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Discussion in 'Politics' started by Magnetic Poles, Apr 28, 2010.
The trail of racial hatred is exposed. CLICK HERE
The Arizona bill was written by more than one or two people and it was passed by more than one or two people.
Instead of speculating on the motives of those who wrote and passed it why don't you comment on the actual content of the bill itself?
Follow the link to another thread started for that very purpose.
I would be more interested in your thoughts on the actual bill rather than your continual accusations about racism.
I am amazed by the so called "anti-big government" crowd that continually seeks to enlarge the powers of government for their own ends. Hypocrisy at its worst. There is much in the law that won't stand Constitutional scrutiny, but take the section on "reasonable suspicion" of being in the state illegally. What constitutes "reasonable suspicion"? Being brown and working as a day laborer? First, this will lead to profiling, regardless of what you think. Secondly, it places too much power to harass innocent people in the hands of rogue cops.
Like I already suggested.
Go to the thread and cut and paste the actual words in the bill that you object to so that everyone can know what you are talking about.
Also there would be some context to words like "reasonable suspicion".
A true Libertarian would never support this bill.
And a true American would never support allowing those who enter our country illegally to remain here illegally. So what's your point?
The concept of "reasonable suspicion" is established law.
"Reasonable suspicion is a legal standard in United States law that a person has been, is, or is about to be engaged in criminal activity based on specific and articulable facts and inferences. It is the basis for an investigatory or Terry stop by the police and requires less evidence than probable cause, the legal requirement for arrests and warrants. Reasonable suspicion is evaluated using the "reasonable person" or "reasonable officer" standard, in which said person in the same circumstances could reasonably believe a person has been, is, or is about to be engaged in criminal activity; such suspicion is not a mere hunch. Police may also, based solely on reasonable suspicion of a threat to safety, frisk a suspect for weapons, but not for contraband like drugs. A combination of particular facts, even if each is individually innocuous, can form the basis of reasonable suspicion."
I almost took you seriously until I saw that you were getting your information from Mad Cow.
Interesting that Mad Cow calls the Arizona law "racist" but never addresses the federal statute that the law is based on. I guess that's because it was passed by liberals.
OK. So why does my support of this bill disqualify me as a "true libertarian"?
Face it...some folks are for illegal immigration, because it solidifies the power grip of their party.
That includes some BB folk.
My main point in the entire discussion is this law is not going to solve the problem. More progress would be made if Arizona and the Federal government passed laws that would give stiff penalties to employers who hire illegal aliens ... and enforced those laws. It is simple economics, if there are no jobs, there will be no money ... no jobs and no money mean the US will not be an attractive place to enter illegally. Taking legal citizens freedoms is not the way to go.
By the way, what does an illegal alien look like. What would cause a policeman to suspect a person is here illegally?
We are a multicultural society. If you and I walk down the street there is no way to tell if we just stepped off the boat or airplane or if our families have been here 200+ years.
That is in the Arizona bill.
If you had bothered to read it you would know that.
Never Seen An Illegal Up Close....
I don't know what they look like... but, I know what a "bleeding-heart-liberal" sounds like! :laugh:
Well, bless your little heart. You are just too cute when you are upset.
According to the following article her approval numbers have jumped after signing the legislation.
I'm Not Angry, Just Reaching Out In Love...
... I'm not upset, :tear: just grieving for you. Paul tells us in Galatians 5:25-26 - "Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other."
Earlier in the same chapter Paul tells us that, "the acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions , and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God."
My spirit is clear of any anger toward you. The Lord has shown me that you are a religious bigot, filled with hatred, and I am truly praying for you...:wavey:
Finally, Paul tells us that, "the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with its passions and desires. Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.
I know my weaknesses mp - you have obviously tried to point them out to me and the world on this forum, fairness shall now befall you; and this is from the Word of God, not some cleaver provoking words from a brother that is truly hurting deep down within their shallow heart and mind - but, you continue to exhibit many of the negatives noted in this passage(in bold) and, you definitely lack the fruits mentioned (in bold) and I have been directed to pray for those who mock me, hate me, and scorn me!:godisgood:
For this reason I sincerely pray for your soul, and implore others on this board, who you have tried to hurt, to pray with me for your total repentance and change of heart toward those whom you disagree. It's OK to disagree with others, but, you don't "play nice!"
If you don't change the manner in which you treat so many on this board, it will soon be evident that the seeds sowed in your heart were seeds sowed in bad soil.
Matthew 13:3-9 - "Behold, the sower went out to sow; and as he sowed, some seeds fell beside the road, and the birds came and ate them up. Others fell on the rocky places, where they did not have much soil; and immediately they sprang up, because they had no depth of soil. But when the sun had risen, they were scorched; and because they had no root, they withered away. Others fell among the thorns, and the thorns came up and choked them out.... he who has ears, let him hear."
I felt it was time you had a lesson in how to treat others. The BOLD areas are those things I am asking the Lord to deliver you from!
Oh, I believe in "once saved, always saved... but, that only counts in the life of those who's seed fell upon the good soil!
Pastor Paul raying:
Sure there is Crabby... If you spoke clear American, and your friend had a Spanish accent.. it would be "reasonable" to suspect he wasn't from America...
Especially if your friend was brown.... or had nappy hair... or wore a Sombrero.. or wanted to take a nap in the afternoon, while all other good Americans were working hard... Or if they wore a hat that said, "Corona".. or... listened to Spanish rap music.. or wore the wrong kinda jeans....Well, you get the idea.
I wonder how many illegal Canadians will be caught.
Or illegal Swiss?
Swiss? Yep.. I have a friend who is an area minister in our denomination, and he tells the story about how his grandmother came from Switzerland, and never registered.. (over 100 yrs ago)... she was an illegal!!! OH MY.....
But I bet no one knew! Even today, if she was still alive, with her white, creamy skin, I bet the cops in Arizona wouldn't even think twice to ID her!..
Why? She doesn't fit the profile.
This is what I am saying: When people say the word "Illegal immigrant".. they ALWAYS have a pre-conceived notion of a Hispanic.. and most just think.. "Mex-i-cun!
Did you get that? A PRE-conceived... notion...
If it wasn't for the white man illegally taking the native American's land, the white man wouldn't be able today to yell... "It's my land".. ."It's my property"...
Yeah, how many Indians were killed in order for you to have your property.
The american natives were more than willing to hand the land over once the European settlers killed 1/2 their populace off in a war over the land. And the Arizonas are upset because illegal immigrants are taking very low wage jobs from the americans who don't want the jobs and prefer to live off welfare anyway.
This is not why they are "upset". They are upset because people are being kidnapped and dying. The people of Arizona are living in fear. They are tired of it.
I think you are allowing your emotions to take control of you right now. I could be wrong, my wife tells me I'm wrong all the time and go fly a kite, and you might do as well. I know from talking to the local in Miami, it is Haitians number one Arabs number two I would say then Central American. It is always the ones the locals see as causing them the most problems.
Up here where I live the big deal is to check the Russians out, their underworld folks are showing all grounds who isn't to be messed with.
I went out of the country at the first of the year and I wouldn't wanted to be an Arab flying into the US or England, they seemed to be checked and watched very closely.
I know Spain is having their problems as well and other places in Europe.