Fundamental Weaknesses

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Rippon, May 5, 2006.

  1. Rippon

    Rippon
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    I was debating ( with myself!) about where to place this subject . I don't consider myself a Fundamentalist so I couldn't place it in the Fundamental Baptist Forum . Perhaps I could have put it in the Pastoral Ministries category . At any rate it has lodged itself here .

    This is directed toward the Fundamentalists/Conservative Evangelicals of a non-Calvinistic stripe . Those of you that are pastors would be the most knowledgeable about this , but some non-Pastors would be able to give some good imput as well .

    What do you think are some basic areas of weakness in the pulpit generally ? Obviously those of you that minister the Word may believe that your preaching is balanced . But try to critique the movement generally , while noting some blessed examples of biblically grounded ministries .

    Do you think it is generally weak exegetically ? Are most of the sermons geared too much to an evangelistic thrust ? Are the believers in your midst getting a good supply of the meat of the Word ? In other words , are believers getting edified ? Do you think that the whole range of Scripture is being steadily gone over , or do you concentrate on a fraction of the biblical canon ? These and other questions can be addressed . I am not a pastor , so I do not speak with any authority . And I am not wishing to go into the C vs. A thingy . I realize that some Fundamentalists are Calvinists . I just want to get your imput .
     
  2. Rippon

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    Well , it is settled then ,there are no weaknesses in the Fundamental pulpit .

    Seriously , it has been more than 5 hours since I posted the above . But it is early morning where most of you are located . So I'll be keeping my eyes peeled for any responses .
     
  3. MRCoon

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    Well, here in Japan it is almost 5 pm on Sat...so after a hardy supper and I'm off to the night shift...so I'll be keeping an eye on this thread as well. Though I would like to add my two yen worth (a little less than 2 pennies :D )

    First, I'm not in full-time service yet, though I'm study and preparing and waiting on my Marine Corps contract to end soon. I am a Youth Director, Ordained and Lincensed to preach by my Church and currently preach about once a month usually Sunday or Wednesday Evenings. I'm not a master of any skills and preach both topically as well as expositorily (is that a word? :confused: ) I've been saved since the age of 10 and serving with God's grace and a right heart since 2000. So I share my opinion based on this background. DISCLAIMER: These are my opinions and my beliefs and how I practice my convictions and preferences and how I preach from my Church's pulpit. They are not meant to be an attack against anyone in particular but if the shoe fits....you know the rest ;)

    I believe too much is sugarcoated from the pulpit. Instead of having true freedom it seems that many Preachers preach like they are running for office and trying to keep all the constituents happy to re-elect them. I would like to see more sermons on sin and repentance preached! It seems like a lot of God's love is preched (and it is a great subject!) but we also need to see God's anger just as he directed it at the people of the OT, and says he will at those in the end times of revelations and of course at everyone in between. God is a God of Love but He also is one who Loves the Sinner but hates the sin! It seems to be that many folks see God as this sweet old nice grandfather that loves us and though he may seem angry he is just a big old teddy bear. Not True! And people need to know it. Notice I didn't say anything about Bible versions, music, or anything else that seems to get some Churches/Pastors fired up from the pulpit?! These are important teaching items not profound preaching subjects...if we teach the word and practice what we preach then the other external things will fall into place by the power/conviction of the Holy Spirit.

    I'm ashamed that more talk is about the justice or injustice of the war in Iraq but it seems there is less talking about the Spiritual Warfare and it has a far worse conclusion than just being maimed or physically dead...it's results are an eternal punishment and seperation from God!! We need Pastors that will preach the sermons of Evangelists...know what I mean? The Evangelist comes to town for a meeting or a few meetings while Prasie the Lord souls are saved and lives are changed yet when the Evangelist leaves that seems to be the end of any repentance like preaching. Too many Pastors save the 'hard' or 'uncomfortable' sermons for the Evangelist to preach...Pastor's need to PREACH THE WHOLE TRUTH...in season and out of season...what does that mean? I believe it means we need to be teaching/preaching things of a timely nature (take real life events and relate them to God's Word) but also we need to preach things that may be unpopular to say. But it seems that due to some 'political correctness' or attempt to 'sensitivity' we fail to preach like this often enough from our puplits. I don't mean we need to be vulgar, full of hate, uncouth or meanspirited but we need to step on toes and swing our sword (by the way it is the only offensive weapon from God, Eph 6) in such a way that we are effective and a threat to the devil. Too often it seems like Preachers preach the Word is such a way that they never really scare the Devil because the 'sword' is never completely bandished. In my life I find that my greatest struggles are when I'm out of balance...whether too much Church and not enough family or too much playing and not enough working...it is the same in the pulpit! Though I like we got too much of 'Lovey-dovey' preaching and not enough of 'sin-hating' preaching!! Sic'em! Sometimes we need to jsut let our Pastor lose after sin and the devil and if his use of the 'sword' hits a Church Member, fmaily member, Deacon or whomever we need to be there to help heal them and comfort them and bring them back into the ranks...and we all just need to be a keepin' keeping on!!

    WHoooWeeee....I'll take a breath and finish later or let y'all chew on these thoughts and write more later.

    I'm a passionate preacher but that is because I ran from God so long and wasted so many years in sin and rebellion and like Paul I have a desire to warn and protect as many as possible. The Lord is Good and Greatly to be Praised!!

    [ May 06, 2006, 05:41 AM: Message edited by: MRCoon ]
     
  4. Rippon

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    MrCoon , I agree with you 99% . That was an excellent post . Thanks for your input . I hope others will share .
     
  5. MRCoon

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    Uh...only 99%...what is the 1% difference (if I may ask)?? And where are the other posters? This is an important subject but this threads inactivity may be an identifier of the problem. [​IMG]
     
  6. Rippon

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    Well MRCoon , did you know that my 99% agreement was a pretty good ratio ! If someone said they were in harmony with only 75% of something of mine I would think positively about that ! But you are in the rarified air that is 24% beyond that !

    Nevertheless , I objected to " God loves the sinner , but hates the sin . " For instance , Psalm 5:5,6 says : The arrogant cannot stand in your presence ; you hate all who do wrong . You destroy those who tell lies ; bloodthirsty and deceitful men the Lord abhors .

    I don't find the distinction there between the sin and the sinner . God hates the sin and the sinner . Robert S. of Crystal Cathedral fame milks this common mantra (of God loving the sinner , and yet hating the sin) a great deal .
     
  7. Charles Meadows

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    Do you think it is generally weak exegetically ?

    I'll put in a few cents worth.

    I think that the "fundamental doctrines" (divinity of Christ, bodily resurrection etc)speak for themselves. But I find "fundamentalists" of the noncalvinist variety to be very hesitant to explore things theology.

    As an example take eternal security. I think that a thorough reading of the scriptures leads one to conclude that one who is truly saved WILL be preserved by the Spirit.

    But it seems that many fundamentalists are so concerned to to question the sacred cow of "OSAS" that they refuse to explore potential meanings of various passages. Consider the argument regarding "cast into outer darkness". Zane Hodges and others see this as true believers who are being chastized. Also consider the case of someone who professes Christ but never ever has any sort of chnage in his/her life after "conversion". That person likely never had a truly saving experience. But yet many preachers are so afraid of "questioning OSAS" that they will say that this individual is still saved but just will get no rewards in heaven.

    Other topics include young earth versus old earth. Many "apologists" are so concerned at "refuting" evolution that they will espouse ridiculous positions just so long as these theories are "anti-evolution".

    In a nutshell it seems that many are more concerned with defending sacred cows than with finding the truth of what scripture really says, which in some cases is not exactly what we may have thought. As I said I think the fundamental tenets of Christianity speak for themselves. We should not be afraid that we might hurt our faith by being intellectually honest.

    In terms of witness...

    Many young people have questions about things. They hear professors at scholl who tell them that the Bible is all wrong. They have questions and need honest answers. If their parents or preachers tell them not to ask questions or tell them to read a book by someone like Dave Hunt the child's faith will likely be hurt all the more! In my early years I was troubled by the fact that evolution seemed pretty well supported by science. I was hoping that Christians had some real answers to this. When I was told to read books by Josh McDowell, Dave Hunt, and others my worst fears were seemingly realized - maybe Christians reall ARE dupes. Are these laughable theories really all that we have? Thankfully I learned that it was OK to ask questions and think deeply about things - even if it meant questioning some of our man-made traditions. As I said I think the central points of doctrine stand by themselves and don't need to be protected from inquiry. Today I have no such problems.

    My 2 cents worth!!
     
  8. MRCoon

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    Yeah, I would have to agree that our pulpits seem to lack depth but that is a shared blame of an audience that seems to only be able to sit still for 30-35 minutes. Now a good preacher can preach for 45+ mins and no one would notice...we need more of this not in an entertaining way but in a deep knowledgable way. We also need Christians that will do their own personal studying and not rely on being fed by their Pastor only. Pastors often get stuck with feeding 'milk' to everyone because there are not enough in the audience that can eat 'meat'...sad :(
     
  9. gb93433

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    I have met many preachers who also lead their listeners to believe that they do not "sugar-coat" their sermons. The problem is often that they will not deal with the tough passages simply because they do not study the tough passages. Simply put they are misleading their listeners by leading them to believe they are not sugar coaters but are simply giving nothing more than fluff with a lot of commmentary.

    A lot of folks go to church to be cheerleaders of the preachers who they perceive as telling the truth when the person who is up there is giving nothing more than a charade and giving out lemon flavored candy. Who wants to listen to an hour of commentary when the commentator should be giving out exposition of God's word?
     
  10. gb93433

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    You are absolutely right.

    When the preacher burns with passion, people will listen and be encouraged or the disobedient will get mad and leave or repent and get right with God.
     
  11. Mexdeaf

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    You are absolutely right.

    When the preacher burns with passion, people will listen and be encouraged or the disobedient will get mad and leave or repent and get right with God.
    </font>[/QUOTE]Two things...

    1) One man's 'milk' is another man's 'meat'.

    2) And passion in the pulpit by itself will not always produce obedient believers. Many times it will produce extremists who have them form of godliness, but deny the power thereof. Witness Hyles' '100%ers', et al.
     

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