Eternally begotten Son?

Discussion in 'Free-For-All Archives' started by jcf, Feb 23, 2005.

  1. jcf

    jcf
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    In the Nicene Creed from which we get the eternally begotten Son has no basis from the Scriptures.

    Can someone tell me when the eternally begotten Son was begotten since this is the foundation of the co-eternal God the Son?
     
  2. liafailrock

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    No... Jesus was not eternally begotten. However, He is God and pre-existed with the Father as the WORD. When it came time for God to incarnate, he was born of a woman and became the "only begotten son of God" because only Jesus was conceived by the Holy Spirit. All others have the (male) seed of Adam. However, the Bible says we, too, can become born again thru Christ. This is referred to as adoption when we pass from Adam's doomed race to God's race. However, this is still a true birth pocess. Consequently, Jesus went from being the "only begotten" Son of God to the "firstbegotten" of many brethern later once the Spirit was given.

    Hence, we are sons of God, and we are like his nature just as physically we take on the nature of Adam. A father begets his own kind. If only people realize that "God" is a generaic term like "dog" or "cat". But there is only ONE YHWH (an individual) in 3 distinct personages just as man has three distinct parts. Collectively, we are God (the NT calls it the body of Christ). But there is only one true and powerful, life-giving YHWH from which all others are born in Him.
     
  3. billwald

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    It is NOT a statement about a time line. It describes a relationship.
     
  4. Saveferris

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    To deny that Jesus is eternally begotten of the Father is to deny a basic precept of Christianity. The concept is no more absent in the scriptures than is the Trinity. The scriptures cannot be understood as a systematic theology book. Basic Theology by Charles Ryrie (with whom I disagree but as a popular example) is a systematic theology book. They are not. They are the recorded divinely inspired Word of God in which God reveals Himself to man. It records salvation history from Adam and Eve to Jesus Christ.

    To say that Christ is not eternally begotten of the Father is to give Christ a beginning or origin in time, and to separate Him from the Trinity. Doing so leaves you somewhere outside the Christian religion. Billwald is half right. Eternal describes time, or in this case, an absence of it, and begotten describes a relationship.
     
  5. NateT

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    I think a problem might be with the word "begotten."

    Athanasius argued that we understand begotten in a linear or temporal sense, becasue we are temporal beings. He argues that the son was not begotten temporaly (as the Arians believed) but rather of the nature. That is, it is God's nature to exist as a trinity. There was not a time when there was not Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

    I think that is probably what billwald was referring to.
     
  6. Glory2God

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    Got any bible to back that up???? :D
     
  7. El_Guero

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    JCF

    Sounds like you are fishing ... again.

    The creed was against heresies like those of
    arius & marcion.

    But, Christians use Col 1: 15 - 23 (and other passages) to see that the Eternal Son was physically begotten (John 3: 16) of a Virgin.
     
  8. Glory2God

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    :eek: Eternal sonship is NOT scriptual in spite of "creeds". This in NO WAY attacks the diety of Christ, or the trinity.

    Ps 2:7 ΒΆ I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee. 2Sa 7:14 I will be his father, and he shall be my son.
    1Ch 17:13 I will be his father , and he shall be my son: 1Ch 22:10 He shall build an house for my name; and he shall be my son, and I will be his father; and I will establish the throne of his kingdom over Israel for ever.
    1Ch 28:6 And he said unto me, Solomon thy son, he shall build my house and my courts: for I have chosen him to be my son, and I will be his father. Lu 1:35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God. Heb 10:5 Wherefore when he cometh into the world , he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:

    Jesus was/and still is the Word prior to his Sonship:

    1Jo 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

    John 1:14: And the Word was made flesh , and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.


    I AM NOT AN ARIAN NOR AM I A ONENESS PETACOSTAL. I AM A BIBLE BELIEVER, AND THE BIBLE IS THE FINAL AUTHORITY IN ALL MATTERS OF FAITH AND PRACTICE!!! [​IMG] [​IMG]
     

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