First resurrection

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Jedi Knight, Apr 6, 2010.

  1. Jedi Knight

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    Ok gang what do you think...is this the spiritual "born again" or physical reference of the first resurrection? Revelation 20:6 Blessed and holy are those who have part in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years.
     
  2. asterisktom

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    I believe that other scripture shows this to be our being already resurrected with Christ, those of us who are Christians:

    Ephesians 1:20
    He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand in the heavenly places

    Ephesians 2:5-6
    [God] made us alive together with Christ...and raised us up with Him

    Colossians 2:12
    ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead

    Colossians 3:1
    If ye, then, be risen with Christ , seek those things that are above
     
  3. kyredneck

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    Hello Jedi,

    I believe those that have been born from above have also been raised with Christ, as Tom has pointed out.


    ....whosoever liveth and believeth on me shall never die. Believest thou this?
     
  4. Jedi Knight

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    Thanks brethren,I thought of John 5 where Jesus said "an hour is coming and NOW is when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and live."
     
  5. Grasshopper

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  6. thomas15

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    I'm right in the middle of a self-styled study on covanent/dispensational comparisons. I tend to lean dispensational and as you may know the resurrection referred to in Rev 20:6 by dispensationalist is generally considered the resurrection of the tribulation saints. Covanent theologians consider this is a silly notion but to me there is some merit to it as a literal reading and taken in context.

    I'm trying to wrap my brain around the covanent position. My take on that is since they teach that believers are spititually resurrected with Christ at the time of salvation and there is no literal millennium, then the Rev 20 resurrection is the physical and general resurrection of believers and non-believers for final judgement. I think then, if I'm correct here, then the spiritual resurrection of believers at salvation is an on-going process that started with the resurrection of Jesus and will continue until the end of the age. Each believer is resurrected one time, but as time marches on, new believers are added to the church and as each member is added, they are resurrected.

    At this time I haven't sorted out all of the details nor have I examined verse 6 in detail so i cannot defend or argue against the covanent position. There are a few problems that come to mind though, for example the words "have a part..." is kind of a weak choice of words for an important event that profoundly effects every believer in every age. Another issue has to do with the temporary physical resurrection of saints that happened when Jesus died on the cross and the other resurrections in the NT, such as when Jesus and Paul brought people back to life. I haven't considered if those resurrections shed any light on the question at hand.

    So, to the OP, you ask a good question, one that I'm struggling with right now.
     
  7. asterisktom

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    Just a short comment before work: I can't speak for everyone else here but I do not like or use the term "Covenant Theology" to describe my position. That position has IMO serious baggage of its own. "Doctrines of grace" seems more accurate.

    Take care.
     
  8. Edward 1689er

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    I think that the text is clear that this is a physical resurrection.
     
  9. swaimj

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    Tom, are you saying that the spiritual resurrection that Christians have already experienced is the only resurrection that will ever occur? Are you saying that there is no future physical resurrection?
     
  10. asterisktom

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    I have to grade papers today and do report cards today. The following page contains the response that I am most comfortable with. I am referring not to the main writer but a responder named Sam.

    Here is the page:
    http://preterism.ning.com/forum/topics/the-nature-of-the-resurrection?commentId=1632544%3AComment%3A71894

    The response is the one that starts like this:

    Reply by sam on February 27, 2010 at 2:06am

    I wrote this on another article:

    In I Corinthians 15, it is maintained that the "it" that is raised is the same "it" that was sown. If you define the "it" as the physical body, then you get Augustine, which is the traditional view.
    ...

    ------end of quote-----------

    When I get done with grading I would like to add my own thought as well.
     
  11. asterisktom

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  12. Allan

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    I'm not Tom however, if one holds to a full or mostly full preterist position then they hold unwaiverly to no literal resurrection - like the saddusees did/do.

    The literal resurrection is spiritualized and thus a believer, being alive, is even now resurrected with/in Christ.
    From Theopedia:
    Though such a view places much of scripture in contradiction, especially passages such as Mary with Jesus when He came to resurrect Lazarus:
    Note first that Jesus didn't disagree with her nor did he correct her on her misunderstanding of what will be. He did however help her understand what He was about to do, even though she didn't yet grasp it all.
    Jesus is speaking of two specific and distinct things. The first is physcial (the literal resurrection of believers - and unbelievers, as there will be a resurrection to life and one to damnation).

    The second is speaking of a spiritual aspect in that those who believe will not ever die (spiritually) even though the body lies dead in the ground for a time.
     
    #12 Allan, Apr 12, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 12, 2010
  13. asterisktom

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    Overall I agreed with the Theopedia article, except for some of the inferences. Speaking of which, I noticed also the guilt-by-association dig (as if I was like the Sadducees, those who Jesus said "erred greatly" concerning the Word of God). Oh well, I guess I had it coming for all those times 10-15 years ago I would castigate preterists as heretical. I just didn't know, and wrote unadvisedly.
     
  14. Allan

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    It wasn't a dig, I was showing an associaiton of the two views since the sadducees also did not believe in a literal resurrection and is what they are most know for, but not that the two views were or are supposed to be identical.
     
    #14 Allan, Apr 12, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 12, 2010
  15. asterisktom

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    OK, thanks.
     
  16. swaimj

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    Tom. How do you interpret Paul's teaching about the resurrection in I Cor 15? The concern there among the Corinthians is about Christians who have already died. If there is no physical resurrection, what is the hope for Christians who die?
     
  17. asterisktom

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    My foundational hope is to be with Christ forever. I am assured that that will happen. As Paul said (2 Corinthians 5:8):

    "We are confident, yes, well pleased rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord."

    Christ in us is "the hope of glory".
     
  18. swaimj

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    I think that's a cryptic reply at best and it doesn't address the issues I raised concerning I Corinthians 15.
     
  19. AnotherBaptist

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    Unless one believes that those in the context who take part in that first resurrection were somehow Spiritually "beheaded" before they were "spiritually" resurrected, then I would say it is a physical resurrection. We die spiritually when we are born physically, not when our heads get lopped off.
     
  20. asterisktom

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    It is perhaps cryptic because you are not used to thinking along these lines. What is your real hope, the blessed hope? Is it (as some have told me) the rapture? Is it even the resurrection? These all would be transient things. Christ is our blessed hope.

    I held off on commenting on 1 Cor. 15 because of two reasons:
    1. I am still sorting things out.
    2. That passage requires more comments and study than I have time for now.
     

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