Eternal Security

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Robert J Hutton, May 19, 2007.

  1. Robert J Hutton

    Robert J Hutton
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2002
    Messages:
    360
    Likes Received:
    0
    I get the impression that Christians of a Baptist persuasion tend to hold to the view that once a person has been truly saved he cannot be lost. Are there any Baptist groups that believe that such a one can lose his/her salvation in extreme circumstances ?
     
  2. J. Jump

    J. Jump
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2004
    Messages:
    4,108
    Likes Received:
    0
    Yes there are several Baptist groups that believe you can lose and/or forfeit your eternal salvation. I believe the American Baptist, or at least some of them hold this view as well as Free-Will Baptist. Not sure of any other groups.

    It's not a Scriptural position, but why let what Scripture says get the way :laugh:.
     
  3. AAA

    AAA
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2007
    Messages:
    524
    Likes Received:
    0
    I believe in the doctrine of the "SECURITY OF THE BELIEVER".
    I believe that we can NOT LOSE our salvation....Eph. 2:8-9, Titus 3:5, Rom 8, John 10 and etc., however it can be given up by those (everyone not chosen by GOD in election) who will refuse GOD's GRACE, But we have to ask ourselves for the person to give up thier salvation: where they really saved to begin with? Because these people were NOT ever saved. 1st John 2:19

    "The LOST of SALVATION" is a FALSE doctrinal heresy.
    I have heard some "Free Will" baptist believe that they can lose it, and I have even talked to a SBC preacher that believed that he could lose it, but the SBC denomination does not believe that a believer can lose thier salvation....

    May GOD bless you....
     
    #3 AAA, May 19, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: May 19, 2007
  4. Jkdbuck76

    Jkdbuck76
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2007
    Messages:
    2,263
    Likes Received:
    64
    Dr McGee once said that he preached the
    security of the beliver and that he also
    preached the insecurity of the unbeliever.


    Food for thought.
     
  5. Pipedude

    Pipedude
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2005
    Messages:
    1,070
    Likes Received:
    0
    The General Baptists also believe in conditional security (=one can lose salvation).

    To my knowledge, the SBC has no doctrinal standard on the question. I have known Southern Baptists who didn't believe in unconditional security (=one cannot lose salvation), but I'll admit that they are a tiny minority. I've never known such a belief to be held among independent fundamental Baptists.

    I don't mind people believing that you can live in sin and go to heaven; it's when they start trying to practice it that gets my dander up.
     
  6. MNJacob

    MNJacob
    Expand Collapse
    Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2003
    Messages:
    288
    Likes Received:
    2
    Here is the "official" SBC position on Eternal Security, from Article V of the 2000 Baptist Faith and Message, which I do not believe has been changed from the 1963 version:

    "V. God's Purpose of Grace
    Election is the gracious purpose of God, according to which He regenerates, justifies, sanctifies, and glorifies sinners. It is consistent with the free agency of man, and comprehends all the means in connection with the end. It is the glorious display of God's sovereign goodness, and is infinitely wise, holy, and unchangeable. It excludes boasting and promotes humility.
    All true believers endure to the end. Those whom God has accepted in Christ, and sanctified by His Spirit, will never fall away from the state of grace, but shall persevere to the end. Believers may fall into sin through neglect and temptation, whereby they grieve the Spirit, impair their graces and comforts, and bring reproach on the cause of Christ and temporal judgments on themselves; yet they shall be kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation." ​
     
  7. Allan

    Allan
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2006
    Messages:
    6,888
    Likes Received:
    0
    Pretty much, just highlight the whole later part with underline emphasis and large lettering. :thumbs:
    Sounds like a pretty solid statement of Eternal Security. I should know (at least hopefully I should know) I'm an SBC Pastor.
     
    #7 Allan, May 23, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: May 23, 2007
  8. Pipedude

    Pipedude
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2005
    Messages:
    1,070
    Likes Received:
    0
    Yeah, it's been a long time since I was SBC, and I'd even forgotten about the New Hampshire Confession, which never got mentioned unless disputing about inerrancy. I guess I was brainwashed by that element that keeps insisting that Baptists have no creeds.

    There are a lot of people in the SBC pews who don't buy into unconditional security, despite the fact that it's been hammered into them them from Day One. But then, there are a lot of dissenters along every line. Take, f'rinstance, Calvinism.
     
  9. David Lamb

    David Lamb
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2006
    Messages:
    2,982
    Likes Received:
    0
    You will probably know that with baptist churches, it is extremely difficult to generalise. There is no "hierarchy" of organisation among baptist churches, so there is no national or international body that speaks on behalf of them all (in spite of media references to "the baptist church in the UK", and the like). Each local baptist church is autonomus under God, and can choose whether it wants to be affiliated to a national grouping, and if so, which one. I notice that you, like me, are from England, so I can reply in the context of this country, where "SB" is an abbreviation for "Strict Baptist", and "Day One" (see PipeDude's reply) is a Christian publisher, formerly known as the Lord's Day Observance Society:) Probably the majority of local baptist churches here are affiliated to the Baptist Union of Great Britain. While by not means all Baptist Union churches believe that it is possible for a sinner to be converted and then lost, that view is more likely to be found in BU churches. It is not likely to be found in baptist churches affiliated to the Grace Baptist Assembly or the FIEC (Fellowship of Independent Evangelical Churches).
     
    #9 David Lamb, May 23, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: May 23, 2007
  10. Allan

    Allan
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2006
    Messages:
    6,888
    Likes Received:
    0
    Baptists don't have creeds Pipedude, we have confessions.
    These confessions (for the SBC) state what the churches have decided is our main line of beliefs. Not that ALL hold to them for some do not hold to all points but it was voted on as being the majority view and therefore our confession as a Convention.

    Actually that aren't alot of people in the SBC who don't by into the unconditional security, yes there are some but the majority do believe in the Security of the Believer. It is one of the classic trade makes of the SBC.
     
  11. npetreley

    npetreley
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2002
    Messages:
    7,359
    Likes Received:
    0
    If you lost your salvation, wouldn't that mean you had temporary eternal life?

    :laugh:
     
  12. Pipedude

    Pipedude
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2005
    Messages:
    1,070
    Likes Received:
    0
    Oh, then you'd agree with the poster who wrote
    But when you say "Actually that aren't alot of people in the SBC who don't by into the unconditional security," I detect that we aren't using the expression "a lot" in the same way. When you're the biggest show in town, even a tiny minority can be "a lot." I'm well-acquainted with the majority position, but I'm testifying to what common people say when they don't think somebody's gonna thump 'em on the head for heresy. As you know, folks learn pretty readily what they can and cannot say and still fit in. All churches are like that.

    I'm not suggesting that these are your most educated, brightest, or most faithful people. I'm just saying they are there and they aren't hard for a conditional securitist from another communion to find when he's moving out in the midst of them.
     
  13. psalms109:31

    psalms109:31
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2006
    Messages:
    3,600
    Likes Received:
    0
    If anyone believes in Christ and know what He has done for them, if they walk way and never return they never believed in the first place.

    I believe in eternal security of the believer.

    1 John 2:19
    They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us.

    Hebrews 3:12See to it, brothers, that none of you has a sinful, unbelieving heart that turns away from the living God. 13But encourage one another daily, as long as it is called Today, so that none of you may be hardened by sin's deceitfulness. 14We have come to share in Christ if we hold firmly till the end the confidence we had at first.
     
  14. Pipedude

    Pipedude
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2005
    Messages:
    1,070
    Likes Received:
    0
    Eternal life? Does the Bible say that?

    I've never heard that before.

    Whoa! I'm gonna have to get back to you on that. If that's in the Bible, I'm gonna have to do some serious rethinking. Thanks for pointing that out. :saint:
     
  15. Allan

    Allan
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2006
    Messages:
    6,888
    Likes Received:
    0
    As in not alot of people - small minority.

    A small minority is still a small minority in comparison with the whole group from which you making the distiction.

    In being an SBC most of my life I have yet to personally meet one SBC person who believes a person can loose their salvation. They may be out there and I know their are some but I have yet to meet even one personally. Not that I've met most SBC, but I have met a great many lay men and others who of other denominations who know SBC'er and attest, even get on their nerves that we don't hold to conditional security.
     
    #15 Allan, May 23, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: May 23, 2007

Share This Page

Loading...