Election Day

Discussion in 'Politics' started by NaasPreacher (C4K), Dec 15, 2008.

  1. NaasPreacher (C4K)

    NaasPreacher (C4K)
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    Despite the best of efforts of a self deluded Hillary loving crackpot Democratic lawyer the Electoral College will meet in 50 states and the District of Columbia to choose the next president today. .

    Interesting note; For the first time ever a state will willingly and knowingly split its electoral votes when Nebraska Elector William Forsee casts his vote for Barack Obama in a state where the majority statewide voted for John McCain.
     
    #1 NaasPreacher (C4K), Dec 15, 2008
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  2. Bro. Curtis

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    "...we need new people..."
     
  3. Jim1999

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    Does this mean the election which happened a short time back was really a farce in democracy? The actual choice is made by an elite lot!

    Cheers,

    Jim
     
  4. Samuel Owen

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    That's what I have been saying for years, its that way sort of.
     
  5. billwald

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    If not for the electrical <G> college, the US would be run by NYC, Chicago, LA, and Dallas/Fort Worth metro areas. Even with the electoral college, in this last election if the 9 or 10 smallest states had gone 100% Republican then Obama still would have won. Without the EC, California would be the only state west of Dallas/Fort Worth that would matter in any national election. No farm state except Ill. and Cal. would matter.
     
  6. NaasPreacher (C4K)

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    Absolutely not - delegates were democratically chosen by the electorate to vote for a designated candidate for president. It a marvelous part of how a true Republic works.
     
  7. billwald

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    A true republic where both parties are owned by the same people who let us vote for our favorite tax collector every 4 years. For about 2 days after the election I still though Obama might stir the pot. No chance of that! He is recycling 20 years of old main line politicians - people who were bought before half the people on this list were born.
     
  8. Jim1999

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    Do Americans get to vote for the electoral college representative during the general election? Why isn't this count done at the same time? Why bother with the general election if an electoral college is going to make the decision after the fact?

    I don't understand the American system at all. Are you all trying to tell me that the USA is not a democracy, but rather a republic,,,whatever that is?

    Cheers,

    Jim
     
  9. KenH

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    The Founding Fathers were fearful of the people, if given a direct vote for president, electing a wild populist as president, such as a Santa Anna-type or in modern terms a Hugo Chavez-type, who would want to become a dictator and wreak havoc on our constitutional republic.

    A republic, in the case of the United States, is a government in which supreme power resides in a body of citizens entitled to vote and is exercised by elected officers and representatives responsible to them and governing according to law.

    - www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/republic
     
    #9 KenH, Dec 15, 2008
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2008
  10. Jim1999

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    So, the electoral college is a way of controlling an election. Sort of like the communists do.

    Cheers,

    Jim
     
  11. mcdirector

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    Ken, wasn't the electoral college also put in place to give some balance to the very small states in case some states became very large? - like has happened.
     
  12. KenH

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    Yes, the U.S. constitution was a series of compromises on a host of issues in order to gain the necessary support for ratification.
     
    #12 KenH, Dec 15, 2008
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  13. NaasPreacher (C4K)

    NaasPreacher (C4K)
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    Sure Jim thats the way it is for your communist southern neighbours.


    The Electoral College suggest an inherit 'mistrust' of the masses. It was never intended to be a democracy. The rule of law is supreme, hence the American near veneration of the Constitution. The United States was intended to be just that - a federation of united states and the electoral college was a way insuring that the small states had some kind of voice in choosing the president.

    I contend that it is one of the greatest accomplishments of the founders and I hope it is never abolished.

    I would like to see more states follow the lead of Nebraska and Maine when the electoral votes are apportioned among the congressional districts and the 2 extra electoral votes go to the over all popular vote winner in the state.
     
    #13 NaasPreacher (C4K), Dec 15, 2008
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  14. Jim1999

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    Myquote: Sort of like the communists do.
    -----------------------------------------

    Now Roger, I did NOT call Americans communists. Please don't let anymore people label me as a communist and atheist because I am a socialist..........That is grossly unfair, and you should know better.

    I said it was like the communists do.........they have a free election, but select the candidates.the only candidate is often a communist follower. I am trying to understand this electoral college thing and so far all I see is control.

    Cheers,

    Jim
     
  15. mcdirector

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    Here is a site that explains how the electoral college works.

    electoral college on how stuff works

    The candidates decide to run.
    The people narrow the candidates down by voting in primaries.
    The people vote for the final candidates.
    The electoral college then casts the final votes for the candidates that ran.

    In theory the state electoral college votes should go for the candidates that the state elected by popular vote, but there is nothing to ensure this.

    I think this is an accurate synopsis, but if it's not, I have every confidence, I'll be corrected. *winky* added ;)
     
  16. Ed Edwards

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    The seven electors (2 for the two Senators, 5 for the number of Representatives in Congress) for Oklahoma will be voting all for John McCain. The vote was like 68% for McCain and 32% for Obama. So the 1/3 that voted for Obama loose their vote; and the 2/3 that voted for McCain loose their vote for a person who won't be elected. Yep, That is confusing.

    Even more confusing is that State Laws vary, our winner-takes-all law being the most common. Some states divide the votes proportionally (in the OK case it would be 5 for McCain and 2 for Obama. I think at last one state you actually voate for electors and not for the President.

    This was a good way to select Presidents when it took three weeks to travel from the remotest corner of the USofA to the Capital. But today we can figure out who is going to be president (most years) before all the polls are closed.

    Actually, much stranger to me is the 'the government can't pass legislation any more - lets have another election' type arrangement. Probably both work well, some of the time?

    My state (Oklahoma) makes it very difficult to have third parties. There must be about 10% voted for the third party in the last election (or get 10% of the voters on a petition) for it to be represented. I had two choices on my ballot: the electors pledged to McCain or the electors pledged to Obama. Oklahoma law levies heavy penalties for NOT voting for the president pledged unto.
     
  17. canadyjd

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    I don't think it's a fair comparison.

    The electoral college vote has become a formality in the election. As noted earlier, the electors always vote exactly how the voters voted....with this first exception.

    peace to you:praying:
     
  18. JustChristian

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    So you're against the idea of one man - one vote? Voters in small states count for more than voters in large states? Also, the electoral collage makes it much easier to steal elections as we've seen in 2000 and 2004.
     
  19. Salty

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    Actually, there have been many instances where electors did not cast the vote as promised:
    In fact in 2000, one elector refused to cast her vote!
    Click here for website

    JustChrstian said:
    Code:
    So you're against the idea of 
    one man - one vote? Voters in small 
    states count for more than voters in 
    large states? Also, the electoral collage 
    makes it much easier to steal elections 
    as we've seen in 2000 and 2004
    In order to have each mans vote actually count, we NEED the electoral college.

    Theoretically Candidate "A" could win by 1 vote in 11 States or Commonwealths and win the election. link: http://www.fec.gov/pages/elecvote.htm

    Candidate "B" Could win 95% of the vote in the other 39 States or Commonwealths (and more than likely the majority of the USA popular vote - yet loose. Do you consider that one-man - one vote?

    Also, especially if a 3rd party was involved, and no candidate received a majority of electoral votes, then there is a possibility that some electors would change their EC vote. If there were no clear cut winner, than the House would vote (by State or Commonwealth)

    That would be much better than having the entire country voting again.
     
    #19 Salty, Dec 15, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 15, 2008
  20. JustChristian

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    I don't understand your logic. I'm saying the electoral college is antiquated, the product of a bygone era when voters didn't know anything about the national candidate but trusted their local electors who they voted for. I think in today's mass communications world we don't need it anymore and it causes more problems than it resolves.
     

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