Does a regenerated man automatically gained justification?

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Bro. Ruben, Mar 16, 2006.

  1. Bro. Ruben

    Bro. Ruben
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    Actually, my question somehow goes like this: “would God regenerate a man who in turn opts to reject justification?” :rolleyes:

    I believe in monergism; I also believe in the distinction between regeneration and justification. While the former being unconditional the latter is, conditional.

    Would an offended God, being Omnipotent, regenerate an offending sinner whom He knows would later reject salvation? Really guys, sorry if it sounds silly to you.

    Second question, what is the role of freewill in justification? When does it come in?

    Thanks for your untiring efforts answering my questions. May God bless you always.

    Bro. Ruben
    Saudi Arabia
     
  2. Calvibaptist

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    Biblically speaking, God only regenerates the elect. Therefore, the regenerated person will respond to the gospel in faith.

    Technically, you are accurate here, if we understand that the condition of justification (faith) is provided by God.

    Since accepting and rejecting is based primarily on God's elective decree, then this is not even a possibility.

    Man's will, prior to regeneration, is not free. It is in bondage to sin. When God regenerates, the Spirit breathes new life into the spiritual dead sinner. At this point, a heart of flesh replaces the heart of stone and the newly regenerated sinner chooses (of his newly free will) to believe in Christ. At that point, he is justified. The separation between regeneration and faith is sequential, but indistinguishable. In other words, we have no idea when the Spirit regenerates (John 3:8). We think we know when someone believes (and is therefore justified), but that is only our best guess based on their profession and their fruit.

    Your welcome, and God bless you as well.
     
  3. genesis12

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    First of all, I'm curious as to how you get away with your questions in a closed society, where folks who profess Christ are beheaded. However, let me just offer that one who rejects salvation by grace thru faith is not saved, and won't be, as long as that is the case.
     
  4. Bro. Ruben

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    Thanks, Calvibaptist. I'm analysing your reply. But surely I will put that in my pocket.
     
  5. OldRegular

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    Calvibaptist

    Good response to the OP. The following is my understanding of Salvation:

    God in His omniscience foreknew that Adam and Eve would choose evil, choose sin and death rather than life and righteous obedience, thereby taking upon themselves the sin nature, becoming slaves to sin, and severing their fellowship with God. Unfortunately through the rebellion of Adam all successive generations of mankind have been heirs to a nature in bondage to sin, alienated from God, subject to the wrath of God. In this fallen state, was rendered incapable of making any contribution to his salvation; this state is known as total depravity.

    Foreseeing the disobedience of Adam and Eve and the fall of mankind, God the Father, before the foundation of the world, foreknew and chose, out of the mass of humanity, a people to be His own [Ephesians 1:4], a doctrine called election. It is certain that if God had not elected some to salvation no one would be saved.

    Salvation, A Multifaceted Gem
    Salvation, the blessing of grace, is that work of the Triune God by which He eternally redeems and reconciles to Himself those chosen in Jesus Christ before the foundation of the world [Ephesians 1:4], freeing them from bondage to sin and His holy wrath. That salvation is purchased by the blood of the Incarnate Son [Romans 5: 9; Hebrews 9: 14; 1 Peter 1: 18; 1 John 1: 7; Revelation 1: 5; Revelation 7: 14], the blood of the everlasting covenant [Matthew 26: 28; Hebrews 13: 20], and is made effective in the life of the elect by the Holy Spirit through union with Jesus Christ. Salvation from beginning to end is entirely by the Sovereign Grace of the Triune God.

    Salvation is a once for all time occurrence in the life of the elect. However, as we see explicitly in Romans 8:28-30, and throughout Scripture, there are a number of events that are associated with salvation. In some of these man takes an active roll but in most of them he is entirely passive. If we consider salvation, this blessing of grace, as a multifaceted gem, we may better appreciate both the gift of salvation and the work of God, in particular God the Holy Spirit, in the salvation of those whom God the Father, before the foundation of the world, has chosen in Jesus Christ, God the Son.

    1. Regeneration
    The initial event in salvation is regeneration, the theological term synonymous with ‘rebirth’ or ‘being born again’. Regeneration is solely the work of God the Holy Spirit whereby those who are spiritually dead in trespass and sin are made spiritual alive and are brought into union with Jesus Christ [Ephesians 2:1-9].

    2. Union with Jesus Christ
    Union with Jesus Christ is an integral part, a condition, of God’s electing grace and this union is solely the work of God the Holy Spirit.

    3. Effectual Calling
    Insofar as man himself is aware, the initial event in salvation is the effectual calling of the Holy Spirit. It is an observable fact that not all who hear the Gospel accept it and come to salvation. The regenerate do, the unregenerate do not.

    4. Conversion
    Conversion is the result of conscious act of a regenerate person in which he responds to the effectual call and turns to God in faith and repentance. Conversion is in reality an acknowledgment that one has experienced regeneration.

    4a. Saving Faith
    Saving faith is an essential aspect of conversion and, though exercised by man, is itself a gift of God [Ephesians 2:8,9] The prophet Habakkuk who writes [2: 4b]: the just shall live by his faith, is echoed by the Apostle Paul in that great faith chapter of the New Testament, Hebrews 11, which clearly demonstrates that faith is, in fact, a way of life.

    4b. Repentance
    Like faith repentance is also an essential aspect of conversion. However, the repentance associated with conversion must be proceeded by faith, that is, a person cannot truly repent of his sins against God until he believes that God is and that he has sinned against God.

    5. Pardon
    A righteous God cannot overlook sin for the wages of sin is death [Romans 6.23]. Man is not a sinner because he sins but man sins because he is a sinner. As such he is subject to the wrath of God [Romans 5:12, Romans 1:18]. All who exercise God given repentance obtain forgiveness through Jesus Christ. Forgiveness or pardon implies deliverance from the penalty of sin.

    6. Justification
    Justification is a judicial act whereby the unjust sinner is declared righteous in the sight of a just and holy God. John Dagg in his Manuel of Theology [page 265] notes that justification is a higher blessing of grace than pardon. Pardon frees from the penalty that follows sin, justification frees us from the guilt of sin. Justification is by faith alone [Romans 5:1] and that faith itself is the gift of God [Ephesians 2:8,9].

    7. Adoption
    God adopts as sons all who believe in Jesus Christ [Galatians 3:26, 1 John 3:1, Romans 8:16,17]. Although we are called the sons of God and joint heirs with Jesus Christ this does not mean that we occupy the same position relative to God the Father as Jesus Christ [John 10:30-33, Colossians 2:9, Philippians 2:5-10]. When God the Son took upon Himself the form of man He laid aside His Glory but not His Deity. Though we are called the sons of God by adoption we will never be divine.

    8. Sanctification
    The Holy Spirit continues to sanctify those whom He has regenerated and finally prepares them fully for the service and enjoyment of life in the presence of God.

    9. Perseverance or Security of the True Believer
    The doctrine of the ‘Perseverance of the Saints’ or the ‘Security of the True Believer’ is one that is cherished by most Baptists. The statement from the 1677 [or 1689] Baptist Confession of Faith [Lumpkin, Baptist Confessions of Faith, page 272] expresses this doctrine in the following excerpt:

    Those whom God hath accepted in the Beloved, effectually called and sanctified by His Spirit, and given the precious faith of His elect unto, can neither totally nor finally fall from the state of grace; but shall certainly persevere therein to the end and be eternally saved, seeing the gifts and calling of God are without repentance, (whence He still begets and nourishish them in Faith, Repentance, Love, Joy, Hope, and all the graces of the Spirit unto immortality).

    10. Assurance of Salvation
    If we do not believe that True Believer’s are kept by the power of God and will persevere to the end it is doubtful that we can ever have any assurance of our salvation. Therefore, every passage of Scripture that demonstrates the security of the believer should provide the believer assurance of that security. The first basis for assurance is the testimony of the Word of God. The second basis for assurance of salvation is subjective. The Apostle John tells us [1 John 5:10]: He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself. That witness is the indwelling Holy Spirit

    11. Glorification
    God will bring to glory those He has saved through the sacrifice of His Son. Glorification is the final facet on the gem of salvation. Redemption is complete, the sin struggle is over. We who are heirs and joint heirs with Jesus Christ [Romans 8:17] will be like Him for we will see Him as He is [1 John 3:2].

    Although Regeneration is the initial event in Salvation the following aspects presented as a Multifaceted Gem are not necessarily in chronological order.
     
  6. humilis

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    Good responses Calvibaptist and OldRegular.

    In Christ Service,

    humilis
     
  7. webdog

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    There is no such thing as "Saving Faith", but there is faith that saves. Big difference. Ephesians 2 is not talking about "Saving Faith", but Salvation.
     
  8. OldRegular

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    There is no such thing as "Saving Faith", but there is faith that saves. Big difference. Ephesians 2 is not talking about "Saving Faith", but Salvation. </font>[/QUOTE]webdog

    We went round and round about this months ago. There is no point in rehashing old disagreements. You may reserve the right to be wrong.

    I use the term Saving Faith simply to distinguish it from the faith that Paul states is one of the gifts of the Holy Spirit in 1 Corinthians 12.
     
  9. EdSutton

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    There is no such thing as "Saving Faith", but there is faith that saves. Big difference. Ephesians 2 is not talking about "Saving Faith", but Salvation. </font>[/QUOTE]Very well said, Webdog! There have been numerous posts that I have read in the short time I have been corresponding on the BB that correctly show that it is not faith that is the gift of God in Eph. 2:8, but that it is the overall subject of salvation- i.e. by grace, you have been saved through faith, and this thing is not of yourself, it is the gift of God. The Greek language will not allow ANY other construction, meaning, or rendering of the verse. It does appear that many so-called, self-styled theologians for many centuries seem to think their understanding of language, and their view of God, somehow trump the language the Scriptures were written in. These, for some reason, seem to include many who seem to be less than enthused when I offer old LOT as the best Scriptural example of one called righteous, for he is so called three times. And they claim that they are basing it all on Scripture. I don't get it!
    In His grace,
    Ed

    P.S. I'm glad to get this post in! Got me off that 666!
     
  10. whatever

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    Do tell - how do we know from the Greek what "it is the gift of God" refers to?
     
  11. Hope of Glory

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    Actually, if you diagram the verses out, it's "grace" that is the gift of God.
     
  12. Calvibaptist

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    Actually, if you know anything about Greek, it cannot be "grace" that is the gift of God.

    Pronouns must agree with the nouns they modify in case, number, and gender. In this verse, both the word "that" and the word "gift" are neuter in gender. "Grace" and "faith" are feminine in gender, and "are saved" is masculine in gender.

    So, "that" and "gift" can not modify, individually, either grace, faith or are saved. Grammatically, it must modify the whole concept - salvation by grace through faith. As such, not only is the whole concept the gift of God, but each individual part is the gift of God. Therefore, salvation is a gift of God; grace is a gift of God; and, yes, faith is a gift of God.
     
  13. Bro. Ruben

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    My beloved brethren, can you please answer my question first according to what you know about regeneration and justification?

    Is it possible that a man be regenerated and then "somewhere along" rejected justification, what is its likelihood?

    Thanks.
     
  14. whatever

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    No, it is not possible.

    You're welcome, but Calvibaptist already answered.
     
  15. Bro. Ruben

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    Any verse please as basis of your reply? I always apply the principle of "Sola Scriptura", so kindly show me a verse.

    Thanks, again.
     
  16. whatever

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    Sure, no problem.

    Rom 8:29-30 - For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.

    You're welcome again.
     
  17. OldRegular

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    Any verse please as basis of your reply? I always apply the principle of "Sola Scriptura", so kindly show me a verse.

    Thanks, again.
    </font>[/QUOTE]Acts 13:48 [NKJV] Now when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and glorified the word of the Lord. And as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed.
     
  18. EdSutton

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    Actually, if you know anything about Greek, it cannot be "grace" that is the gift of God.

    Pronouns must agree with the nouns they modify in case, number, and gender. In this verse, both the word "that" and the word "gift" are neuter in gender. "Grace" and "faith" are feminine in gender, and "are saved" is masculine in gender.

    So, "that" and "gift" can not modify, individually, either grace, faith or are saved. Grammatically, it must modify the whole concept - salvation by grace through faith. As such, not only is the whole concept the gift of God, but each individual part is the gift of God. Therefore, salvation is a gift of God; grace is a gift of God; and, yes, faith is a gift of God.
    </font>[/QUOTE]calvi is essentially correct in this explanation. However, let me tack on one little bit of clarification. I was referring to this verse only, here. Therefore, each part of the modifiers, grace and faith are the gift of God, here because they are modifying the whole concept, as calvi pointed out. But the language here, will not allow the order to be reversed to say that faith is the gift of God, therefore grace is the gift of God, therefore salvation is the gift of God. As we KY country hicks would say, "Hit don't work thataway!"
    In His grace,
    Ed
     
  19. Hope of Glory

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    Justification is a process, of course it can be stopped. Unless you mistakenly think that your salvaiton can be lost, then you can have one without the other.
     
  20. Hope of Glory

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    The nominative neuter singular demonstrative
    pronoun "houtos" is diagrammed in apposition to
    "dOron", also nominative neuter singular. The
    pronoun is proleptic because of emphasis, for it precedes the noun it modifies. I wish I had the ability to post the diagram work that Dr. William Ramey did, but it is copyrighted.
     

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