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Dubai Ports World: Commercial Racial Profiling

Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by KenH, Feb 21, 2006.

  1. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
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    What's the official C/P stance on this one ?
     
  2. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    Here are the reasons why I support the sale of the port management duties of P&O to DP World:

    1) It would be a step backward for U.S. security to stop this deal from taking place. It assumes that DP World will not carry out its obligations and basically treats Dubai as an enemy nation in spite of the help that it has been to us since the attacks on 9/11/2001. If we thumb a modern Arab city such as Dubai in the eye, then why should any Arab nation, or any nation for that matter, help the U.S. in the war with al Qaeda if this is how it will be treated.

    2) Pakistan has been home to a lot worse than Dubai yet we consider Pakistan to be a key ally in the war with al Qaeda. If we are going to reject Dubai then we should immediately cut all ties with Pakistan. Yes, some money laundering took place in Dubai. That is not exactly an action unique to an Arab country.

    3) Dubai intelligence officials were a big help in unraveling A.Q. Khan's Pakistani nuclear black market activities.

    4) Dubai is a wonderful example of capitalism in the global marketplace. DP World is a world class company, not some back room, fly by night operation.

    5) Who was the first Middle East country to go along with the U.S. Container Security Initiative? Dubai.

    6) Who agreed to prevent the passage of nuclear materials through its ports? Dubai.

    7) Who has invested in modern technology such as installing radiation detection equipment? Dubai.

    8) Who has directed its banks to improve their internal controls to stop terrorist financing? Dubai.

    9) Companies in Dubai are run transparently with modern accounting. Dubai is a great example for other Muslim Arab nations to follow in being open to new ideas and being involved in the global marketplace.

    10) With Dubai's commitment to new security technology, the U.S. can partner with DP World to develop better ways to scan containers and to track them.

    11) The U.S. is a worldwide champion for capitalism and transparency and anticorruption in business practices. We should not become protectionist when an Arab country legitimately engages in the capitalist system and plays by the rules.

    12) The U.S. is best when we are creative in opening doors to the rest of the world, not when we give in to fear and paranoia.

    13) We should not alienate a modern nation, the very people in the Middle East that we need to encourage to expand their influence in other Arab nations to bring their fellow Muslims into the global marketplace for their good and ours.

    14) The U.S. needs to stop this slide that I am seeing into neo-isolationism. This is the 21st century, not the 1930s. I know that we average Americans tend to tire rather easily when it comes to engaging in international relations over an extended period of time as we have since 9/11/2001, but it would be to our own detriment and peril to begin to think that we can ignore the rest of the world and wall ourselves off - economically or otherwise.
     
  3. The Galatian

    The Galatian New Member

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    It appears that Bush has been hoist by his own petard on this one.

    The ravings about having to surrender our rights to save us from terrorism, and "terrorists under every bed" have had their effect.

    The public guages what the administration was saying about security and Muslims and measures Bush's intention to turn our ports over to Arabs by that guage.

    And they are understandably upset.
     
  4. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    Yes, Galatian, I am afraid we are seeing the result of a lack of independent thinking by many of our fellow citizens on this DP World issue.
     
  5. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
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    What is Dubai's stance on Israel ?
     
  6. StraightAndNarrow

    StraightAndNarrow Active Member

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    I've always thought that our ports were our most vunerable point. We adequately check only about 5% of the containers that arrive on ships. How difficult would it be to slip a suitcase nuke past that kind of security? For the life of me I can't figure out what we're getting for the billions of $ we're spending on "homeland security."

    The charade that goes on in airports isn't really making us much more secure if at all. Instead of dangerous places like New York and Los Angeles, a lot of the money is being spent in places likle Montana (no offense but not exactly a terrorism hot spot). I saw that bullet proof jackets were bought for dogs someplace!! (I might buy one for my dog but don't want my tax dollars going for that.)

    I suppose I'm saying it really looks like Bush doesn't have a clue about what to do in this situation. He invaded Iraq because they "might" have been a threat but the place just turned out to be a sinkhole for American $ and quite possibly the biggest foreign policy disaster since Viet Nam. On the other hand, two of the 9/11 hijackers were from the UAR and much of the funding passed through the UAB.

    So, here we have a situation in which we invaded and occupied Iraq which had nothing to do with 9/11 but are awarding the contract for operating our major ports to a country which was involved.

    I suppose some here would agree with Bush's statement:

    The president said he was struck by the fact that people were not concerned about port security when a British company was running the port operation, but they felt differently about an Arab company at the helm. He said the United Arab Emirates was a valuable partner in the war in terror.

    If Bush doesn't see the difference between entrusting our ports to our strongest ally and entrusting them to an Arab country that was involved in 9/11 he's even more STUPID than I thought he was (and I didn't think that was possible).

    Why is Bush trying to push this deal through so quickly without adequate review? There has to be some kind of payback going on. This is definitely a shady (try jet black) deal.
     
  7. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    No, we are awarding nothing. P&O had the contracts to operate some terminals at some ports in the United States. P&O has sold - legally and transparently - its port terminal operations to DP World.

    It's called capitalism.

    If many of the American people are going to turn their backs on capitalism then I guess they can go back to digging taters and living a subsistence lifestyle.
     
  8. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    CFIUS approved the deal. The president is not a member of CFIUS.
     
  9. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

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    Ken, thanks for your list. I don't agree with it and fail to see how:

    "It would be a step backward for U.S. security to stop this deal from taking place."

    Could you please explain the negative security effect? To me, it seems the opposite.

    You said Dubai is "A wonderful example of capitalism in the global marketplace." So that is a reason we should let them be in charge of our ports?

    How does them "agreeing not to have nuclear materials through its ports" have anything to do with our ports? I'm failing to see the connection.

    How does their "investing in modern technology such as installing radiation detection equipment" have anything to do with our ports unless they are going to bring it with them and put it over here?

    And does "the companies in Dubai are run transparently with modern accounting and being a great example for other Muslim Arab nations to follow in being open to new ideas and being involved in the global marketplace" protect our ports here in the US?

    And, how does the "U.S. being a worldwide champion for capitalism and transparency and anticorruption in business practices" make our ports any safer by allowing a FOREIGN GOVERNMENT to be in charge of them?

    And finally, "if the U.S. is best when we are creative in opening doors to the rest of the world, not when we give in to fear and paranoia," then shouldn't we outsource the Secret Service protection & put it up for bid on the open world marketplace? It would probably save tax dollars since the Secret Service also protects the former presidents and possibly the former vice presidents, too. And probably their families.

    You said... "...but it would be to our own detriment and peril to begin to think that we can ignore the rest of the world and wall ourselves off - economically or otherwise."

    There is no danger of that, Ken. That's one of the reasons we have the biggest trade deficit in the history of this nation, because we HAVEN'T ignored the rest of the world. And that's one reason our American jobs keep getting shipped overseas, because we haven't ignored the rest of the world.

    BTW, no offense, but these sound like Bill O'Reilly's talking points from the Factor the other night. Not accusing you, but it's the same rhetoric. I fail to see where Americans should feel safe by allowing a FOREIGN GOVERNMENT assume control of our ports.

    The bad news is, it is not only 6 ports, but 22 ports involved in this deal. The good news is, the UAE has postponed this. There were also, according to Karl Rove, some "hurdles that had to be overcome with the British" whatever that means.

    I agree with SandN on this one. :eek:
     
  10. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    Good, since I didn't watch O'Reilly talking about this on his TV show. I'm not even sure what his stance is on it as lately I have watched very little of his TV show and listened very little to his radio show.
     
  11. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    Dubai has been an ally in the war with al Qaeda. If we treat an Arab ally this way, then what incentive is there for other Arab nations, or any nation, to be our ally against al Qaeda? If their businesses are going to play by the rules and we tell them, "You're Arab(or You're non-American) and that's not good enough" then there is no incentive for other nations to ally themselves with us.
     
  12. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    It shows that Dubai is assisting us in attempting to stop the flow of nuclear materials. Since DP World has every reason to operate its business in our ports with due diligence, there every reason to expect it to cooperate with such efforts in our ports.
     
  13. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    I fully expect DP World to do so.
     
  14. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    DP World has every reason to maintain its world class reputation. These U.S. terminals are not its, or Dubai's, only business interests in the world. If a company proves to do shoddy work then its future is quite bleak indeed.
     
  15. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    Why should concerns over Secret Service protection be an issue in regards to a business deal? Remember, the Coast Guard, Homeland Security, and Customs will still be in charge of security as they have been while P&O has managed these terminals.
     
  16. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    There is no bad news in that.
     
  17. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

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    Why should concerns over Secret Service protection be an issue in regards to a business deal? Remember, the Coast Guard, Homeland Security, and Customs will still be in charge of security as they have been while P&O has managed these terminals. </font>[/QUOTE]Then how come on the other thread Homeland Security didn't know anything about it? :confused:

    Was it, as has been suggested on cable news, just a "glitch" in the paperwork? God help us if there is this big of a communication gap between the POTUS and WH advisors and Homeland Security! Especially on something looming as large as the management of our port system by a foreign government!!!
     
  18. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    Chertoff said he didn't know about it. Homeland Security has a member on CFIUS but I don't know if it's the secretary. Perhaps an undersecretary or assistant actually does the work on CFIUS on behalf of Homeland Security. If the secretary is the one who is actually supposed to be on CFIUS then I would be disappointed in Chertoff's performance.

    Wouldn't have anything to do with my points about the reasons why the deal with DP World should stand. Nor would that change the fact of who is in charge of port security - Customs, the Coast Guard, and Homeland Security.

    If we block DP World and P&O is getting out of the port terminal management business I guess there would be no company to manage those particular terminals and they would have to be shut down. Or the state governments could take them over and run them; that would be sort of like having FEMA running them, I reckon.
     
  19. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    That's the management of some terminals in some ports, not anywhere near the whole shebang.
     
  20. StraightAndNarrow

    StraightAndNarrow Active Member

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    CFIUS approved the deal. The president is not a member of CFIUS. </font>[/QUOTE]Bush says he will veto any act by Congress to stop it. What's he hiding?
     
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