Free-Masonry and the Founding Fathers...

I am surprised that states ever had such clauses requiring that all representatives be protestant. Obviously, this was only the states and not the federal government. Further investigation needs to show when these laws were done away with, and why. This reminds me of the law in Great Britain that was used against Baptists. And if we support reintroduction of such clauses into our state laws it will happen again. Maybe I should point out that there are many more Catholics in this country than there are Baptists. More Methodists and many other religions, too. If we support the establishment of religion it will one day explode in our faces.

We don't really know what Washington believed. He never made it public and that alone speaks volumes. Jefferson and others were much more articulate. It would be very difficult to characterize any of them as "Christians."

I remain totally opposed to any religious tests in our government. I believe that any vestiges of religion in government should be removed, i.e. the pledge of allegiance, etc., the doors from the Supreme Court building if need be. This is for OUR protection. If there is any test, then most of us will fail. Even if it could be proved that the founding fathers were in favor of establishing a "Christian nation" I would still remain opposed to it. And furthermore this is the only consistent position for a baptist to take.

 

Separation of church and state are on most anybody's list of "Baptist distinctives." That is hardly speaking for the entire group.

 

Amity with all due respect, you have shown yourself quite un-informed in many aspects with the founding of this nation and with the Founding Fathers, not to mention those from that era; -or- you are simply choosing to distort matters.



You began by proclaiming that Christian, you stated “Judeo-Christian” principles had no part in the founding of America. When in fact such is undeniable; as Supreme Courts, Supreme Court Justices, Presidents, Founders, Congressional Representatives, historians and indeed the Federal Government itself and throughout our history, recognizes such.
A few of these things have been pointed out in this thread alone or you can go here for a broad historical overview which you may find interesting. http://www.christianlifeandliberty.net/NoKingbutKingJesus.doc
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Your position however has gone from denying that Christian principles played a role but that all such influences on Government should be removed. A view which in fact is contrary to God’s word.

Amity such as this and many other things should have been common knowledge. It only goes to show how much revisionism has taken place and how far from historical truth we’ve come.

Yes, such was not in the Constitution itself but the federal Government was the union of the States ( "united States") that comprised the Federal Government. With the Founders being Representatives from each! Who do you suppose helped draft some of those State Constitutions?


In regards to the Federal Government though, the First Congress wrote swearing in language in upholding the Constitution "So help me God", in addition to the many other things pointed out. But as fact, our Nation was not established with the Constitution, which was our second attempt. It was established with the Declaration of Independence, which most assuredly recognizes God. As great as the Constitution is, the Declaration of Independence should be more.

Supporting Representatives who are Christian, or having our Government recognize God or His Word, or having our Government support Churches/faith based groups, as they once did and still do; is not establishing religion or forcing anyone to believe any certain way.

Jesus taught us to pray as such

It simply baffles me there are Christians who seem to fear such.

As it stands, our Government works hand in hand with Churches and Faith based groups in feeding, housing, and caring for those in need, in paying military chaplains and in allowing Bibles to be given out by Churches or organizations to school children, such as the Gideon’s do. All of which is historical. In fact, the first Congress and Founders procured and distributed the Holy Bible themselves in bringing the good news to others.

There is no such thing or true Separation of Church/State in America and there never has been! That mentality has however, lead to the introduction of laws allowing abortions and will lead to the introduction of other laws in regards to gay marriage, polygamy, infanticide etc. etc. All of which is contrary to Gods word.

Then you will have a real problem with Scripture. In addition, I would consider God's word as found in the Bible the authority, when a Church stance seems errand.

amen.

This could not be further from the truth. You are mistaken or are so biased with your own faith that you cannot accept others, which would include an entire nation and not just the Founders, as being saved!
"virtually every one of the 55 writers and signers of the...Constitution...were members of Christian denominations: 29 were Anglicans, 16 to 18 were Calvinists, 2 were Methodists, 2 were Lutherans, … [and] 1 lapsed Quaker and sometimes Anglican.][p. 180]
Note: There were also two who were Roman Catholic, and one was an open Deist – Dr. Benjamin Franklin who attended every kind of Christian worship, called for public prayer, and contributed to
all denominations".


There is debate as whether Washington had a water Baptism and questions as to why he later seemingly left early on communion days. Though his family attests to his taking communion and he attended Church faithfully. What he spoke in private to the Lord is simply known to them but he gave plenty of public/private accounts which are known and give great insight to his faithfulness, as others.

Take care:jesus: