here still believe God has preserved His word as He said.


"Regardless, the proper response is a humble submission to God's preserved Bible, not a gleeful groping for the exacto-knife or a lifetime membership in the bible of the month club."

Proper response to WHAT?? Can you *PROVE* that God's preserved Bible is in only one version??

 

Another thing, JohnV-English is spoken today by roughly one billion people. That still leaves 5/6 of the world that DOESN'T speak English. Jesus died for them, too.

 

HomeBound: "Faith in Jesus Christ is enough to get us to Heaven, but if it were not for the Bible, we would not know that."

Agreed. But no book is greater than its AUTHOR.

"Really? Would those discrepancies be with salvaltion? If not, how do you know."

Same as you-Faith in Jesus, and common sense.It doesn't matter how many women came to Jesus'tomb early Sunday morn.(The Gospels disagree on this number!) What matters is that they came, and JESUS HAD ALREADY RISEN! That fact is universal in the Gospels.


"No. My question to you is, was God's word ever perfect?"

It was and is perfect in the sense that it appears exactly as God chooses.


"If yes, why don't we have it today(according to you)? If no, then you make God a liar, because everything that God does is perfect."

Then please tell us why there are no two English bible versions alike. I say it's because God has preserved His word and presented it AS HE CHOSE, not limited by the stupid doctrines of men.What sayest thou? Are all the English BVs before 1611 perfect as God chose them to be, or not? If not, for what reason? Remember, you must apply the same standard to modern versions as you do to older versions, or else use a DOUBLE STANDARD.

"Ask yourself this question, God saved me, but did he give me the tools to defend myself against the devil and this world?"

Of course He did, but we must pick each of them up & equip ourselves with them. The KJVO picks up just the sword & lets the MACHINE GUN sit. The KJVO takes the horse while leaving the tank parked. I choose to pick up both the sword and the MG & to drive the tank while leading the horse, being able to use the tool(s) appropriate for the job, switching as necessary, enabled by JESUS CHRIST. I can't drive the tank across the river, but I can cross it on the horse, depending upon JESUS CHRIST to build a bridge & bring the tank across for me, or His having another tank waiting for me on the far bank. I can't use the MG against evil smoke, but I can burn it up with Christ's FLAMING SWORD. But it all begins with PICKING UP the tools He places at your disposal.

BY WHOSE AUTHORITY should we be KJVO?

 

tim: "We may not understand everything about how God has preserved his word."

Robycop: Right. There are no two English Bible versions alike, but all of us here still believe God has preserved His word as He said.


tim: That's at least a believing response I can respect, not unlike Brother Ed's - believing all English Bibles are the preserved word of God, somehow. What I can't respect is collating all Greek manuscripts and distilling them in a way that appears to assume either God doesn't exist or that He doesn't work in any discernable way to preserve his word. One doesn't honor God by ignoring him or his promises.

tim: Regardless, the proper response is a humble submission to God's preserved Bible, not a gleeful groping for the exacto-knife or a lifetime membership in the bible of the month club."

Robycop: Proper response to WHAT??

tim: A proper response to God's promises and the available evidence. Start by assuming that God has preserved his word in a mighty, fairly obvious way (based on what the bible itself teaches) and see where that leads you. But don't be too critical, or you'll find yourself criticizing God and his work. Keep yourself humble. The goal should be to identify what God has done, not to judge it.

 

Psalm 138:2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.

I believe God holds his word highier than you think.

 

Psalm 138:2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.

I believe God holds his word highier than you think. </font>[/QUOTE]HB, having read your reply and Roby's posts it appears that you are in essence saying that since the KJV is God's Word, you interpret this verse as "for Thou hast magnified the KJV above Thy name" is that really what you mean?

 

That same argument would speak even better of the Latin Vulgate written in the "language of heaven" it endured for over 1000 years.

HankD

 

I find it interesting that people came to Jesus long before the NT had arrived.

Hebrews 11:6, " And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him."

 

Thank you for your kind words, Brother.
There i go suffering again for Jesus
Maybe next winter, Brother Tinytim, the Lord
will call you to the Rio Grande river vally,
Florida, or Hawaii to "suffer for Jesus". </font>[/QUOTE]Funny you should mention this.
Our family was sent to Orlando this past summer by Make-a-wish foundation. (because of my youngest son's illness)
We stayed at place called "Give kids the World"
They provided tickets to all the attractions in Orlando. And pampered us to no end.

Anyway, I have been working on putting together a mission trip for my youth to central Florida and one of the things we will be doing is showing Christ's love to these terminally ill children and their families.
I believe God puts us in the right place at the right time to do something for him in the future.

 

Psalm 138:2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.

"I believe God holds his word highier than you think."

No, that would be higher than the KJVO thinks. The KJVO tries to LIMIT GOD to what he/she believes is the ONLY VERSION He has provided, while being totally unable to prove that doctrine.

And as for Ps. 138:2, just ask anyone proficient in Hebrew if this verse should REALLY read, "along with thy name".

 

Originally posted by timothy 1769:


tim: "That's at least a believing response I can respect, not unlike Brother Ed's - believing all English Bibles are the preserved word of God, somehow. What I can't respect is collating all Greek manuscripts and distilling them in a way that appears to assume either God doesn't exist or that He doesn't work in any discernable way to preserve his word. One doesn't honor God by ignoring him or his promises."

The principle of differences between the various mss is explained by their being written by different writers in different times & places. Apparently, this principle is used by GOD, as He's given us four differing Gospels written by four different writers. To try to limit God to just one Bible version is almost tantamount to limiting Him to just one Gospel.

tim: "Regardless, the proper response is a humble submission to God's preserved Bible, not a gleeful groping for the exacto-knife or a lifetime membership in the bible of the month club."

No, the proper response is realizing that God does NOT work within the framework of man's silly imaginations concerning His word. He preserves/provides His word as HE chooses, not according to some man-made myth such as KJVO.


tim: "A proper response to God's promises and the available evidence. Start by assuming that God has preserved his word in a mighty, fairly obvious way (based on what the bible itself teaches) and see where that leads you. But don't be too critical, or you'll find yourself criticizing God and his work. Keep yourself humble. The goal should be to identify what God has done, not to judge it."

But that's EXACTLY what the KJVO does!!! He/she never stops to consider that he/she may be trying to FIGHT GOD! The KJVO criticizes any other English BV with the simple premise that "it aint the KJV so it's incorrect". What's incorrect is the KJVO myth. You mention available evidence-There's not the slightest evidence for the myth's veracity. That's right-NONE-ZILCH!!

Therefore I ask, "By whose authority are you KJVO and by whose authority do you tell me I should be????????"

 

John 16:13,Proverbs 22:17-21,and 1st Corinthians 2:9-13.

That is all of the scripture I need to reject "bibles"(niv,isv,nasb,etc) from dark-age,popish,Egyptian mss.

The Holy Spirit is the one who bears witness to the things of God....Question answered from Scripture(I know that Scripture will not settle the matter;never does,never will);now answer me this:where in the Bible(KJB)does God say to put Alexandrian Philosophers,Gnostics,Scholarship,and men's opinions over what God said??

 

That is in the Bible right after the verses
where God say the Antiochian line of
documents that
were rewritten in Roman Constaninople are
superior to the Alexandrian
line of documents
none of which was found in Alexandria.

 

Remember, thousands, and thousands, probably over a million of souls were saved for MORE than 1,000 years LONG TIME before 1611 A.V. printed.

English Bible were not translated till around 12 or 13th Century, the first English Bible were translated by I think Wyciffle(excuse me lousy last name spelling).

More than one thousand years many people in Europe countries heard the gospel of Christ while English Bible was not yet exist!!

But, also thousands of Old Testament saints were saved by the faith - Hebrews chapter 11 that is over 2000 years BEFORE 1611 A.V. printed!

KJV does not saved people. Gospel saved people!

I was saved by read different version - New English Version(NEV) in Rev. 20:11-15, even WITHOUT a person witness gospel to me how to become saved. I accepted Christ by bow down and confessed to Christ with sign. I was saved in August 17, 1988. Thanked God, that I saw warning of the lake of fire in NEV, that I do not want go there! That why I asked Christ to saved me.

I strongly against KJVO group, because it caused many churches into split and divided. It is not necesscary to doing it.

Late Dr. Curtis Hutson wrote a booklet on Peter Ruckman, he said it is not necesscary to have split or divisions among Christians because of Ruckman.

However, Dr. Huston seems more likely close to KJVO. Although I respect him very well.

More important to know the gospel of Jesus Christ than just debate on manuscript and different versions is silly and not necesscary.

We simply look up and faith on Jesus Christ only, not KJV.

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 - Amen!

 

I want to add to say one thing about KJV.

When Jesus Christ comes to earth at the second advent.

Will we use KJV only during eternality kingdom?

No. We can worship only Jesus Christ, and we all will have ONE universal language to talk each other forever and ever.

ALL saints will FORGET debate on versions even include KJV too once they get in heaven, also, reigning with Christ on earth after the second advent!

Not necesscary for every Christians demand to use KJV all the times, many Christians in another country across world, cannot read English, they read different languages, so, they read different language Bible in their own language.

That is the point.

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 - Amen!

 

Why would you prefer the Greek, Latin, Spanish or any other language if your native language is English? Don't get me wrong, I do believe that the modern versions contain enough of the Gospel to reach a lost person, BUT for that new convert to grow maturely in the Lord, they need meat.

Since there are no errors in the Bible, this is N/A.

What are you saying, the apostles did not give a perfect message just because it came from a human?

Because everything God does is perfect.

Psalm 12:6 The words of
the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.
7 Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.

Really, name one thing that God has done that wasn't complete and perfect. Also, what part of the Bible is in err?

Okay, I still say that "Everything God does is perfect."

God allowed the spelling errors to be found and fixed. Why? So we could have a perfect Bible.

So what is your final authority?

 

Because everything God does is perfect.
.....
God allowed the spelling errors to be found and fixed. Why? So we could have a perfect Bible.
</font>[/QUOTE]Why did God have errors that needed to be fixed in the first place? You said "everything God does is perfect" - so why didn't he do it perfect from the beginning? Why did he do something that needed its errors to be found and fixed? Why did he not do it perfect in 1605?

More KJV-only double talk.

 

Yes, your correct, but they heard the Gospel message from the word of God.

I did not say salvation started at 1611. I believe that Old Testament saints went to paradise and when Jesus died on the cross, he went to paradise to preach. While there they heard the word of God and then went to Heaven with Jesus. Faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the word of God.

Duh!

Sign? What sign?

I highly doubt the KJB split your church. Probably what happen was people wanted things their way and did not like the preaching from the KJB.

Jesus, Jesus who? How do I find out about this Jesus? Here, here is the Bible, God's word.

Thank God for those that gave the ultimate sacrifice to give me God's word. I suggest you read Foxes book of Martyrs to see how that book(the Bible) is important.