1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Does God have evil spirits??

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by xdisciplex, Jun 15, 2006.

Top Posters
  1. xdisciplex

    xdisciplex New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2005
    Messages:
    1,766
    Likes Received:
    0
    1Sa 16:14 But the Spirit of the LORD departed from Saul, and an evil spirit from the LORD troubled him. :eek:

    How is this possible!? God is good how can he have evil spirits?
    This sounds as if God is both good and bad but this cannot be.
     
    #1 xdisciplex, Jun 15, 2006
  2. donnA

    donnA Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2000
    Messages:
    23,354
    Likes Received:
    0
    God is not good and bad, He is not bad at all, He is always 100% good. God is not possessed or indwelt by evil spirits, and this verse does not say He is. Either God allowed an evil spirit to 'trouble' Saul, or God specifically sent it, or when the Spirit of the Lord (Hly Spirit) is not present it leaves an opening for evil spirits. Whichever, God is not evil in any way, shape or form.
     
    #2 donnA, Jun 15, 2006
  3. webdog

    webdog Active Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2005
    Messages:
    24,696
    Likes Received:
    2
    Remember when satan had to approach God to persecute Job? I think this is continually happening even today. Satan and demons can only do what God allows. Maybe this verse is stating that after permission from the Lord, the demon (or satan) left God's presence to trouble Saul.
     
    #3 webdog, Jun 15, 2006
  4. Link

    Link New Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2004
    Messages:
    695
    Likes Received:
    0
    Doesn't Chronicles say that the Spirit was from Satan?

    Anyway, God is sovereign over Satan as we see clearly displayed in the book of Job. God is good, but he had an evil spirit trouble Saul, a man who had done evil.
     
    #4 Link, Jun 15, 2006
  5. genesis12

    genesis12 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2005
    Messages:
    799
    Likes Received:
    1
    One of the errors that we make is simply looking at a verse and deciding what it means, without ever thinking of its context and the Hebrew (or Greek in the NT) language "underneath". When one does that, one can pull from scripture monstrous misunderstandings which are filed away in the brain as fact. Bummer. Case in point:

    There are other translations of the word 'evil.' One indicates that the spirit was a spirit of deep personal sadness, of grief. A Christian can grieve the Holy Spirit, and guess what? You know it when you do. I recall those times when a "white lie" seemed appropriate, only to be immediately STUNG by that sin, the "quickening" of the Spirit.

    Careful exegesis demands first of all attention to 1 Corinthians 2:9-14 and similar passages. How many similar passages can you find, xdisciplex? When will you complete that search? If you had studied this passage you would have seen that 'evil' could mean deep sadness, remorse, grief. Read the passage in that context, as follows:


    1Sa 16:14​



    Now, the LORD'S Spirit had left Saul (Saul was out of fellowship, walking in disobedience), and a spirit of grief from the Lord burdened him tremendously. Saul's officials told him, "A spirit of overwhelming grief is tormenting you. Your Majesty, why don't you command us to look for a man who can play the lyre well? When overpowering grief comes to you, he'll strum a tune, and you'll feel better." Saul told his officials, "Please find me a man who can play well and bring him to me."​



    Think about it. Study, to show yourself approved, a servant of our Most High God. :Fish: :thumbs:


    p.s.: As to Chronicles:
    The spirit of the world is the spirit of satan. He is the prince and power of the air, the father of lies. Once the Spirit of God had left, Saul was wide open. He even consulted a medium. Never, never, never resort to that!
     
    #5 genesis12, Jun 16, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 16, 2006
  6. xdisciplex

    xdisciplex New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2005
    Messages:
    1,766
    Likes Received:
    0
    But the greek word which is used in this verse is the very same word which is also used in Genesis 2:9 to describe the knowledge of good and evil. Also when you look at all the other places where this word is used it is very often translated with evil.
    The problem is also not that the spirit was evil, the problem is that it says "an evil spirit from the Lord".
    From suggest that this spirit belonged to God or to His angels.
    When I tell you that I give you some money from my money then you will assume that I take some of my own money and give it to you.
    This is what I don't understand. If God simply allowed Satan to send an evil spirit to harrass Saul then the bible should not say an evil spirit from the Lord. :confused:

    And another problem is that even if this was an evil spirit from Satan this gives me the impression that God also uses Satan and his angels to carry out his will but this doesn't fit together with how I see God. If God uses an evil spirit from Satan to harrass Saul then why does he do this? Why does God not directly use one of his angels to harrass Saul? Could God's angels not harrass a person because they are not evil? :confused:
    Does this mean that God does things which are actually his will but he uses Satan to do them and this way he can blame it on Satan? Because everybody will say that it was an evil spirit who harrassed Saul? But if God was the one who made the evil spirit harrass Saul then isn't this the same as God directly harrassing Saul? :eek:
     
    #6 xdisciplex, Jun 17, 2006
  7. webdog

    webdog Active Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2005
    Messages:
    24,696
    Likes Received:
    2
    Did you even read my response? Being "from" somewhere does not mean "belonged to". If my wife sent me to the store, as I am coming home from the store, I am literally coming "from" the store, I don't "belong to" the store.
     
    #7 webdog, Jun 17, 2006
  8. xdisciplex

    xdisciplex New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2005
    Messages:
    1,766
    Likes Received:
    0
    Okay.Then this problem is solved. But there is still the other problem.
    It looks as if God uses Satan to carry out his plans whenever he wants to do something destructive which wouldn't really fit to his image, as if God was camouflaging his actions by letting Satan carry out his will and the people then assign this deed to Satan while God was the one who let Satan do it or who made Satan do it.
    Is God like this? You see, this is one of the problems which I have. I don't know if God would do something like this or not. I cannot really imagine that God uses Satan to do evil things, I mean this would be sick, wouldn't it? Because this would mean that these things which Satan does are in God's will. :(
    But I also don't know how to explain this stuff in a way which makes look God better.
    Do you think that this angers God when I have such thoughts? :tear:
     
    #8 xdisciplex, Jun 17, 2006
  9. webdog

    webdog Active Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2005
    Messages:
    24,696
    Likes Received:
    2
    No, I don't think God is angry you have these thoughts, this is how some great men of God have come to some conclusions about God's sovereignty (even though I may not agree 100%).

    If God uses satan as His puppet to carry out all evil, then satan has absolutely no power, and all sin is authored by God, which is heresy.
     
    #9 webdog, Jun 17, 2006
  10. xdisciplex

    xdisciplex New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2005
    Messages:
    1,766
    Likes Received:
    0
    Yes, this is what I mean. This cannot be because this would mean that God uses Satan as a scapegoat to do the things which he wants to do but he camouflages them by letting Satan do it. This doesn't fit to God. But the problem is that I cannot really explain these things in a way which make God look good. I think it's Paul who says that some christians have been handed over to the devil, most likely to make them return to God. But what I don't understand is this. Why does Satan do exactly the things which God expects him to do? If God sends Saul an evil spirit from Satan then why doesn't Satan do the exact opposite of what God wants him to do? For example why did the angel of Satan harrass Paul? This is exactly what God wanted, right? Why didn't this angel go against God's will and simply stopped harrassing Paul? Somehow this looks like God uses both good angels and bad angels like chessmen to carry out whatever plan he has. :confused:
    There are christians which claim that Satan is actually a servant of God and he only does what God wants him to do. This goes exactly into this direction. I think that these are the things which make them assume such strange things which are really absurd because this would mean that all the bad things which Satan does are actually ordered by God, this would be totally perverse. But I haven't really found an answer to this problem yet. :(
     
    #10 xdisciplex, Jun 17, 2006
  11. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2002
    Messages:
    32,913
    Likes Received:
    71
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    Well we do know that God calls the wicked nations of Babylon and Syria "his servants" when they are sent to subjugate Israel. I am not sure we have a good way out of Him taking responsibility for what He allows them to do in those cases.
     
    #11 BobRyan, Jun 17, 2006
(You must log in or sign up to post here.)
Loading...