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Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Yeshua1, Jul 5, 2013.
per Romans and Paul, why they really be seen as 'equally wrong" or not?
Both are fornication and both equally sinful. And it doesn't matter what a show of hands says. It's what God's word says.
Hetero sex outside of marriage is fornication.
Homo sex outside of marriage is fornication.
And that same word defines what BIBLICAL marriage is.
Bible goes one step further with homosexuality, calling it "unnatural" in Romans 1.
Another would be abomination. Some try to feel cozy putting them all in the same basket so it wont be so shocking and can be accepted as "Normal".
I agree, as same sex activity is like sex with a animal. I will state this off the bat. Sin leads to death. Homosexual activity is a sin, as is sex outside of marriage with the opposite sex. Without the forgiveness of Jesus Christ, both cases are headed to hell.
Having said that, I look at it like this. Homosexual activity would be disgusting to me saved or unsaved. Unsaved, the act of cheating on my wife with another woman would not seem unnatural. Do I see a difference in cheating on my wife with another woman vs another man? Yes I do. They are both a sin, but just the thought of being with another man is sickening, and takes no presence of the Holy Spirit to make it such.
Since I have not done either in both a saved and unsaved condition, it comes down to the natural order of things.
When God said "Love your neighbor" I don't think He meant like that.
Matter of fact, since we see the marriage institution is to be between one man and one woman in Genesis 2:22-24. The world government is not to be our final authority. We are not to accept homosexual marriage even though the government has passed a law saying it is OK. God says it is not!
I know God did not mean love in the way the world is pushing love today.
What the world is actually pushing is the lust of the flesh, which is not of God.
Intimate relations outside of marriage is sin, whether hetero or homo. But the fact that God declares homosexual relations to be both an abomination and unnatural is proof that God hates that sin even more than a man sleeping with a woman he is not married to.
Very good point Fred. There is no such thing as homosexual relations within the bounds of marriage. One might as well be in bed with their pet cat.
If you cannot marry your pet cat that's discrimination right?
The world would say it is discrimination. I would say it is wisdom.
Well maybe I am prejudice since my second marriage was to a cat. It did not work out. Without going into details, the honeymoon and the claws just did not mix. This was taken on our wedding day.
Awww she was a cutie!
26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. 27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error. Romans 1:26-27
Natural sexual relations. Scripture shows natural sexual relations to be God's original intent. Therefore anything outside of THAT, heterosexual or homosexual, is unnatural.
Man did not naturally sin as God's creation was without sin.
So God created mankind in his own image,
in the image of God he created them;
male and female he created them.
28 God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Genesis 1:27-28
In the same place that He created male and female, He defined what His natural order was: sexual relations between male and female in the confines of God ordained marriage.
EVERYTHING outside of that order is unnatural whether we like it or not.
Is there a difference between 1st degree murder and 2nd?
They BOTH require malicious intent after all do they not?
They BOTH end up in a dead person no?
With first...there's the additional facet of malice aforethought:
They are not equivalent nor "equally" unnatural. They are both equally damning in the sight of God, but anything less than perfection is damning in reference to God's justice. But they are not the same in terms of their depravity or lasciviousness and they are not the same in terms of their departure from or perversion of the natural order.
At minimum, when one commits a homosexual act, they are not only engaging in unlawful sexuality, (i.e outside of the marriage bond) but they are compounding that with the additional dimension of engaging in that act with an unauthorized and unnatural object of sexuality.
To compare heterosexual fornication to homosexuality is akin to comparing heterosexual fornication to heterosexual incest.
Mental gymnastics are required to make them equivalents. Homosexuality exemplifies a deeper depth of perversion and concupiscience than heterosexual fornication does.
No sane person will view shop-lifting a pack of gum from a convenience store as equivalent to the multi-million dollar fraud of Bernie Madoff or the robbing of a bank with a firearm. Both will condemn you to hell in God's eyes, but that is because God's standard is perfection. Threads like this trade on blurring the distinction between God's requirement for perfection for the sake of justification, with the heinousness of a sin in reference to it's destructiveness and level of perversion.
It would be the same as pretending that hiring a hit-man take out your 80-year-old billionaire husband for the life insurance money....is the same as torturing a small child to death merely for the sake of sadistic pleasure. They both end up in a "murder" but They are NOT the same thing.
Now I know what happened to that pet canary that your "special ed" Lone Oak Jr. High valedictorian whose name was "Sammy". Your second wife ate it, and you divorced her/it. :tongue3:
All off your past is slowly unfolding in front of my eyes......and they're burning!!!!!
I would say that sex outside of marriage is fornication. Extra-marital sex is adultery!
Sex between same-gender folks, whether joined in a civil union or civil approved marriage, is the sin of committing an unnatural act, or as Paul said, "It's an abomination to God's intention for mankind!"
And while the LG BT scholars and theologians may argue that, "wickedness" is equated with "abomination" in Proverbs 8:7. "Lying lips" are added to the list in Proverbs 12: 20 and a "proud heart" in Proverbs 16: 5. It seems then that pride and lies to further one's own agenda are every bit as hateful to a holy God as are sexual sins [from this LGBT link: http://glow.cc/isa/abomination.htm]
This article-and I strongly suggest all of you read it-goes on to conclude: None of us is qualified to cast the first stone. We are all equally in need of restoration. Let us not focus on heterosexuality nor homosexuality as anything before God, but let us focus on Him who is the hope of our salvation and bow before Him in humility of spirit for "the Lord is near to the brokenhearted, and saves those who are crushed in spirit." (Ps 34; 18)
Let us then embrace each other in love -- gay and straight together -- and kneel humbly before the Christ who took our place and tasted death for us that we might stand in His place and share eternal life with Him.
I would have to admit, while I do not agree with this liberal-world biblical view-interpretation; it is why there are those who have strayed from the path God intended for them and are now on the "Highway to Hell!" It is a convincing argument to accept those who commit unnatrual acts into the fellowship.
I felt that all of you needed to see what the other side is saying, and why so many are thinking they stand on the same side of God as those of us who argue that same-gender relationships are sinful and will preclude those inidivuals/couples from having and enjoying eternal life - should they not repent and come to Jesus, FORSAKING that way of life!!!
Appears to be a nice attempt to conflate man's human perspective and what we think of certain sins with how God sees them. Again Biblically incorrect.
Unlawful sexual activity is still unlawful no matter who is engaged in it.
No need for you to say it as God has already said it. :laugh:
Is there a natural sin? If there were, wouldn't homosexual sex, which is a sin, have to be considered natural?
ALL SIN is unnatural.
So are we no longer accepting sinners into the fellowship?
Point them to Jesus. But you got to point them with the truth. There are no natural sins.
I think you are being facetious - but from a legal point of view a judge did rule that you can not marry you pet, because the pet can not give consent.
When I was in Germany (c75-78) AF TV interviewed this man who "married" his plant.
Don't remember his name or any other detail.
Threads dealing with human sexuality are not allowed on the BB. Closed.